It's a good job that nobody said that then.
Kirk drift—misremembering a character…
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It's a good job that nobody said that then.
Well, yes. A dramatization of Kirk's logs, as Gene intended
Not to change the subject, but that's a literary device that has been used before. Particularly, C.S. Forester, who is most famous as the author of the Hornblower naval fiction stories, which we know Rodenberry read as he compared Kirk to Hornblower. Forester also wrote The Ship in 1943, and reprinted dozens of times, set aboard a British cruiser during WW II. The chapter titles are all phrases from the captain's reports and a different member of the crew becomes the central character for that chapter.
Exactly. These are fictional characters. Their roles change from story to story. I mean, hell, in "This Side of Paradise" Kirk is a paragon of duty and virtue, and in "The Conscience of the King" he's morally ambiguous, teenager-seducing, and so revenge-obsessed he lets it interfere with his duties.
In any event, I did not accuse Pike of "exploiting" anyone or of being a fraud. I noted that "The Cage" is a patriarchal text which endorses the moral superiority of male-dominant power structures and which revels in cishet male power fantasies vis-a-vis its depiction of Pike's relationships to all of the female characters.
Sci has been saying it all along only he uses more words.
I rest my case. It’s all about “white male bad” and society of the past was shit.
Speaking of character drift, recent events in SNW should once and for all put an end to any claims that the events of SNW are in the same continuity as TOS because they absolutely are not. There is no way in Hell to get the characters from where they are now in SNW to where we see them in TOS. None.
Well, okay. I suppose some highly advanced race could radically alter everyone's memories and personalities, but that's what it would take.
Well, okay. I suppose some highly advanced race could radically alter everyone's memories and personalities, but that's what it would take.
Of course any show or movie we're watching, we're going to be seeing the events through the point of view of the main character. Given that Pike is a straight cis male, we see things from that point of view. You seem to feel that that is a bad thing. I can certainly think of stories that we see through the point of view of their female main characters. Is that also a bad thing?
In other words, you seem to be saying The Cage is told from the point of view of straight cis males! And my reaction is...ok. So?
So are you saying that Lenore wasn't an adult at 19? Is it because she was 19 or because she was a woman? I ask because I was married when I was 19, and it seemed like I was considered adult by everyone... was that because I was a man and not a woman?
Also, Kirk had no ability to seduce anyone in that episode. Kirk and Riley were the final names on Lenore’s serial killer to-do list before Kirk had met her. She wasn't under Kirk's spell, she was looking for any opportunity to kill Kirk and Riley... and made attempts on both of them.
Lenore’s feelings for Kirk never went beyond wanting him dead... which is what got her father killed (during her second attempt on Kirk's life).
Why is it that (in your mind) even a serial killer must not have had any agency in this story because she was a woman? She had to be the target of the seduction (and not the seducer) because she was a woman.
And was Kirk revenge-obsessed? What seemed to be driving him more in the episode was guilt for not taking Leighton seriously before he was killed. Delivering Anton Karidian to authorities if he was Governor Kodos is hardly an act of vengeance (killing him, like Riley wanted, could easily qualify).
You have a narrative you want to push, and you'll see serial killers as victims to try to make your point. But you also sound sexist, which seems counter productive to your arguments.
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