Spoilers KEL: The Unsettling Stars by Alan Dean Foster Review Thread

[historypeats]

Can you tell from reading it that it’s the JJ version of the characters than the Prime ones? Can you imagine the story with the TOS crew?

I feel it reads like the Pine/Quinto/Saldana/etc. portrayals. Part of that comes from the oft-stated fear of losing their new positions, but it's mostly that the personalities are different. Quinto's Spock has an entirely different attitude towards Kirk than Nimoy's did. I'm probably characterizing this poorly, but the dialogue is also heavy on "banter" vs. substantial conversation - something I tire of quickly but that reflects the nudge-nudge elbow-elbow rhythm of the films.

 

[Thrawn]

Didn’t they start their 5 year mission after Into Darkness?

Oh sure, I just meant stand-alone TOS adventures that don’t add anything substantive to the novel-verse continuity aren’t usually my bag. Is the story in this, or are the characterizations in this, unique enough to balance that out? From the discussion so far, I’m not sure.

 

[JWolf]

A note on the abbreviation: I was originally planning to use either KT or KT-TOS for this one, however, after some research, I ended up going with ALT for consistency. If anyone feels strongly that it should be changed to something else, feel free to let me know!

It should be Kelvin as The official name is The Kelvin Timeline. ALT can mean anything.

 

[thribs]

I would go With JJV.

 

[JD]

The official name is Kelvin Timeline, so I'd just go with KT, ALT is just to generic, it could refer to any alternate universe. Since the Kelvin books are set in a specific universe, and will be getting at least one more book, and probably more after that, I think it would be best to give them their own specific abbreviation for the review threads.

They were supposed to come out in 2009. Surprised they didn’t change “new” to “defunct”.

I don't think the movies are officially "defunct", I believe Noah Hawley is still working the fourth movie. Anybody have Twitter and want to ask him?

 

[Saul]

Also I just noticed the cover says "based on the thrilling new Star Trek movies!"

...new?

So far....
If you said old I might be thinking 1-10.

 

[Christopher]

Since the abbreviations are traditionally three letters, I'd suggest KLV.

 

[fireproof78]

It’s all very confusing. There is no way Kirk will be a Lieutenant after only 3 years.

That's what's on screen.

 

[DEWLine]

That "KLV" suggestion works. Seconded.

 

[Christopher]

Saavik was a lieutenant while still in the Academy (though it's possible she'd graduated and returned for command school). "Obsession" implied that Kirk was a lieutenant when he graduated and was assigned to the Farragut, though it's possible he served on it long enough to get promoted.

 

[Malaika]

I'd use kelvin timeline as abbreviation

And about time they released these novels!

This is an interesting question. A reader posted on the Doctor Who fan forum that he felt that the book could read as a regular, early-days TOS novel, with the Spock/Uhura relationship as being the only aspect that made it a Kelvin-timeline story. I skim-read some of the dialogue from the first chapter, and I could at times hear both actors for each character, but I sometimes had to make more effort to remind myself of the voice of a Kelvin-timeline actor, while TOS actors' voices intrude more readily because of long familiarity.

I hadn't read the full thing yet but so far, the mystery around the new alien race they are asked to help is capturing my interest enough. However, I too got the feeling I'm reading the usual tos five years mission adventure with the Spock/Uhura interactions being the only new thing truly reminding us that this in the kelvin timeline and the characters have different experiences (unless you are one of the fans who think they were secretly together in tos too).

In general, I wouldn't find it a good quality for a kelvin trek novel that it comes across as... not reading kelvin trek, LOL. Part of the fun and the main appeal of this trek is precisely seeing another, different, version of the characters and their reality. The more you imagine this Spock with Quinto's face and voice, the more an author is successfully developing that Spock. Ditto for the others.
My perception is that Alan Dean Foster is trying to make them seem familiar to old fans.
I can see it was a novel written right after the first movie came out so the author was tentatively exploring this new world, so to speak. I got a similar vibe from the first issues of the comics: at first it felt like an attempt to recreate a tos energy, only with time Mike Johnson became more confident in writing these characters as their own thing.
To be fair, it's possible readers who are old fans are the ones to default project tos on these characters regardless what the author does..in short, it may just be our perception too.
That said, I read the starfleet academy novels too and I can say they successfully made me only see the kelvin characters. Perhaps the academy setting helped those authors too because that was by itself a new territory compared to writing stories aboard the ship.

 

[Avro Arrow]

Thank you to everyone who commented on the abbreviation! Unfortunately, there doesn't seem to be any kind of overall consensus here. Maybe the fairest option would just be to put it into a poll to let everyone pick their favourite, and we can see if one comes out as the most preferred among the readers.

OK, here we go, vote here!

 

[Desert Kris]

I hadn't read the full thing yet but so far, the mystery around the new alien race they are asked to help is capturing my interest enough. However, I too got the feeling I'm reading the usual tos five years mission adventure with the Spock/Uhura interactions being the only new thing truly reminding us that this in the kelvin timeline and the characters have different experiences (unless you are one of the fans who think they were secretly together in tos too).

Well I haven't ruled out the possibility that they might have very, very briefly been together; but I prefer to think of it as mainly a Kelvin-timeline thing, so that it has unique character dynamics to distinguish from TOS.

In general, I wouldn't find it a good quality for a kelvin trek novel that it comes across as... not reading kelvin trek, LOL. Part of the fun and the main appeal of this trek is precisely seeing another, different, version of the characters and their reality. The more you imagine this Spock with Quinto's face and voice, the more an author is successfully developing that Spock. Ditto for the others.

Agreed, I would want writers for Kelvin novels to lean in on the different character dynamics and patterns of speech.

My perception is that Alan Dean Foster is trying to make them seem familiar to old fans.
I can see it was a novel written right after the first movie came out so the author was tentatively exploring this new world, so to speak. I got a similar vibe from the first issues of the comics: at first it felt like an attempt to recreate a tos energy, only with time Mike Johnson became more confident in writing these characters as their own thing.

I think that's probably understandable, although it is something that disappointed me about Star Trek Beyond that it made the characters resemble TOS more than I felt was necessary. I'm a fairly forgiving reader, and I know that Alan Dean Foster probably wrote the book after the first movie, and didn't have the sequels to reference for performance and character progression. If this new book has mainly been kept as it was in it's original finalized form, I honestly prefer that, as a glimpse into how writers would write for that timeline just from the first movie as a springboard.

To be fair, it's possible readers who are old fans are the ones to default project tos on these characters regardless what the author does..in short, it may just be our perception too.

Oh, yes; I think that's the case with me. I'm of the generation of fans who was introduced to TOS while growing up in the 80's, and finished growing up with TNG's crew. Seeing the familiar names in the prose of this new novel triggers an automatic, practiced virtual performances in my mind; which has been more practiced with all the old TOS novels I've read over the last couple years, much more than in the past.

That said, I read the starfleet academy novels too and I can say they successfully made me only see the kelvin characters. Perhaps the academy setting helped those authors too because that was by itself a new territory compared to writing stories aboard the ship.

I held off on those novels because I wanted to experience the new versions of TOS's crew in their roles as the Enterprise bridge crew. Are they good, or at least enjoyable, in your opinion? Maybe if we eventually get enough novels of the Kelvin timeline characters adventuring on the Enterprise, I'll feel more comfortable giving them a chance.

 

[Malaika]

Well I haven't ruled out the possibility that they might have very, very briefly been together; but I prefer to think of it as mainly a Kelvin-timeline thing, so that it has unique character dynamics to distinguish from TOS.

Same here. I like it as a separate 'what if' kind of thing.
The idea that kelvin Spock lost his home planet and mother but his life isn't without hope, he may actually have something his tos counterpart (who didn't have to face that tragedy) didn't have.
It's also a matter of kelvin Spock having a different journey where he understands his two sides better and he's more honest about his feelings.

Although I find it a bit a waste that tos novels would rather marry Spock to his surrogate daughter in an attempt to give him love interests, yet they never really explored possibilities you can already find in tos such as a connection with Uhura (and whether he'd struggle making a move because he was so conflicted).

Agreed, I would want writers for Kelvin novels to lean in on the different character dynamics and patterns of speech.

From what I read, even though Alan is keeping the st09 flavor for the spock/uhura and kirk/mccoy dynamics, he is more or less trying to recreate the original trio dynamic asap which results in Mccoy constantly finding pretexts to be on the bridge and antagonize Spock in a way that might come across as pretentious in context.
It's disappointing that in a mission where Uhura's skills in alien languages may be useful, she doesn't have a big role because the author prefers to limit the group, just like in old fashioned trek, to kirk/spock/mccoy thus a men only party. I don't see her interacting with Kirk much. It feels like going backwards to the trek that was the boys and the rest of the crew separated from them doing their things offscreen.

I'll finish the novel and see if my impression is confirmed but yeah, so far I'm not impressed by him keeping some things too 'tos safe' .

I held off on those novels because I wanted to experience the new versions of TOS's crew in their roles as the Enterprise bridge crew. Are they good, or at least enjoyable, in your opinion? Maybe if we eventually get enough novels of the Kelvin timeline characters adventuring on the Enterprise, I'll feel more comfortable giving them a chance.

I liked them for the most part. Part of the fun is precisely the fact you get a glimpse of the characters from 'before' the ship and how Kirk and Mccoy became friends as well as how Spock and Uhura became a couple.
It's the kind of novels that are used as a means to basically see parts of the characters stories you can't see in the movies.

If I were to write more novels, I'd probably like to explore what the crew did in the year it took them to repair the enterprise at the end of stid. Or what they do at the end of beyond when they are once again waiting to get their ship back.

 

[Gracewood]

I will go with Kelvin verse. I don't like the name JJverse or Abramsverse because it gives JJ Abrams too much power and dominance over the series, something I will find odd since I heard he was never really into star trek.

 

[Gracewood]

Spock married his surrogate daughter in TOS? Yuck. Happy I don't read most of the TOS novels. To be frank when I first saw Spock and Uhura as a couple I was a bit shocked because Spock always turned down a lot of girls in TOS but when I deeply think about it, it kind of make sense for a young spock in an alternate timeline to have a girlfriend that he keeps a secret.

The truth is with guys like spock, regardless that he is Vulcan or not, a guy who constraints and disciplines himself and emotions that much usually tends on having a secret life or a secret lover or a beloved confidante, who they can go to for solace and intimacy.

He and Uhura would not have been my first guess, Christine Chapel would have been but that is the good thing about the Kelvin verse. Its a matter of what if? and the point of what if stories is to give the idea that any character with another character in a series can be a couple in a different world or alternate timeline. For Spock and Uhura in the first film, Its very believable.

 

[Christopher]

I will go with Kelvin verse. I don't like the name JJverse or Abramsverse because it gives JJ Abrams too much power and dominance over the series, something I will find odd since I heard he was never really into star trek.

I wish people would stop assuming that had any relevance. Harve Bennett and Nicholas Meyer weren't "into" Star Trek either, but most people loved their movies. This isn't a hobby, where your fondness for a thing is the only relevant parameter. It's a profession, and what makes something good is the creator's skill. I mean, good grief, it's not like Robert Butler was a Star Trek fan when he directed "The Cage" in 1964, since nobody could've been yet. But he still did a terrific job at it. A creator's job is not to be a fan, it's to make something good enough that it turns people into fans.

Aside from that, I agree that naming a continuity after a single person involved in its creation, regardless of one's opinion of said creator, is awkward and undesirable. After all, such a creation is a collaborative exercise, and if it's successful, it can live beyond any single creator's involvement. We don't call the Marvel Universe the "Leeverse," even though Stan Lee was pivotal to it, because others like Jack Kirby and Steve Ditko were pivotal too, and because it's continued to thrive under new creators long after Lee retired.

Spock married his surrogate daughter in TOS? Yuck.

I question that interpretation of Spock's relationship to Saavik. It comes mainly from the novel The Pandora Principle, I think, and there's no indication of it in the films (especially given that they implicitly had sex in The Search for Spock). He was her mentor, and in the unofficial backstory he was her rescuer, but any presumption of a father-daughter relationship is conjectural. If anything, a number of versions of Saavik's backstory have had her raised by Sarek and Amanda, making her more of a foster sister, though a generation apart so they never would've actually lived together as siblings.

 

[fireproof78]

It's also a matter of kelvin Spock having a different journey where he understands his two sides better and he's more honest about his feelings.

As well as a different relationship with his dad.

I will go with Kelvin verse. I don't like the name JJverse or Abramsverse because it gives JJ Abrams too much power and dominance over the series, something I will find odd since I heard he was never really into star trek.

What does one have to do with the other? Abrams did his best work, fan status be damned. He is a professional.

Regardless, I would go with the Kelvin universe moniker, but that has nothing to do with Abrams. I think the man deserves the credit and then some.

I wish people would stop assuming that had any relevance. Harve Bennett and Nicholas Meyer weren't "into" Star Trek either, but most people loved their movies. This isn't a hobby, where your fondness for a thing is the only relevant parameter. It's a profession, and what makes something good is the creator's skill. I mean, good grief, it's not like Robert Butler was a Star Trek fan when he directed "The Cage" in 1964, since nobody could've been yet. But he still did a terrific job at it. A creator's job is not to be a fan, it's to make something good enough that it turns people into fans.

Agree with this.

 

[Gracewood]

As well as a different relationship with his dad.

What does one have to do with the other? Abrams did his best work, fan status be damned. He is a professional.

Regardless, I would go with the Kelvin universe moniker, but that has nothing to do with Abrams. I think the man deserves the credit and then some.

Agree with this.

I think he does deserve credit, not just a whole alternate reality universe as a tribute to him.

 

[fireproof78]

I think he does deserve credit, not just a whole alternate reality universe as a tribute to him.

And I agreed with the idea of not naming the Kelvin universe after him.

I just also noted that his fan status should have no bearing on that decision.