I watched this tonight for the first in ages. I was surprised that there wasn't a spin-off for our young friend and his time travelling bud. Helping and putting things right with endangered species throuhout the galaxies etc.
Journey's End
- Thread starter Neutral Zone
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Agreed, but I was thinking more from those who write and make programmes and not my own. As we know if there is an oppertunity for a sequel programme amkers have a tendancy to go for it
This episode was the ultimate rape of Wes' character.
I don't think we needed a Star Trek meets Quantum Leap. Oh wait....
http://ent.trekcore.com/gallery/albums/1x21/detained_058.jpg
Amen to that. Worst part is that it actually would've been a pretty good episode if it was purely about the treaty and Picard having to deal with the ensuing mess.
i agree. the basic idea of the episode - native americans leaving earth to revive their traditional culture on another planet - is (for me) actually a pretty cool one. the whole wesley thing is just embarrassing, though, and a 100% failed attempt to follow up on the spirit of "where no one has gone before."
^ I have to disagree with that. Wes finally began to think for himself, to act on his own, without always comparing himself to the expectations of others -- the real maturation of his character. It's not the best episode of the series, but it's a poetic and plausible (in terms of character, if not the science behind pulling oneself out of time) ending.
i didn't get that at all. the original conception of the wesley character (and admittedly, this didn't usually come across well) was that of an utterly unique, once-in-a-couple-hundred-years genius. rather than follow through on that, the writers seemed to spend most of the series trying to make wesley back into a "normal" kid, albeit a really really smart one. "journey's end" to me was a really lame attempt to recall the spirit of awe and wonder from that early episode (with a generous amount of hokey new age BS slathered on), and in that sense was an unmitigated & abject failure. it didn't seem poetic to me. it seemed clumsy and awkward, not to mention stupid.
all this & one of the most embarrassing lines in the series - "be sure and dress warm on those other planes of existence" (or whatever).... ::shuddering::
total crap episode, on all fronts.
i agree with the earlier post - the basic idea of the episode is a sound one, but the whole wesley thing is just awful.
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And what the hell was this BS about wanting to go into Starfleet to live up to other people's expectations (or something like that, IIRC) ? We KNOW it's crap, if anything with Wes in it before this episode is to be believed.
Well, we'll have to agree to disagree ... because I saw the series as slowly (albeit haltingly) building toward this moment ever since "Final Mission." Wesley's whole experience in "The First Duty" was the part of his seeing beyond the "illusion" of Starfleet. More specifically, many children who grow up with expectations placed on them by others (his mother, Picard, Riker, even what he thinks his deceased father would have wanted), ultimately discover that their true dreams and talents are to be found in very different pursuits.
And that completely fits with Wesley's depiction as a prodigy (one episode called him a wunderkind). So many people were placing their expectations on Wesley with how he ought to use his talents, it's no wonder he ultimately resisted their implicit pressure.
On that level, the message of the episode is almost universal -- how many of us late-teen, early-twenty-something young adults rebelled against what "the real world" thought we ought to be? The idea itself is something that has transcends Wesley's story.
I do admit that the episode itself wasn't especially nuanced in its approach (which is why I said it was not the best of episodes in the series). But conceptually, the direction Wesley's character takes not only makes sense, but is also a rather timeless tale. Which is why I call it "poetic."
And that completely fits with Wesley's depiction as a prodigy (one episode called him a wunderkind). So many people were placing their expectations on Wesley with how he ought to use his talents, it's no wonder he ultimately resisted their implicit pressure.
On that level, the message of the episode is almost universal -- how many of us late-teen, early-twenty-something young adults rebelled against what "the real world" thought we ought to be? The idea itself is something that has transcends Wesley's story.
I do admit that the episode itself wasn't especially nuanced in its approach (which is why I said it was not the best of episodes in the series). But conceptually, the direction Wesley's character takes not only makes sense, but is also a rather timeless tale. Which is why I call it "poetic."
It'd be good if that actually happened, sure. Only, y'know, there weren't even subtle hints at that until Journey's End. He always seemed genuinely enthused about a life in Starfleet, and he pursued it on his own. Nobody shoved it down his throat or pressured him. Not that we ever saw any evidence of in any onscreen scene. Journey's End pulled this plotline out of its ass. It'd be cool if it WAS a natural story like that, but we're never shown anything that would make us think it was.
Hell, Picard wanted nothing to do with him for the longest time!
Hell, Picard wanted nothing to do with him for the longest time!
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As I alluded to before, I see "The First Duty" as showing the first steps in Wesley's "disillusionment" with Starfleet and the "rules of the Real World." True, there isn't much else after that episode, but to me, it's enough to justify Wesley's change of heart in "Journey's End." I respect your criticism, but as I said, it seems like we'll have to agree to disagree on the issue. To me, the episode, despite its flaws (of which there are many) is plausible and poetic.
If you're interested, my review of the episode is here.
If you're interested, my review of the episode is here.
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