Really? I got the impression that was extreme old age. Same as Dax's reference to O'Brien dying in bed at 140.
Medical advances and improved living standards can only take you so far.
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Is T'Pol still around ?
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Really? I got the impression that was extreme old age. Same as Dax's reference to O'Brien dying in bed at 140.
Medical advances and improved living standards can only take you so far.
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Ambassador (or whatever) T'Pol shows up in Ten Forward during the teaser - actress in heavy makeup - she begins to tell Guinan a story.
Fade to T'Pol in her busty youth.
Episode continues from there.
Is there a reason to include T'Pol in a TOS story short or flashbacks as to what happened to her since 2186?
There is no necessity to include a Lady T'Pol in a TOS story. Continuity serves the plot, not the other way round. Her role in A Less Perfect Union was critical to the plot, that's why she was there and not, for example, Phlox.
As for Shran's fate, it has been explicitly established as being uncertain by the 2260s in Age of the Empress. Empress Sato accesses the historical database of the Defiant, which says he left the service at some point and went his own way.
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I assumed that was just meant to be a reference to TATV, since
1) The story was written before The Good that Men Do, and therefore even in novel continuity the episode was "canon."
2) Even now with The Good that Men Do, it doesn't matter since in the 23rd century when the Defiant database was written what we saw in on screen on TATV would be considered the "official story" for Federation historians and therefore it would be that story the database references.
So basically, that tells us nothing about what actually happened to Shran.
Nowadays, in the 2380s and beyond, I expect people are storing a good transporter trace and every few decades someone just "runs them through a transporter" and they're good as new. Or Borg nanoprobes. Or making them sit in an "RNA reversion field."
Taking all of the technology of the TNG/DS9/VOY/Novelverse era as a whole, I can't see any reason why people aren't living forever.
Christopher's e-book "The Collectors" touches on the question of the relative technolgical conservatism of the Federation some as compared with what it should be able to achieve, if that's something you're interested in reading on.
You'd lose you're memories subsequent to the time of the transporter trace, right?
Not quite. According to "Unnatural Selection," the trace isn't an actual stored copy of your full pattern; that would take far too much memory. It's just a record of your DNA pattern. It was used in "Unnatural Selection" to correct Pulaski's damaged DNA, and that was able to reverse her aging because it was the result of a genetic mutation (doesn't quite hold water, but that was the idea). So it wouldn't be a cure-all for every form of aging or illness or injury, only a way of correcting genetic mutations. (Making one wonder why they didn't use it in "Genesis.")
So it didn't alter her memories, because her original DNA pattern was just overlaid onto the mutated one in her cells. That wouldn't have altered her brain structure or memory storage.
Now, "The Lorelei Signal" did posit using a stored copy of the entire transporter pattern (which was not called a "trace" there) to repair rapid aging or degeneration. In the Alan Dean Foster version, it did reset their memories, but in the actual episode, it didn't. In retrospect, it seems likely that the stored "pattern" was, in fact, a genetic trace, because it doesn't follow that they'd have more storage capability in the 23rd century than the 24th. ("The Counter-Clock Incident" did the reverse, using the transporter to restore the de-aged crew to normal, but that episode was such an incoherent mess that I prefer to ignore it.)
No. As I said, it just used the uncorrupted genetic data from her trace as a patch on the corrupted genes in her pattern. The rest of the pattern came from her, from the real-time scan of her body. Per TNG rules, the transporter can't store an entire person's pattern, otherwise it could create living clones of anyone. It just doesn't have the memory capacity to store that data with the quantum resolution necessary to reproduce a living organism. The best that could be done was to take a smaller amount of data that could be stored -- e.g. the genetic code in Pulaski's chromosomes -- and use it to selectively edit her pattern when she was beamed aboard. So the result would still be her adult body, just without the genetic damage that created the appearance of rapid aging.
Which actually shouldn't have immediately undone the physical changes she'd undergone, since genes don't work that way. It would've taken time for new cells to grow and replace the old ones, for her white hair to grow out, etc. But then, the same goes for the instant cure in "The Deadly Years."
^Yes, we do get a glimpse of where T'Pol is as of 2186. I believe that's her chronologically latest appearance in the main timeline.
I agree we shouldn't establish T'Pol's final fate as long as the Enterprise is still around. That does not exclude references to her later life in other stories.
But to add to the discussion: Federation: The First 150 Years, p. 187. The following excerpt refers to an event of the 150's birthday of the Federation, on 11 October 2311, and to the Human-Vulcan first contact from "248 years before":
Disclaimer: I'm aware F:150Y is not in continuity with the Litverse.
But to add to the discussion: Federation: The First 150 Years, p. 187. The following excerpt refers to an event of the 150's birthday of the Federation, on 11 October 2311, and to the Human-Vulcan first contact from "248 years before":
DavidAGoodman said:
Disclaimer: I'm aware F:150Y is not in continuity with the Litverse.
Well, Dr. McCoy lived to at least 137, which seemed to be no big deal to anyone.
I'm certain there have been medical advancements, but IMO it just feels weird to use that as an excuse to have T'Pol show up in a TNG era story. And at that, how fun WOULD it be to do one where T'Pol would certainly be too old to contibute more than some wisdom and logic to a tale. Use time travel instead - everyone else does, plus it keeps T'Pol at her T'hottest.
Mark
Why?
Just describe her as going to the Ba'ku planet in the Briar patch for a decade and that's it.
Even when she would first get there, she would notice the effects of the metaphasic radiation after the first few days (probably more than enough to slow down the ageing and have her survive for the decade needed for her biology to revert to the previous younger state).
Realistically, the Federation should have advanced in medical science so much that by the late 22nd century, lifespan should have been radically extended (nevermind the 23rd and 24th century) via stem-cells alone for example.
It is possible that many people in the Federation simply don't want to live that long, or were really not encouraged to think like this.
But It's one of the less realistic prospects of Trek... whereas already in real life regenerative medicine with stem-cells will take off in the next 5 to 10 years.
And nanobots by 2030.
Radical life extension in real life is already talked about as being more than doable for humans using stem-cells alone... and we could have been using this for the past decade intensely.
Besides, weren't Vulcans described as living past 300 years?
If T'pol was 60 years old in 2154, she'd have more than enough time to reach Ba'Ku planet after Insurrection took place in 2370-ies and get restored to her younger self - though it never made sense that the effects of metaphasc radiation could not be duplicated by the best Federation minds who posses highly advanced scanning technology to boot.
The directors apparently needed a dumbed down reason to create viable drama (yet again).
Never in my experience. The Making of Star Trek said that Vulcan life expectancy was about 250 years, which was accepted lore for a while. But as I remarked above, "Unification" and "Broken Bow" put Vulcan lifespans at around 200 years or so.
Sarek lived for just over 200 years.
Seems quite short lived.
Besides, we know very little of T'Pol's life since her service on NX-01 (or at least, we know next to nothing), so who knows what might have happened.
She might have gained access to medical research that extended her life expectancy for instance that wasn't available to the general public, went to Ba'ku planet (the Briar patch was evidently known in mid 22nd century, but the planet itself might not have been discovered until sometime in the 24th century).
then there's the transporter as a possibility, etc. etc. etc.
Plenty of options for T'Pol to survive as a young woman into the 24th century.
Perhaps even stasis?
My issue there is, is there a need to have T'Pol in the 24th century, especially if she's been kept young looking. I'd be interested in seeing her play a role in her older years if the story was good and she was needed, but just to come up with a convoluted reason for her to still look good in the catsuit? No, that just feels like pandering to the hetero male fan base to me.
It can be done, of course, but I don't think it should be done.
I hope there are many great novels set in the 22nd century with T'Pol
It can be done, of course, but I don't think it should be done.
I hope there are many great novels set in the 22nd century with T'Pol
Where is the logic in extending her life, just so she can exist in the 24th century?
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