In the future of Syntehol, is there underage drinking?

[fireproof78]

Reality says that teens will drink well before the age of majority for a variety of reasons that have nothing to do with trauma and everything to do with social acceptance and finding their place in society. Teens are dumb; common sense doesn’t kick in until after 25 and you realize that waking up with a hangover is a great teacher on why you shouldn’t drink to excess.

It's absurd to think the Federation creates the same type of environment as 21st century societies and that somehow these behaviors will carry on.

Point blank.

It is more frustrating to just dismiss this behavior as "teens will be teens" without acknowledging that social learning in society and that a society that values growth and development might not inspire such behaviors.

Finally, this behavior cannot be called "self destructive" in one post and then say "at risk youth are not appropriate for Trek." If you have the behavior as described in Trek then it comes with all.the baggage associated with it.

 

[Michael Two Wolves]

Yes it can, when you take it out of the context in which I very clearly stated it as you are doing. I said we are not talking about the self-destructive behaviors of troubled youth, we are talking about a harmless theft of some minor-tier alcohol for a cheap thrill before going off into the shining plastic future of Starfleet.

We are talking about beer. No hard liquor. Teens sneaking off to drink the Star Trek equivalent of a beer, not stealing dad’s fifth of vodka. Your insertion of a red herring into the conversation amounts to nothing.

 

[fireproof78]

There's no indication these behaviors would occur or have reason to do so.

 

[fireproof78]

Yes it can, when you take it out of the context in which I very clearly stated it as you are doing. I said we are not talking about the self-destructive behaviors of troubled youth,

I apologize. I misread.

 

[Michael Two Wolves]

I apologize. I misread.

It happens. No harm, no foul. I am just as guilty of this myself at times.

 

[Weyoun 251]

"Dipshit from Chicago" is what he calls himself.

It has been stated multiple times there is no advertising in the Federation. Indeed, in time travel episodes where characters see ads or commercials, they always react with "WTF is this?" The current shows have leaned into this, showing advertising on other planets, but still with the Starfleet/Federation characters acting perplexed over the concept.

Spoiler: Lower Decks S4

Indeed, this was even a critical plot point in the most recent episode of Lower Decks.

Good catch mate - I've conflated two quotes of his into one there

 

[Mr. Laser Beam]

It was Michelob. They said that in the scene.

Almost as bad.

 

[Orphalesion]

Ah, but that’s just it. Some of us would like to see that underworld in the Star Trek universe. It is, after all, called Star Trek, not Starfleet TV. Not everything must revolve around Starfleet and it would be interesting to see a contrast against the backdrop of Starfleet space. A spacer-turned-mercenary, for instance, that runs around doing missions for gangsters and other criminals, in a suped-up freighter with a Romulan subversive for a partner who has a death mark for telling the Tal Shiar to kiss his Liberty-loving backside is a show I could dig in the Star Trek universe.

I’ll have to check out the new shows.

But aside form the specific details...how would a show about a mercenary or working class folk in the Star Trek universe be different from the Expanse, Firefly, LEXX....(okay LEXX is more hedonism) I understand not wanting to always have to watch Starfleet. But whenever I don't want that...I just watch a sci-fi show or movie that has something different. I want many franchises to exist, I don't want one franchise to be everything. I actually quite like the smugglers in Star Wars (I LOVED Solo) but I feel it's more of a Star Wars thing.

Also yes, give the newer shows a try. Season 1 Picard was too...well...I don't know how to call it...sleazy? For me. It had stuff I don't like in any show. But I think it might appeal to you. There's a whole episode (which I do consider one of the better ones of Season 1 Picard) where they visit a sleazy city planet full of casinos and crime lords and all that stuff.
And if you really want to see recreational drinking...well just watch Lower Decks. One of the characters already gets drunk off her ass in the first episode.

For a show I enjoy a lot more there's Lower Decks. I feel those are very relatable characters to me that remind me of myself and my friends. Granted I'd be basically the Boimler of my group. But there's also characters like Mariner who literally gets drunk off her ass in the first episode and spends a good amount of time "trying to stick it to the man" if that's what you're after.

Also...please don't understand that wrong. But what is it with hetero men and their gangster movies/shows? I feel like every hetero man friend I have loves their mobster stuff. What's so alluring about that? Is just the whole "macho" thing?

The realism in an older teen drinking a can of beer while working on a project skimmer (car? Shuttle?) is much more accessible and relatable to people than Wes going away to Starfleet school.

I can relate to Wes. And to characters like Boimler and Tendi and Rutherford. I'm Geek X-D

 

[fireproof78]

Also...please don't understand that wrong. But what is it with hetero men and their gangster movies/shows? I feel like every hetero man friend I have loves their mobster stuff. What's so alluring about that? Is just the whole "macho" thing?

As a hetero man I do not like mob stuff. Irritating and annoying.

Same with pirates. Stupid romanticization of a hedonistic and savage lifestyle. Fuck that noise especially in Star Trek.

 

[Orphalesion]

As a hetero man I do not like mob stuff. Irritating and annoying.

Same with pirates. Stupid romanticization of a hedonistic and savage lifestyle. Fuck that noise especially in Star Trek.

Oh I didn't mean to say everyone. Just like I don't watch Drag Race.
It's just seems really common and, since I find mobsters so thoroughly unappealing I'd like to understand why.

 

[Michael Two Wolves]

I think it’s not so much that I don’t always want to see Starfleet as much as I like to explore the background stuff that then gets referenced in the Starfleet shows. It’s fun to see connections to earlier references light up.

I like to see the guts of ships and see the bits and pieces that make everything go. That’s why the idea of anyone—mercenary or otherwise—on the run with an outlaw companion implies broke down ships in need of repairs (more stuff to explore—engine parts and ship maker companies, for instance), seedy bars with hot alien chicks, loud music and intense chase scenes, shootouts and ultimately, the bad guys getting served by the antiheroes.

 

[Mr. Laser Beam]

But what is it with hetero men and their gangster movies/shows? I feel like every hetero man friend I have loves their mobster stuff. What's so alluring about that? Is just the whole "macho" thing?

That could be a part of it, yeah.

I'm also a "zero" (as Dr. Kinsey might say ) but I never really got into the mob stuff either.

Although I do admit to some fascination with the Iotians from TOS. To think that an entire civilization could quickly and eagerly seize upon an obscure gangster novel, as a blueprint for their entire civilization...I thought that was really cool. Especially how the Iotians treat "The Book" with near-religious reverence, and don't tolerate any disrespect against it.

Even though it was obviously an excuse for another "planet of hats" episode.

"I would advise youse to keep dialin', Okmyx!"

 

[JesterFace]

With syntehol, what if there's only underage drinking, so called real drinkers want real alcohol with a proper hangover.

Also, they want....
irrational behaviour
hugging everybody repeating "you're a good guy" over and over again.
shouting
acting like they're wealthy, even if monet doesn't exist?
designated helmsman is required
buying everybody rounds of drinks even if money still doesn't exist?
remembering the good old times with other drunk folks
remembering the last time they were drunk
remembering what they drank the last time they got drunk
remembering how pissed off their significant other will be because of being drunk
and possibly fighting over ridiculous reasons that make no sense.

 

[Guy Gardener]

With syntehol, what if there's only underage drinking, so called real drinkers want real alcohol with a proper hangover.

Also, they want....
irrational behaviour
hugging everybody repeating "you're a good guy" over and over again.
shouting
acting like they're wealthy, even if monet doesn't exist?
designated helmsman is required
buying everybody rounds of drinks even if money still doesn't exist?
remembering the good old times with other drunk folks
remembering the last time they were drunk
remembering what they drank the last time they got drunk
remembering how pissed off their significant other will be because of being drunk
and possibly fighting over ridiculous reasons that make no sense.

It's a romantic unknown.

Real alcohol would be very hard to come by. Fill out a hundred forms, win a lottery, and 8 months later you get 500 mls of the good stuff.

Or replicate a billion barrels of synthehol, sell it to prewarp morons and live like a king.

 

[fireproof78]

I think it’s not so much that I don’t always want to see Starfleet as much as I like to explore the background stuff that then gets referenced in the Starfleet shows. It’s fun to see connections to earlier references light up.

I like to see the guts of ships and see the bits and pieces that make everything go. That’s why the idea of anyone—mercenary or otherwise—on the run with an outlaw companion implies broke down ships in need of repairs (more stuff to explore—engine parts and ship maker companies, for instance), seedy bars with hot alien chicks, loud music and intense chase scenes, shootouts and ultimately, the bad guys getting served by the antiheroes.

It's nice for Trek to be about bad guys.

Obviously that's how such mercenaries were portrayed before.

It's just seems really common and, since I find mobsters so thoroughly unappealing I'd like to understand why.

Appeal of the dangerous and supposedly free life.

 

[Michael Two Wolves]

Why not just replicate all the ingredients and equipment and the prehistoric 45 million year old yeast and make your own Fossil Fuel beer?

 

[fireproof78]

Why not just replicate all the ingredients and equipment and the prehistoric 45 million year old yeast and make your own Fossil Fuel beer?

Why not Indeed?

Besides that it sounds disgusting.

 

[Michael Two Wolves]

To you. From the Wired magazine article I read, the flavor sounds a lot like the extinct Red Label Miller with a twist. I’d try it just to say I did.

 

[fireproof78]

I'll send you a get well soon card.

 

[Michael Two Wolves]

I’m pretty sure that even in Federation space, a 45 million year old beer with “hints of clover and ginger” would find a market in connoisseurs who would enjoy drinking something brewed from a yeast older than even Vulcan civilization.