Even in the Alpha Quadrant. I remember that there was a shot of the Promenade of DS9 where you could see Lieutenant Ayala in the background at one of the shops. This was in Season Five.
If Equinox had survived, who'd have been the new Captain?
- Thread starter Guy Gardener
- Start date
Equinox: Chakotay becomes Captain, Tuvok becomes First Officer. (Janeway would need 2 extremely trusted colleagues on board a ship that had gone so astray)
Voyager: Janeway stays Captain, Paris becomes First Officer. (Despite the fact that he had been demoted that year, he had more experience than Kim, B'Elanna belongs in Engineering, Seven and The Doctor would be ridiculous choices)
Voyager: Janeway stays Captain, Paris becomes First Officer. (Despite the fact that he had been demoted that year, he had more experience than Kim, B'Elanna belongs in Engineering, Seven and The Doctor would be ridiculous choices)
If you put Chakotay in charge of Equinox, then the entire crew of the Val Jean is going to follow him, so then you'll have a Starfleet crew on one ship and a Maquis crew on the other ship.
The division line between crews would now be a few kilometres of hard vacuum.
Politically unsound.
Us and them, so to say.
But the Command of equinox would still have to be A Maquis and Starfleet.
Which brings me back to B'Elanna again, with Tuvok as her XO since he's smart enough to handle the politics of the matter.
One reason to give the ship to the ECH.
What if Equinox became just a huge mobile antimatter tanker one toggleflip away from detonation? I.E.: They turned Equinox into a super torpedo for the next time they got into the shit against a foe who completely outclassed them?
You need at least a hundred people to run Voyager, although 5 years after that comment was made, odds are that that ship was super automated to the point that one of two people could run the entire vessel, workforce, one, the Killing game.... But say 110 crewmen on Voyager and 42 on Equinox... What if more crew volunteered to work under Chakotay? Say 2/3rds of the entire crew requesitioned a transfer to Equinox to follow after the Indian because his fanclub was bigger than Janeways that it made more sense for she, that captain and her loyalists to take the smaller ship?
The division line between crews would now be a few kilometres of hard vacuum.
Politically unsound.
Us and them, so to say.
But the Command of equinox would still have to be A Maquis and Starfleet.
Which brings me back to B'Elanna again, with Tuvok as her XO since he's smart enough to handle the politics of the matter.
One reason to give the ship to the ECH.
What if Equinox became just a huge mobile antimatter tanker one toggleflip away from detonation? I.E.: They turned Equinox into a super torpedo for the next time they got into the shit against a foe who completely outclassed them?
You need at least a hundred people to run Voyager, although 5 years after that comment was made, odds are that that ship was super automated to the point that one of two people could run the entire vessel, workforce, one, the Killing game.... But say 110 crewmen on Voyager and 42 on Equinox... What if more crew volunteered to work under Chakotay? Say 2/3rds of the entire crew requesitioned a transfer to Equinox to follow after the Indian because his fanclub was bigger than Janeways that it made more sense for she, that captain and her loyalists to take the smaller ship?
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Cool idea for a thread, sort of like how the Pegasus survived on nuBSG. Of course, on that show they didn't really know what to do with it and went through 4 commanders in one half season 
. For the Equinox, I would have loved to see Chakotay become the captain as it would have given him a renewed sense of purpose; I always felt like he was hugely neglected in the last several seasons of the show.
Another interesting question is if Equinox HAD survived, I wonder how long it would have remained? Had the rest of the show been mostly the same, are there any big events that stand out as a reason to destroy the Equinox? I'm not sure if there were. Another small point---keeping Equinox would have forced the writers to continue to use the remaining Equinox supporting characters, people who were completely forgotten and never mentioned or seen again after part 2. BSG did the same thing with all of its Pegasus supporting players, other than a 2-ep mini-arc thing 2 seasons later...maybe these one-ship shows just aren't cut out to bring on a second ship!
. For the Equinox, I would have loved to see Chakotay become the captain as it would have given him a renewed sense of purpose; I always felt like he was hugely neglected in the last several seasons of the show. Another interesting question is if Equinox HAD survived, I wonder how long it would have remained? Had the rest of the show been mostly the same, are there any big events that stand out as a reason to destroy the Equinox? I'm not sure if there were. Another small point---keeping Equinox would have forced the writers to continue to use the remaining Equinox supporting characters, people who were completely forgotten and never mentioned or seen again after part 2. BSG did the same thing with all of its Pegasus supporting players, other than a 2-ep mini-arc thing 2 seasons later...maybe these one-ship shows just aren't cut out to bring on a second ship!
There would be no good reason to keep the Equinox. They would have one substandard ship slowing Voyager down and there would be a crew shortage on both ships. The only thing the Equinox would have been good for was spare parts, probably not many of those, and raw material.
Brit
I wonder if Equinox would move faster if Voyager was towing it inside it's warp bubble compared to how speedy Equinox impels under it's own power?
As a hulk, you'sd ave to wonder why Seven couldn't turn the entire thing into a Transwarp capable vessel since she could mees up the entire project with out tacking a lick out of Voyager's defensive posture?
new idea?
Training ship, kind of like the kids table. Little to none actual senoir officers.
Have the inexperienced and newb and rube and maquis audition on Equinox for Voyager?
As a hulk, you'sd ave to wonder why Seven couldn't turn the entire thing into a Transwarp capable vessel since she could mees up the entire project with out tacking a lick out of Voyager's defensive posture?
new idea?
Training ship, kind of like the kids table. Little to none actual senoir officers.
Have the inexperienced and newb and rube and maquis audition on Equinox for Voyager?
Didn't they actually debate this in Part I?
Not until it became clear that the beasties were attacking constantly and were not going to stop.
Dealbreaker. The proposed skuttling made Ransom bolt.
Hmm?
When the beasties demanded that Janeway feed them the Equinox crew, were they asking for the ship as well?
Because it seems that Janeway could have have kept the ship if she just fought a little smarter intot he position that she just tied up the Equinox crew and left them screaming for their mommies in a an unshielded cargo bay? But the beasties were so ignorant about humans that they must have assumed that the Equinox 5 had always been Voyager crewmen...
Doesn't that make Janeway a liar for not following through with her deal? Her safe passage in exchange for the bastards who had been murdering space beasties?
Dealbreaker. The proposed skuttling made Ransom bolt.
Hmm?
When the beasties demanded that Janeway feed them the Equinox crew, were they asking for the ship as well?
Because it seems that Janeway could have have kept the ship if she just fought a little smarter intot he position that she just tied up the Equinox crew and left them screaming for their mommies in a an unshielded cargo bay? But the beasties were so ignorant about humans that they must have assumed that the Equinox 5 had always been Voyager crewmen...
Doesn't that make Janeway a liar for not following through with her deal? Her safe passage in exchange for the bastards who had been murdering space beasties?
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So it's always all right to take advantage of aliens only as long as they are too ignorant to know that they are being cheated and hard done by?
I'm thinking about the Pakleds in reverse right now.
"It's easier to say sorry than please"
I'm thinking about the Pakleds in reverse right now.
"It's easier to say sorry than please"
I guess it's just that we hold some (fictional) people to a higher (impossible?) standard.
But Picard uncloaked the Enterprise in front of the Romulans in Pegasus because he thought it was naughty that the federation was doing the dirty on them, however Kirk pimped his first officer to some Romulan slapper to steal one of those thingies a century earlier, but when that alien wanted to eat Icheb as penance for practically nothing, Janeway said "Sweet: Go for it, eat the little bastard because rules are rules and a law is law and a deal is a deal." Hells Janeway planned to honour her deal with the Borg, well at least that's what she told people after Chuckles backed the hell over her will and best intentions.
When a shop keeper intentionally and maliciously gives you incorrect change do you laugh or cut one of his fingers off?
Do I expect scummy behaviour from Captain Chakotay, Captain Tuvok, Captain Torres or Captain Doctor? is there going to be such a moral ravine between the new equinox captain and the old Voyager captain some point down the road that they too will be forced to take up arms against one another because the principles of the Federation and decency are being shat upon?
This rules out Chuckles and Tuvok, they're both too honourable to be on an even pegging with Kathy that with out the friendship and teepee in his pants Janeway was going to be being held acountable for some unacceptable shenanigans in the following two years before Admiral Janeway was not immediately put in a cell or stasis for contaminating the timeline.
So the new Captain either had to be a bastard or a weakling, not that janeway would ever admit that the reason she REALLY doesn't get along well with others to the point of bloodshed is because she has a fundementally unsound personality. She's almost incapable of coming to terms with this in any healthy manner.
But Picard uncloaked the Enterprise in front of the Romulans in Pegasus because he thought it was naughty that the federation was doing the dirty on them, however Kirk pimped his first officer to some Romulan slapper to steal one of those thingies a century earlier, but when that alien wanted to eat Icheb as penance for practically nothing, Janeway said "Sweet: Go for it, eat the little bastard because rules are rules and a law is law and a deal is a deal." Hells Janeway planned to honour her deal with the Borg, well at least that's what she told people after Chuckles backed the hell over her will and best intentions.
When a shop keeper intentionally and maliciously gives you incorrect change do you laugh or cut one of his fingers off?
Do I expect scummy behaviour from Captain Chakotay, Captain Tuvok, Captain Torres or Captain Doctor? is there going to be such a moral ravine between the new equinox captain and the old Voyager captain some point down the road that they too will be forced to take up arms against one another because the principles of the Federation and decency are being shat upon?
This rules out Chuckles and Tuvok, they're both too honourable to be on an even pegging with Kathy that with out the friendship and teepee in his pants Janeway was going to be being held acountable for some unacceptable shenanigans in the following two years before Admiral Janeway was not immediately put in a cell or stasis for contaminating the timeline.
So the new Captain either had to be a bastard or a weakling, not that janeway would ever admit that the reason she REALLY doesn't get along well with others to the point of bloodshed is because she has a fundementally unsound personality. She's almost incapable of coming to terms with this in any healthy manner.
Picard exposed the Pegasus device because 1) He's one of the more noble characters in Trek (up there with Spock and Bashir) and 2) The Feds had an agreement at that time with the Romulans whereas in "Enterprise Incident" they didn't. They made the deal and he felt compelled to stand by that.
As for the new Captain of Equinox being a bastard, why not just take a character and develop them into being more of a bastard as times goes on to show the corrupting influences power had on said character?
As for the new Captain of Equinox being a bastard, why not just take a character and develop them into being more of a bastard as times goes on to show the corrupting influences power had on said character?
Janeway would probably put Tuvok in command of the Equinox. I can't see her putting Chakotay there as she needs him on Voyager because of the Maquis. Having Chakotay as XO of Voyager lets the other Maquis feel that they're not being 'abused'. Let's face it, even though they've been working together for years, old sentiments can come back quickly so Chakotay is needed to help maintain a balance and feeling of fairness. Torres is a Maquis and she knew that guy on the Equinox, no way she'd be able to control the crew. Paris would be the next most likely candidate but he's shown to be reckless so giving him command could spell disaster in the future should he choose to disobey an order again. Kim would be laughed at and the good Dr is needed more in sickbay than on the bridge. Therefore, Tuvok is the only option available. Tuvok wouldn't be promoted since he's a Lt. Commander and this rank has proven to be sufficient to be commanding officer of a starship in the past (any lower rank would be stretching it). There's no doubt Janeway would 'intermingle' the crews a bit to try and prevent any sort of major unrest. The main troublemakers would be locked up in quarters on Voyager like Suder was.
Bashir criminally lied about the very nature of his personality and his resequenced DNA for most of the first 30 years of his life. He cheated at darts too. So what if he cheated to lose, but still it's cheating. Miles did not appreciate being patronized in the slightest.
Exposing the phase cloak in violation of the Treaty of Algernon was the right thing to do, even if it meant a costly renegotiation of the peace, whether that meant outright war or just humiliating diplomatic concessions or an acidic tarnish of the Federations reputation FOREVER, and Picard was probably a little concerned that Pressman would use this new technology to put the Federation on a new warfooting against the Romulans or other races if it became clear that any victory would be "piss easy", so neutering the warmongerer by exposing his ace up his sleeve was the only way to save billions of lives on either side by losing a little political face. Picard was damned if he did and damned if he didn't, so he might as well do the right thing.
One choice is no choice at all.
People suggest the entire story retoactively must have been section 31, even if Enterprise's final episode didn't chose to back up that hypothesis after reintroducing section 31 an episode and two earlier.
No arguments about Spock.
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