"I like the new movie better..."

[Admiral Buzzkill]

"Failings" or "flaws" it comes to the same thing. And even many of its fans admit the film has them. It's just a matter of degree.

That goes for any film. I don't believe anyone said it was flawless.

Indeed, and it's entirely reasonable to point out that films and TV shows that the critics hold up as examples to be preferred have the same kinds of flaws - or worse.

But then, if you do that you get caterwauling about "trying to make the new movie look better by tearing down the other stuff."

It would be much happier for everyone if folks who hated something just went and devoted their time and attention to something they liked better - quietly, or at the very least, quickly.

 

[doubleohfive]

It would be much happier for everyone if folks who hated something just went and devoted their time and attention to something they liked better - quietly, or at the very least, quickly.

And sadly, that precise motive seems to be more and more anathema to the general disposition of most Trekkies these days.

 

[Aragorn]

It would be much happier for everyone if folks who hated something just went and devoted their time and attention to something they liked better - quietly, or at the very least, quickly.

Where exactly do you think you are, man? This is the internet!

The largest single post I've ever seen on this board was in the BSG forum from a certain BSG hater who ripped the series endlessly yet spent more time on the show than even its biggest fans and kept watching to tell us how right he was.

What are a few select people supposed to do with their free time if they can't bitch and moan in the Star Trek XI forum 24/7?

 

[F. King Daniel]

And when some of those people who nitpick STXI to death somehow will accept nonsensical bollocks like Mirror Vic being human in DS9 without any complaint whatsoever, they expose themselves as the double-standard bearing, mindless trolls they really are.

 

[Jochk]

Heck, I'm a die-hard life-long Trekkie, and I like the new movie better .

(and I enjoy all the others, even TMP, STV and Nemesis )

One problem with that the new trek movie reminded me to much of star wars and still was good just not from a Star Trek point more from a Star WARS point.

 

[Devon]

Heck, I'm a die-hard life-long Trekkie, and I like the new movie better .

(and I enjoy all the others, even TMP, STV and Nemesis )

One problem with that the new trek movie reminded me to much of star wars and still was good just not from a Star Trek point more from a Star WARS point.

Not sure I regard a story about a young James T. Kirk's life getting altered by a time traveling Romulan much of a good Star Wars film. But what do I know.

 

[Amaris]

Heck, I'm a die-hard life-long Trekkie, and I like the new movie better .

(and I enjoy all the others, even TMP, STV and Nemesis )

One problem with that the new trek movie reminded me to much of star wars and still was good just not from a Star Trek point more from a Star WARS point.

Really? I'm quite the fan of Star Wars, but I'm a hardcore Trek fan. I've got tons of knowledge, most of it useless trivia, backed up in my head. That said, while there are nods to Star Wars, there are many more homages to the Trek universe. Personally, a little injection of a different viewpoint did the franchise a lot of good. It has rejuvenated people's interest in Star Trek, and now we can see many more years of Trek instead of a dismal, dying gasp of a last breath many of us thought had finally come.

 

[Ryan8bit]

And when some of those people who nitpick STXI to death somehow will accept nonsensical bollocks like Mirror Vic being human in DS9 without any complaint whatsoever, they expose themselves as the double-standard bearing, mindless trolls they really are.

Haha, did somebody really say that? If so, it sounds like a good read.

DS9's mirror universe should have never been more than one episode really.

 

[Aragorn]

Not sure I regard a story about a young James T. Kirk's life getting altered by a time traveling Romulan much of a good Star Wars film. But what do I know.

Time travel is a staple of Star Wars! Just like technobabble, battles in space (thus "Star Wars") and the Enterprise.

 

[Admiral Buzzkill]

Not sure I regard a story about a young James T. Kirk's life getting altered by a time traveling Romulan much of a good Star Wars film. But what do I know.

Time travel is a staple of Star Wars! Just like technobabble, battles in space (thus "Star Wars") and the Enterprise.

Exactly - like how George Lucas traveled back in time to years before Luke Skywalker was born in order to fuck up the franchise!

 

[doubleohfive]

Man, some of you guys really take this shit far, far too seriously.

I mean ... who cares if Mirror Vic was a "real" person or not? It was fun! It was surprising! It was unexpected. Don't get so fucking bogged down in the technical crap. It may be science fiction but in a very literal sense it's all fantasy too. Not every i has to be dotted, not every t needs to be crossed.

Stop spending your time hating it. Focus more on what you do enjoy. You'll be happier for it in the long run, trust me.

 

[ST-One]

Man, some of you guys really take this shit far, far too seriously.

I mean ... who cares if Mirror Vic was a "real" person or not? It was fun! It was surprising! It was unexpected. Don't get so fucking bogged down in the technical crap. It may be science fiction but in a very literal sense it's all fantasy too. Not every i has to be dotted, not every t needs to be crossed.

Stop spending your time hating it. Focus more on what you do enjoy. You'll be happier for it in the long run, trust me.

This.

 

[darkwing_duck1]

I think this thread is about insulting people who dared to enjoy the new film, even if they decide to check out the other shows and movies as a result.

Well, now, this topic was actually started by someone relating a positive experience regarding the film - that he knew people who preferred it to oldTrek. So that's what it's about. There've been posters who consider that the mere existence of the topic is a troll to old-timers.

The existence of the topic, maybe not. A majority of your posts, certainly.

The truth is, if we've listened with open minds to many people about the movie we've all heard others express the opinion that they like it better.

And many express that they did not.

It's unavoidable - so many more people have seen this movie and liked it, most of them non-fans, than have bothered with oldTrek for a very long time. Why shouldn't they prefer this?

These are the same "non-fans", ie the "general public" that ensure that the television schedule is flooded with drivel like Survivor: Anywhere we haven't been yet" and umpteen dozen police procedurals.

The frustration on the part of folks who find this unacceptable is pretty simple: they're not getting what they want. Intuitively most of them understand that they're never going to get what they want, because it's not in the interests of anyone involved to give them what they want.

It is if they want a fanbase that will take them through the next 40 years instead of abandoning them for the next "kewl thing".

And the implication there - which is pretty much justified - is that they can't have what they're asking for because in may respects it's not good enough. It's not sophisticated enough, not ambitious enough as a production, not entertaining enough to impress or attract a new audience.

09 Trek is "sophisticated" or "ambitious"?

09 Trek is the epitome of dumbing down for the massess: reduce your characters to one and two-line "concepts", put them in a bright and shiny story outline they plays up spectacle and hopes like hell that no one notices that for all that it's a mile wide, it's an inch deep.

It didn't even have enough juice left to hold on to the audience it had two decades ago.

Not under Berman's regime. What oldTrek could (can) do under a GOOD producer like Coto has not been fully explored.

So the reflex is to find fault with the audience, with young people, and with the majority. We used to call this phenomenon "everybody's out of step but Johnny."

Ever heard the truism that "The masses are asses..." And that is nowhere more true than today's youth. Any age group that can embrace trash "culture" like gangsta, and who find the pathetic psuedo-lives of "celebrities" like Lohan, et al in the least bit interesting are NEVER going to be culturally literate...and the drek they feed on is only going to choke out legitimately artful endeavors like weeds choke rose gardens.

 

[darkwing_duck1]

It would be much happier for everyone if folks who hated something just went and devoted their time and attention to something they liked better - quietly, or at the very least, quickly.

Translation: Sit down, shut up, and drink your Kool Aid...

 

[Ryan8bit]

who cares if Mirror Vic was a "real" person or not? It was fun! It was surprising! It was unexpected. Don't get so fucking bogged down in the technical crap.

I'm guessing this was addressed towards me? Personally, I don't care that they did that, but I wouldn't go out of my way to try and rationalize it either. That's what sounded funny to me and what made me curious.

Vic being there was just part of a string of senseless occurrences that were done just to be sensational. It's bad storytelling that has nothing to do with anything technical. But this is all beside the point.

 

[Ghrakh]

It would be much happier for everyone if folks who hated something just went and devoted their time and attention to something they liked better - quietly, or at the very least, quickly.

You mean people who hate criticism? Since forums are for discussion and debate, I agree it would be better if those haters went elsewhere.

 

[Admiral Buzzkill]

Debate and discussion are worth having if the participants can be smart and interesting. This isn't the case with very much of the "criticism" (to elevate continuity nitpicking and narrow minded complaining by the use of that term) that goes on regarding this movie. That hating is simply boring and repetitive.

 

[Ryan8bit]

That hating is simply boring and repetitive.

If it's so boring, why do you consistently read and reply to it?

 

[doubleohfive]

Vic being there was just part of a string of senseless occurrences that were done just to be sensational. It's bad storytelling that has nothing to do with anything technical. But this is all beside the point.

I disagree that it was "bad storytelling."

It was a gag. A story joke. One more thing to fuck around with the very literal, linear and A to B to C brain functions of most of the Star Trek fandom. As Q once said, "I add a little flair, a little excitement to your lives and all you do is complain!"

Look, it'd be one thing if the DS9 writers tried pulling these kinds of zany things all the time. But the fact is they didn't. It was ONE gag in ONE episode that took place outside the main storyline and continuity. I myself don't have a real problem with it. In fact, I think it was a pretty bold choice to make, just to show how much more fucked up the MU really is compared to our own. It didn't need any explanation; And being that some people still wonder about it, still feel like they need an explanation for it TWELVE YEARS LATER probably suggests that it --the story point-- you know, worked.

 

[doubleohfive]

That hating is simply boring and repetitive.

If it's so boring, why do you consistently read and reply to it?

Well, it's certainly not because being right is thankless, that's for damn sure.