The narrative of fans being the only thing that saved Star Trek with the power of their love is just that, a narrative.
How Paramount should handle Star Trek now that Star Wars is BACK!
- Thread starter Dales
- Start date
That's quiet the impressive non-sequitur you've got there.
And my 'position' is that Trek does 'better' when a lot of people 'like' it. When only the 'send suggestions to CBS' fans are being catered to, it's traditionally resulted in a rather large hiatus and much internet (and print) angsting.
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The groundbreaking "Heir to the Empire" novel by Timothy Zahn ushered in a wave of "Expanded Universe" (or licensed derivative novels) books that has lasted for more than 20 years. It wouldn't be appropriate to call those novels "fan fiction" as they were produced professionally. Some books are better than others, some authors are better than others, but every single one was approved and vetted by the license holders. Same for the movies. The very nature of the production - approved and financed by the IP rights holder - makes it not a fan production.JWPlat said:
I mostly agree with Karzak, i was watching a ST fan film the other day, and I just couldn't finish. The production values were amazing, but something about the way it was done just...didn't work.
When those IP holders are not the original authors, or sometimes direct descendants (e.g., Tolkien), those IP holders are fans - if we're lucky - licensing to other fans.
I'm not making this argument to demean good people writing good entertainment. I'm making it with some sarcasm to demean Karzak's demeaning statement about fans. Some fans are more talented than other fans. I'm pointing out you can't generalize like that even when it is qualified with "most."
I'm not making this argument to demean good people writing good entertainment. I'm making it with some sarcasm to demean Karzak's demeaning statement about fans. Some fans are more talented than other fans. I'm pointing out you can't generalize like that even when it is qualified with "most."
And yet... not every fan is as talented as you seem to believe. Yes, some are really good at what they do. But the majority are amateurs with no interest in learning or doing any better than just word-vomiting on a page or sloppily splicing together some footage in iMovie. If these precious little snowflake fans were half as talented as you believe, they'd understand that.
What you consider "demeaning" is just me stating the facts, if bluntly so.
Nope. It doesn't work that way. Any licensed derivative; by it's very nature as a professional production, is not a work of "fandom", regardless of how fannish they are of that genre in their personal life.
Of course, some licensed works come out awful (cf: Star Wars Prequel Trilogy), and some fan productions come out very well. But mostly its the other way around.
Professionals are fans that get paid. Sometimes they're not even fans. Getting paid does not magically imbue a work with talent. Obviously, I don't consider fans and professionals on any different level at all because we are all human. It's about talent and available resources or tools. Everyone but the original artist is producing derivative works as fans (or opportunists).
But getting paid usually means you have a track record of good stuff.
If you do something for free, and you don't have a choice in the matter, there's a reason for that.
I respectfully disagree. Prelude to Axanar might be pretty to look at, but is all sizzle and no substance. I freely admit that I'm in the vocal minority on this, and I also acknowledge that I'm only going by the "Prelude" and other, single scene the production has released, but they have a long, long way to go to impress me.
I whole heartedly agree that Interstellar was more Star Trek than trek these days. I said so while watching the film. In fact, it's almost easy to imagine zefram cochrane and his little village just over the hill during the beginning of the film.
In terms of fan/professional issues....the most successful return to form for a sf show in recent years is Doctor Who. And that is most definitely being made by fans while being a professional production.
In terms of fan/professional issues....the most successful return to form for a sf show in recent years is Doctor Who. And that is most definitely being made by fans while being a professional production.
Not exactly. Take STNV, James Cawley has a small team of fellow actors, set builders and production crew; all making next to nothing (or volunteering) on the production. Let's say that total budget per episode is around $25,000. This means that they can't really hire top talent; relying on amateurs and occasionally professionals, some of whom are OK and some who are really good. You end up with a series of episodes fanfilms, some good, some not - but when you watch it, you can tell its not the real mcoy.
Now lets look at Enterprise; with a budget of lets say $5 million per episode; this covers:
Pre/Production: filming, actors, crew, set construction, equipment, post production: editing, special effects, models, scoring, looping, sound effects, etc.
Then you have a studio person whose sole job is too make sure the episode is polished before release.
Now Scott Bakula could be the biggest trekkie ever, or he could loathe the show, and IT DOES NOT MATTER for two reasons: 1. it's his job. He's being paid to act a part, and (hopefully) he would act to the best of his ability. An amateur simply doesn't have the training, or time, to do this level of work. (some actors are awful and still being paid loads of money. such is life).
What it boils down to is that (usually) the rights holder, whether or not its the original creator, has the resources to make a more polished product. By definition a fan film is an unlicensed production (except where covered by Fair Use terms by a professional) and no matter how fannish the producers are of a derivative work, if it's licensed it ain't a fanfilm.
It's being made by the BBC, who created Doctor Who in the first place. Unlike Star Trek, which started as the brainchild of one person and developed by a crew, Doctor Who was created as more of a group effort, although there were a few individuals who were responsible for key aspects of the show to develop.
They just should try to make a good Star Trek tv show.
The new Trek film franchise has stood up just fine on its own.
If anything, the resurgence of Star Wars has been a result of the success of Star Trek. SW literally hired away the guy to reiignite their franchise who had just reinvented the ST franchise.
Star Trek on the big screen should continue with its swashbuckling adventures....but it should also blend in more exploration and actual SPACE opera in this space opera. The adventure aspect is great. More of it should be "out there."
If that's not possible, hopefully we'll get it in the new upcoming TV series.
Yeah, Trek is strong enough now to go home to the small screen. Regardless of what SW does, ST will be judged on its own merits. Always been the case.
If anything, the resurgence of Star Wars has been a result of the success of Star Trek. SW literally hired away the guy to reiignite their franchise who had just reinvented the ST franchise.
Star Trek on the big screen should continue with its swashbuckling adventures....but it should also blend in more exploration and actual SPACE opera in this space opera. The adventure aspect is great. More of it should be "out there."
If that's not possible, hopefully we'll get it in the new upcoming TV series.
Yeah, Trek is strong enough now to go home to the small screen. Regardless of what SW does, ST will be judged on its own merits. Always been the case.
No.
The fan mentality is, uh, "special" - which is why superfans are forever railing at writers, directors, designers etc. for doing what creative people actually do, part of which is to add to and transform the source material they work with.
