So now that Spock Prime is pretty much stranded in the alternate reality for the remainder of his life, just how much of his knowledge of future events will he reveal, if any? Would he tell people about Khan, the Borg, the Dominion, etc, so that they are better prepared to deal with these threats when they arise? Would he upgrade their technology to the level of his own time (although it appears this has already happened to some extent)? Or would he be tight-lipped about what he knows, only assisting in small ways without letting too much slip?
How much will Spock Prime tell Starfleet?
- Thread starter EJA
- Start date
More then likely, he won't say a thing. What I want to know is if he'll tell people who he really is, or make up a new identity.
Vulcan Elder: "Who are you?"
Spock: "I am Spock, son of Sarek. Yes I know I look really old and you think I'm on the Enterprise, but I'm really from the future. Oh and an alternate reality."
Would they put him in the Vulcan loony bin? Would they believe him as Nu Kirk and Nu Spock did? Would Spock Prime hang out with Sarek? These are the questions left to the novels I suppose.
Vulcan Elder: "Who are you?"
Spock: "I am Spock, son of Sarek. Yes I know I look really old and you think I'm on the Enterprise, but I'm really from the future. Oh and an alternate reality."
Would they put him in the Vulcan loony bin? Would they believe him as Nu Kirk and Nu Spock did? Would Spock Prime hang out with Sarek? These are the questions left to the novels I suppose.
Be a bit hard for what's left of the Vulcan Science Academy to deny the possibility of time travel after what happened. 
I can imagine that he may report all that he knows, but Starfleet will probably classify a lot of it. May even lead to the earlier formation of the Temporal Authority, or whatever that department is called.
I can imagine that he may report all that he knows, but Starfleet will probably classify a lot of it. May even lead to the earlier formation of the Temporal Authority, or whatever that department is called.
This is a very good question, and one that would be ideally suited for inclusion into the next movie because of the moral dilemma it presents. Since there is no real timeline to follow anymore because it is an alternate reality, Spock would be in a great position to advise Starfleet and UFP of the dangers that lurk out there. That would have the benefit of saving countless millions of lives - even something as simple as the parasites that infect Deneva. The problem with that, of course, is that if everyone is aware of all the problems out there (I'm talking Romulans, Klingons, Khan, cloaking devices, etc.), it makes for boring story telling.
Think about it. "Okay fellas, we need to timetravel back to earth and swipe a couple of humpbacks - check. Khan is here - don't put him in detention on Ceti Alpha V - check. There's a doomsday machine right over there. Empty a starship and chuck it down it's throat - check. You get my point.
The entire debate for this thread should be very interesting.
Think about it. "Okay fellas, we need to timetravel back to earth and swipe a couple of humpbacks - check. Khan is here - don't put him in detention on Ceti Alpha V - check. There's a doomsday machine right over there. Empty a starship and chuck it down it's throat - check. You get my point.
The entire debate for this thread should be very interesting.
Maybe the next movie should start with a scene showing the Enterprise completing one of these 'preemptive cleanup' tasks, just as a hint to what they're doing, and maybe having Spock and Kirk talk about how the information from the future Spock-Prime has given them only gives them an edge in certain ways (maybe Spock reminding Kirk about the Butterfly effect the events of the previous movie would most likely have).
Hell, maybe the next movie could have them trying to deal with something pre-emptively, but fuck it up in a way that couldn't have been predicted.
Hell, maybe the next movie could have them trying to deal with something pre-emptively, but fuck it up in a way that couldn't have been predicted.
Maybe the next movie should start with Spock Prime on his deathbed. He wants to say something important, to warn them about impending events, but dies (for real, this time) before Sarek or young Spock can mind-meld with him. Problem solved.
I don't think Spock Prime would "spill the beans" about events which may or may not happen in the new timeline. Things are already screwed up enough.
I don't think Spock Prime would "spill the beans" about events which may or may not happen in the new timeline. Things are already screwed up enough.
From what I've heard, it sounds to me as though Greg Cox's forthcoming novel may well deal with some of the issues of Spock's knowledge of future events. But yeah, the whole idea of having a future Spock around is a bit of a two-edged sword really: It's nice to have a link to the original continuity, but then all the characters would know in advance what's coming, so there's no sense of excitement or the unknown, which is why I think Spock Prime should be VERY conservative about what he says. But then he'd have to face a lot of people being pissed at him for not sharing his knowledge when the disasters start happening.
Last edited:
I don't see it.
I'm a fan of old Spock mostly keeping his mouth shut but even if he spills out everything, it's a big galaxy and many many unknowns are out there.
Turn left instead of right to avoid the Doomsday Machine and walk right into the Whatever Device you wouldn't have otherwise found.
As I see it, Spock warning the Federation of certain events only creates another uncertain future where different events will occur, just as important, intriguing & potentially dangerous.
Nothing more, nothing less.
But the scope of known space in the TOS timeframe is limited; if the Enterprise crew of the new universe did avoid the Doomsday Machine and encountered this other threat, the problem is still there, as it would still have been encountered in the original timeline, and Spock Prime would still know about it. For example, say the next movie opens with an extradimensional rift opening up in Federation space and releasing a horde of vicious monsters into the galaxy, the Feds could simply go to Spock Prime and ask him how to defeat them, as he's obviously from the future and would know what steps to take, and the crisis would be solved. Also, the USS Enterprise's mission to "seek out new life and new civilization" and "boldly go where no one has gone before" would be unneccessary, as Spock Prime would be able to tell them exactly what was out there.
That is, IF he decides to tell them anything.
But you make Spock sound as some kind of all knowing entity.
Just because Spock is from the future, it does not mean he knows every detail, every mission, every action taken and every threat that was encountered by every starship out there during his lifetime in the Prime Universe.
I also do not believe that for many situations things are really as straightforward as : Problem emerges ---> Spock gives solution based on future knowledge ---> Starfleet applies solution --->Problem solved.
Sure for some situations it could be but very often even the best and smartest battle plan does not survive contact with the enemy.
It often took many steps and events in certain sequences to occur for situations to be resolved happily. Who is to say trying to apply the final solution from the start will succeed and not cause unforeseeable problems ?
And in the end, who is Spock to start playing god with the galaxy ?
Saving for example the new universe Romulans from annihilation by the Hobus supernova might seem like a good thing and a great diplomatic move. Billions are saved.
Only to have Romulans decades later maybe start another war with the Feds, killing millions that would have lived otherwise if nature had done its job.
As for the to "seek out new life and new civilization" and "boldly go where no one has gone before" mission, it is hardly unnecessary.
How much knowledge does Spock really have about everything ?
Knowing about the Gorn and where they are or knowing a summary of their history is nothing compared to having to go out there and meet them and interact with them.
So they have spoilers and some knowledge on paper and in a computer.
They still have to boldly go and it is where noone has gone before.
We do know what is in Saturn or Jupiter.
Would it make it any less an achievement, any less magnificent or wondrous to go there ourselves for the first time ?
Not in my opinion.
He should at least warn them about V'ger and tell them to find some humpback whales.
I would think that Spock would follow the Temporal Prime Directive, and basically not say anything.
I hope he spills the beans on everything, that way those issues become less important since they can be dealt with early thus freeing up stories which go somewhere we haven't been before.
Either way, how those Prime Universes issues are handled should be reserved for telling in novels or comics, not by using up precious screen time.
Either way, how those Prime Universes issues are handled should be reserved for telling in novels or comics, not by using up precious screen time.
Old Spock has a philosophical streak that simply goes beyond logic.
I suspect he would take a leap of faith and not simply reveal everything he's seen.
In Star Trek VI, he told Valeris that she should have faith that the universe will unfold as it should.
He also realizes that he is in an Alternate Reality, so his knowledge of future events may not necessarily always apply.
I don't think, in light of the Alternate Reality, the Temporal Prime Directive would be an issue, since for him, the future is still unknown, even with the clues from the Prime reality future.
I suspect he would take a leap of faith and not simply reveal everything he's seen.
In Star Trek VI, he told Valeris that she should have faith that the universe will unfold as it should.
He also realizes that he is in an Alternate Reality, so his knowledge of future events may not necessarily always apply.
I don't think, in light of the Alternate Reality, the Temporal Prime Directive would be an issue, since for him, the future is still unknown, even with the clues from the Prime reality future.
Maybe he told all, of the prime universe at least, to Kirk in the cave, kind of like a katra transfer, but more of a piggy-backing message, a warning of sorts.
Think about it though, the amount of info he couldve poured into Kirks minds subconcious regarding certain events that HAVE to happen.
Granted its all been altered to an extent, but certain things may still have to happen regarding fate/destiny that is hinted at in the movie so often, is staggering. Even without knowing it, Kirk will make certain decisions based on certain feelings/suggestions inserted into his mind by Spock such as people to be wary of (Mudd, Khan, Sybok, Chang, Kor and Kang etc etc) and events to be cautious of (again Khans 'ship-jacking', the whale probe, guardian of forever etc etc) that will most probably happen just in a different context, in which case, Kirks so called 'Hunch's' will actaully be influenced by Spock uploading the prime univereses experiences on a sub-consious level.
Maybe that could be the bigger reason Kirks eyes are tearful becaue of all of Spocks experiences from the Pike missions in the prime timeline to the ambasador role on Romulus.
Yeah, 99.999% of decisions will be made by Kirk alone, but that underlying .001% of feeling will be there, even though he doesnt know it, perhaps. Its theasable at least.
It may even be a way to get Shatner in on the game, as much as im against the idea, but still, if Shatner was digitised to a certain degree to how he appeared in TUC/GEN with some audio samples of log entrys from TOS and the addition of CG'd missions of the Enterprise etc, its possible, but its a damn stupid idea.
Cant even believe i thought of that Digitised Shatner bit.
Think about it though, the amount of info he couldve poured into Kirks minds subconcious regarding certain events that HAVE to happen.
Granted its all been altered to an extent, but certain things may still have to happen regarding fate/destiny that is hinted at in the movie so often, is staggering. Even without knowing it, Kirk will make certain decisions based on certain feelings/suggestions inserted into his mind by Spock such as people to be wary of (Mudd, Khan, Sybok, Chang, Kor and Kang etc etc) and events to be cautious of (again Khans 'ship-jacking', the whale probe, guardian of forever etc etc) that will most probably happen just in a different context, in which case, Kirks so called 'Hunch's' will actaully be influenced by Spock uploading the prime univereses experiences on a sub-consious level.
Maybe that could be the bigger reason Kirks eyes are tearful becaue of all of Spocks experiences from the Pike missions in the prime timeline to the ambasador role on Romulus.
Yeah, 99.999% of decisions will be made by Kirk alone, but that underlying .001% of feeling will be there, even though he doesnt know it, perhaps. Its theasable at least.
It may even be a way to get Shatner in on the game, as much as im against the idea, but still, if Shatner was digitised to a certain degree to how he appeared in TUC/GEN with some audio samples of log entrys from TOS and the addition of CG'd missions of the Enterprise etc, its possible, but its a damn stupid idea.
Cant even believe i thought of that Digitised Shatner bit.
He will tell them everything at which point they'll lock him away as some fruity old Vulcan who has lost his marbles. Mayhem will follow.
Similar threads
