How is it legal for Star Trek fanzines to be sold on Amazon and eBay?

[Christopher]

Re: How is it legal for Star Trek fanzines to be sold on Amazon and eB

I heard once that Roddenberry asked Paramount to go easy on fanfic authors, as long as they didn't try to profit or compete directly. I suppose Paramount/CBS has a history of looking the other way, recognizing that fan productions help keep the audience invested in the franchise.

As for the DVDs of fan films, I don't know how much they charge, but could it be that they're just charging enough to recoup the manufacture and shipping costs?

 

[Therin of Andor]

Re: How is it legal for Star Trek fanzines to be sold on Amazon and eB

I think some of them, like Of Gods and Men, even sell DVDs so their not all non-profit. I can't believe that Paramount isn't aware of them.

Paramount and CBS are very aware of fanfilms and the fans work to a rather tight set of parameters to stay... legal (or at least under the radar). "Of Gods and Men" compensated their celeb cast with $$$, AFAIK, so it would not be hard to prove no profits were made - and the DVD actually comes free when you buy an autographed photo of the fanfilm's main cast. The first "Starship Exeter" sent out a free "Making of..." DVD to $$$ supporters of their second episode (and the "Making off..." case came with an unannounced bonus second disc containing the first episode on DVD.)

One of Phase II's announcements, that they would film "He Walked Among Us" - an unfilmed TOS script (that was originally written with Milton Berle as the guest) by Norman Spinrad - had CBS very swiftly nix that one before preproduction began, as this script is wholly owned by "Star Trek" - and Paramount/CBS deserves the chance to one day pick up where TOS left off. (The author even released the script as a promotional eBook for a time.)

http://www.trekmovie.com/2012/03/28...-script-will-film-new-gerrold-script-instead/

http://www.giantfreakinrobot.com/scifi/jj-abrams-cbs-send-lawyers-shut-star-trek-fan-films.html

I heard once that Roddenberry asked Paramount to go easy on fanfic authors, as long as they didn't try to profit or compete directly.

Definitely! He convinced Paramount that the fannish activities had kept alive the interest in Trek throughout the 70s and boosted the numbers of prime time TV Trek reruns. Paramount always acknowledges the existence of fanzines in the media release packs of each ST movie.

 

[Idran]

Re: How is it legal for Star Trek fanzines to be sold on Amazon and eB

I think some of them, like Of Gods and Men, even sell DVDs so their not all non-profit. I can't believe that Paramount isn't aware of them.

Paramount and CBS are very aware of fanfilms and the fans work to a rather tight set of parameters to stay legal.

Stay inoffensive more than stay legal, I'd say. Despite the efforts of organizations like the OTW, the legal status of fanworks (even those completely non-profit) and whether they qualify as derivative or transformative works is still in question in the US. As far as I'm aware, at least. (Though if it wasn't in question, I'd wonder why the OTW exists.)

 

[TheAlmanac]

Re: How is it legal for Star Trek fanzines to be sold on Amazon and eB

I think some of them, like Of Gods and Men, even sell DVDs so their not all non-profit. I can't believe that Paramount isn't aware of them.

Paramount and CBS are very aware of fanfilms and the fans work to a rather tight set of parameters to stay legal.

Stay inoffensive more than stay legal, I'd say. Despite the efforts of organizations like the OTW, the legal status of fanworks (even those completely non-profit) and whether they qualify as derivative or transformative works is still in question in the US. As far as I'm aware, at least. (Though if it wasn't in question, I'd wonder why the OTW exists.)

I tend to think that everyone who has an opinion is secretly content to continue the unspoken stalemate on this issue, as both sides would have a lot to lose (relative to the status quo now) if a court case ruled against them.

IMO, if the OTW were as invested in pushing their interpretation of US copyright law as they claim, they would've launched a test case that was on-point with an original fan film or written fanfic--rather than concentrating mostly on vidding (per the examples in your link), where it's much easier (also IMO) to make a fair use argument when it comes to sampling video material from copyrighted works.

 

[Idran]

Re: How is it legal for Star Trek fanzines to be sold on Amazon and eB

Paramount and CBS are very aware of fanfilms and the fans work to a rather tight set of parameters to stay legal.

Stay inoffensive more than stay legal, I'd say. Despite the efforts of organizations like the OTW, the legal status of fanworks (even those completely non-profit) and whether they qualify as derivative or transformative works is still in question in the US. As far as I'm aware, at least. (Though if it wasn't in question, I'd wonder why the OTW exists.)

I tend to think that everyone who has an opinion is secretly content to continue the unspoken stalemate on this issue, as both sides would have a lot to lose (relative to the status quo now) if a court case ruled against them.

IMO, if the OTW were as invested in pushing their interpretation of US copyright law as they claim, they would've launched a test case that was on-point with an original fan film or written fanfic--rather than concentrating mostly on vidding (per the examples in your link), where it's much easier (also IMO) to make a fair use argument when it comes to sampling video material from copyrighted works.

Has there been a significant-enough incident that could have lead to such a test-case, though? I can't think of any major fandom projects or fanworks that have been shut down through C&Ds any time recently; biggest I can think of are relatively minor indie fan games that wouldn't have had a significant enough footprint to invest a major legal battle into, things like Chrono Trigger: Crimson Echoes.

 

[Therin of Andor]

Re: How is it legal for Star Trek fanzines to be sold on Amazon and eB

Has there been a significant-enough incident that could have lead to such a test-case, though? I can't think of any major fandom projects or fanworks that have been shut down through C&Ds any time recently...

As mentioned above, one of Phase II's announcements, "He Walked Among Us", was nixed by CBS at preproduction stage in 2012. Had Phase II continued, it would certainly have gotten icky.

 

[Idran]

Re: How is it legal for Star Trek fanzines to be sold on Amazon and eB

Has there been a significant-enough incident that could have lead to such a test-case, though? I can't think of any major fandom projects or fanworks that have been shut down through C&Ds any time recently...

As mentioned above, one of Phase II's announcements, "He Walked Among Us", was nixed by CBS at preproduction stage in 2012. Had Phase II continued, it would certainly have gotten icky.

Oh wow, somehow I completely missed that part of your post. Haha, sorry about that, Therin; completely my bad there.

Yeah, that certainly conceivably could have served as a test case. Though there would probably be an aspect of what TheAlmanac said; even if they had been approached by a group like OTW, they probably would have been reticent to go to court over it in the event that they would lose and fanwork would be definitively declared in US case law as a derivative work. It's one thing to work on things that might be illegal, and another to work on things that are.

 

[Phantom]

Re: How is it legal for Star Trek fanzines to be sold on Amazon and eB

The resale of fanzines I would assume would be covered under the "first sale" doctrine. Once a copy of an IP (and the fanzine itself is the IP of the fanzine author/producer) is sold, the subsequent owner of that individual copy is free to dispose of it as he/she chooses.

SCOTUS just upheld "first sale" in 2013 in an important case.

http://arstechnica.com/tech-policy/2013/03/thai-student-protected-by-first-sale-supreme-court-rules/

I don't think that ruling would apply to fanzines since they are not "lawfully made".

They would fall under "fair use" and as "derivative works". Now if they were republishing novels or something that would be infringing.

 

[Therin of Andor]

Re: How is it legal for Star Trek fanzines to be sold on Amazon and eB

Now if they were republishing novels or something that would be infringing.

Yep. About six months ago, I reported to Simon & Schuster a fan-run blog that was proudly republishing entire Pocket "Star Trek" novels as blog entries, in order of original publication. They were up to #8 and it only took about two weeks before S&S contacted me, with a form letter thank you (for each violation I'd reported). And the site was gone!

 

[Idran]

Re: How is it legal for Star Trek fanzines to be sold on Amazon and eB

They would fall under "fair use" and as "derivative works".

Just being a derivative work isn't enough; if something is simply a derivative work then it's not fair use, as only the original rights holder can authorize the production of derivative works:

Subject to sections 107 through 122, the owner of copyright under this title has the exclusive rights to do and to authorize any of the following:

...
(2) to prepare derivative works based upon the copyrighted work;
...
​

The still-open legal question is if a fandom creation is specifically a transformative work, which does fall under fair use.

 

[Allyn Gibson]

Re: How is it legal for Star Trek fanzines to be sold on Amazon and eB

IMO, if the OTW were as invested in pushing their interpretation of US copyright law as they claim, they would've launched a test case that was on-point with an original fan film or written fanfic--rather than concentrating mostly on vidding (per the examples in your link), where it's much easier (also IMO) to make a fair use argument when it comes to sampling video material from copyrighted works.

Has there been a significant-enough incident that could have lead to such a test-case, though? I can't think of any major fandom projects or fanworks that have been shut down through C&Ds any time recently; biggest I can think of are relatively minor indie fan games that wouldn't have had a significant enough footprint to invest a major legal battle into, things like Chrono Trigger: Crimson Echoes.

An Alien fanfilm, Alien: Identity was served with a C&D last week.

 

[hbquikcomjamesl]

Re: How is it legal for Star Trek fanzines to be sold on Amazon and eB

The basic situation (at least in my understanding, and I don't even play a lawyer on television) is that so long as the fanzine creator isn't either deriving profit from the original sale of an unauthorized, unlicensed 'zine, or interfering with Paramount's ability to derive profit as the owner of the various Star Trek copyrights and trademarks (i.e., so long as they're not violating the SPIRIT of the relevant intellectual property laws), Paramount tolerates them, probably because they eventually realized that Roddenberry was right, it WAS and STILL IS in their best interest to tolerate 'zines and other fan fiction.

I wrote a couple of fanfic pieces myself, in the course of four semesters of Short Story Workshop at a local junior college. One was an alternate Borg-origin story; the other was a Captain Sulu era return to M113. Which is an anomaly in itself: I loathe both the Salt Vampire (for many years, I could not bring myself to even watch MT) and the Borg (or at least, the endless parade of Borg stories). I think one of them ended up in the class anthology for the semester in which I wrote it.

Copyright ownership, and patent ownership, for that matter (unlike trademark ownership) does not carry a burden to either enforce it or lose it. The owner is entirely free to choose whether or not to enforce a copyright or patent, on a case-by-case basis. (I recall a commercial from years ago, from a German automaker that held a number of patents on safety features, but made the point of having never enforced those patents, because some things are too valuable not to share.) The whole point of CC, GPL, and other "copyleft" licenses is that the author of a piece who releases it under one of those licenses is, in effect, retaining copyright ownership, while irrevocably (but conditionally) licensing it to all of humanity.

 

[TheAlmanac]

Re: How is it legal for Star Trek fanzines to be sold on Amazon and eB

IMO, if the OTW were as invested in pushing their interpretation of US copyright law as they claim, they would've launched a test case that was on-point with an original fan film or written fanfic--rather than concentrating mostly on vidding (per the examples in your link), where it's much easier (also IMO) to make a fair use argument when it comes to sampling video material from copyrighted works.

Has there been a significant-enough incident that could have lead to such a test-case, though? I can't think of any major fandom projects or fanworks that have been shut down through C&Ds any time recently; biggest I can think of are relatively minor indie fan games that wouldn't have had a significant enough footprint to invest a major legal battle into, things like Chrono Trigger: Crimson Echoes.

An Alien fanfilm, Alien: Identity was served with a C&D last week.

There you go! That would be a great cause for the OTW to champion, in light of their legal stance.

Having said that, there actually doesn't need to be a "significant incident" for the OTW to proceed with a test case, as they themselves pointed out in a case where a playwright sought a declaratory judgement that 3C, a satire of Three's Company in the style of Anton Chekhov (no, I don't see the appeal, either) did not infringe on the sitcom.

Those affiliated with the OTW seemed really excited about that ruling, but the play changes all of the characters' names along with other details, and the ruling explicitly mentions that changing a character's sexual orientation doesn't automatically make a work transformative--which you'd think would be taken as bad news by any slashfic writers out there hoping to rely on a "transformative works" defence.

 

[Phantom]

Re: How is it legal for Star Trek fanzines to be sold on Amazon and eB

They would fall under "fair use" and as "derivative works".

Just being a derivative work isn't enough; if something is simply a derivative work then it's not fair use, as only the original rights holder can authorize the production of derivative works:

Subject to sections 107 through 122, the owner of copyright under this title has the exclusive rights to do and to authorize any of the following:

...
(2) to prepare derivative works based upon the copyrighted work;
...
​

The still-open legal question is if a fandom creation is specifically a transformative work, which does fall under fair use.

That's a fair point if you are specifically referring to actual fanfictions. Simple fanzines would absolutely fall under "fair use" as "discussion, education, and critique".

 

[Idran]

Re: How is it legal for Star Trek fanzines to be sold on Amazon and eB

That's a fair point if you are specifically referring to actual fanfictions. Simple fanzines would absolutely fall under "fair use" as "discussion, education, and critique".

Oh no that wasn't my point. My point was that you said it would fall under derivative work as something that would make it fine, but if it was a derivative work it wouldn't be fine. You don't want it to be a derivative work. Fair use yes, derivative work no, and if it falls under fair use then by definition it isn't a derivative work. I was just correcting the use of terminology because that phrase means something specific legally, it doesn't just mean derived from another work.

 

[Phantom]

Re: How is it legal for Star Trek fanzines to be sold on Amazon and eB

Fair enough.

 

[Therin of Andor]

Re: How is it legal for Star Trek fanzines to be sold on Amazon and eB

That's a fair point if you are specifically referring to actual fanfictions. Simple fanzines would absolutely fall under "fair use" as "discussion, education, and critique".

A good set of examples of staying-between-the-rules re Star Trek in book form would be "The Best of Trek" paperbacks by Signet.

* They used only the word "Trek", not "Star Trek" in the title.

* Cover art featured vaguely familiar starship shapes.

* Most items were reprints of previous fanzine contributions.

* Contents included letters of comment and critique, tech and history speculations, character discussions, etc, but the only fiction genre included was parody.

 

[JD]

Re: How is it legal for Star Trek fanzines to be sold on Amazon and eB

I was thinking about this more, and I think IP owners taking legal actions against fan fics/films is kind of a bad idea, unless it somehow threatens the viability of later official products. By taking legal action against fans, you take a pretty big risk of alienating those fans, especially if it's something high profile like that Alien fan film was going to be. Fans are the most important part of a big franchise, and by alienating them all they would do is hurt themselves. Fan fic and fan films are just a way for artistic fans to show their love for a franchise, and I don't really see the harm in it.

 

[Idran]

Re: How is it legal for Star Trek fanzines to be sold on Amazon and eB

If you want a good example of that, there was TSR in the 90s. They went on a tear sending out C&Ds to basically every D&D fansite, and it really turned a huge portion of the community against them. The C&Ds stopped once Wizards of the Coast acquired them, and the rift healed pretty quick after, thankfully. (They even went so far as to give certain fansites "official" status and permission to release 3e material in some of the less prominent settings as a gesture of apology, a status that still persists today: Dark Sun, Spelljammer, and Planescape still have "official" fansites that have full permission to use Product Identity in any of their 3e setting fanworks.)

 

[Therin of Andor]

Re: How is it legal for Star Trek fanzines to be sold on Amazon and eB

Fan fic and fan films are just a way for artistic fans to show their love for a franchise, and I don't really see the harm in it.

Sadly, some fanfic writers try to show their love for a series by making their story resemble, almost exactly, a licensed, official paperback - and sell them online, or even in stores or on hucksters' tables at conventions. That runs the risk of another fan buying the item, thinking they are getting actual licensed, official product, and refusing to buy more (official) stuff because the faux product was inferior, or too far removed from what made the series special.

Similarly, with bootleg toys: eg. Batman and Spider-man action figures in the same packet, with swapped accessories. And arms that fall off easily.

The licensees don't want inferior competitors on the market, and the studio doesn't want fans mistaking faux product (that is not vetted by the studio) for the real thing.

In those cases C&D orders are essential.

I was in a bookshop in London the other day and saw The Unauthorised Guide to Star Trek Voyager. Picked it up to a flick through only to see it had been composed from "high quality Wikipedia articles". I knew such things existed on Amazon but didn't realise bookshops were selling them
Seems an easy way for the "author" to make money.

A few shops have found entries for the Wiki-reprint manuals and ordered them accidentally.

Ditto, a few official Pocket novels on an official print-on-demand service. The books are larger than MMPB, but the internal content looks like margins are set for MMPB, not trade. The shops hate getting caught with those, too.