How Do You Define Success In Life?

[Mr. Laser Beam]

this one guy got polo. Then he was President.

At least it wasn't water polo. That's very cruel to the horses.

 

[Use of Time]

If I were to hypothetically consider being healthy as a major factor in being successful then what do I care if luck has something to do with that. I don't think the thread is limited to defining success as something that is personally earned. I'll take any break that life wants to toss my way.

 

[CorporalClegg]

Sigh.

I think I need to go back to typing school.

 

[thestrangequark]

It's far more luck than anything else.

Is the term fundamental attribution bias? I can't remember, it's something like that -- the tendency we have to overestimate the role our behavior plays in a situation and underestimate external factors. You can run all the marathons you like and micromanage every fucking nutrient that enters your body, but if you come across the wrong pathogen, or have a gene that's just a little wonky, you're fucked.

ETA: Fundamental Attribution Error -- I was close!

I agree with you, but if you get hit with a pathogen or develop cancer and you've let yourself fall into a state of lifestyle induced ill health dealing with disease will be a lot harder on you. And that just plain applies to age as well.

If you say, "I've got my health" that's luck.

If you say, "I've worked to maintain and achieve this level of physical well being" that's success.

I do agree with that, sort of. However the converse is that if one starts qualifying health in terms of success, then when things don't go so well, one feels a failure. I guess my particular disease is just exceptionally apt for illustrating how little control we actually have over our bodies, which made the inaccuracy of that statement stand out especially. I can do absolutely everything perfectly: dose exactly right at the exact right time, eat exactly the right amount of exactly the right foods, cover exactly for whatever physical activity I'm doing, and still some other confounding factor will come in and fuck up my blood sugar. It's not a reason not to keep working at it, but it's a very good argument against seeing health as something at which one can be successful. We may be successful at certain behaviors which can promote good health, but that's not the same thing as being healthy.

 

[thestrangequark]

Probably your use of the 'f' word.

Clearly I don't swear nearly enough on this board if people think my using fuck implies offense! If I'm offended I will say so. If I use 'fuck' it's because I've had a mouth like a sailor since I was 6 years old.

You should swear more. It's rather fetching.

Fuck off, bitch.

 

[Use of Time]

I think the only issue here is people are confusing happiness and success. I think TSQ says it pretty well here that health would be more appropriately equated to happiness than success considering the lack of control we have over our own bodies.

 

[thestrangequark]

If I were to hypothetically consider being healthy as a major factor in being successful then what do I care if luck has something to do with that. I don't think the thread is limited to defining success as something that is personally earned. I'll take any break that life wants to toss my way.

It must feel great to take the credit for everything good that happens to you! Slightly deluded, but fantastic fun!

 

[Use of Time]

It sure is!

 

[CorporalClegg]

Fuck off, bitch.

May I quote you in my sig?

 

[TEACAKE'S PLEATHER DOME]

It's far more luck than anything else.

Is the term fundamental attribution bias? I can't remember, it's something like that -- the tendency we have to overestimate the role our behavior plays in a situation and underestimate external factors. You can run all the marathons you like and micromanage every fucking nutrient that enters your body, but if you come across the wrong pathogen, or have a gene that's just a little wonky, you're fucked.

ETA: Fundamental Attribution Error -- I was close!

I agree with you, but if you get hit with a pathogen or develop cancer and you've let yourself fall into a state of lifestyle induced ill health dealing with disease will be a lot harder on you. And that just plain applies to age as well.

If you say, "I've got my health" that's luck.

If you say, "I've worked to maintain and achieve this level of physical well being" that's success.

I do agree with that, sort of. However the converse is that if one starts qualifying health in terms of success, then when things don't go so well, one feels a failure.

You're right, it would be easy for someone to feel a failure because of the way society frames it. However I would saya person's success at health is a daily thing, you might have something go wrong but if you're not actively contributing to ill health by your lifestyle you are still being successful in how you take care of your own body.

I can do absolutely everything perfectly: dose exactly right at the exact right time, eat exactly the right amount of exactly the right foods, cover exactly for whatever physical activity I'm doing, and still some other confounding factor will come in and fuck up my blood sugar. It's not a reason not to keep working at it, but it's a very good argument against seeing health as something at which one can be successful. We may be successful at certain behaviors which can promote good health, but that's not the same thing as being healthy.

But even if your body fucks up you are still successful in not having contributed to that and to other unseen things. Like your arteries, you said you are quite athletic and your arteries as you age will benefit from your success at maintaining your health via exercise.

But generally, yeah, bad choice of words because that's all rather too much parsing and the message people get is they have failed if something goes wrong.

 

[TEACAKE'S PLEATHER DOME]

Clearly I don't swear nearly enough on this board if people think my using fuck implies offense! If I'm offended I will say so. If I use 'fuck' it's because I've had a mouth like a sailor since I was 6 years old.

You should swear more. It's rather fetching.

Fuck off, bitch.

You ruined it with the smiley. Fucker.

 

[Mr. Laser Beam]

I must revise my earlier statement. "Success in life" equals "Not ruining threads like I've just done".

 

[TEACAKE'S PLEATHER DOME]

If I were to hypothetically consider being healthy as a major factor in being successful then what do I care if luck has something to do with that. I don't think the thread is limited to defining success as something that is personally earned. I'll take any break that life wants to toss my way.

It must feel great to take the credit for everything good that happens to you! Slightly deluded, but fantastic fun!

Hey at least he didn't say God did it.

 

[Use of Time]

My point is that success and luck don't have to be mutually exclusive. I've already pretty much agreed with your whole premise as far contributing health to success soooo...

 

[thestrangequark]

Fuck off, bitch.

May I quote you in my sig?

If you like, though I'm sure it's not the most original thing that's ever been said!

I agree with you, but if you get hit with a pathogen or develop cancer and you've let yourself fall into a state of lifestyle induced ill health dealing with disease will be a lot harder on you. And that just plain applies to age as well.

If you say, "I've got my health" that's luck.

If you say, "I've worked to maintain and achieve this level of physical well being" that's success.

I do agree with that, sort of. However the converse is that if one starts qualifying health in terms of success, then when things don't go so well, one feels a failure.

You're right, it would be easy for someone to feel a failure because of the way society frames it. However I would saya person's success at health is a daily thing, you might have something go wrong but if you're not actively contributing to ill health by your lifestyle you are still being successful in how you take care of your own body.

I can do absolutely everything perfectly: dose exactly right at the exact right time, eat exactly the right amount of exactly the right foods, cover exactly for whatever physical activity I'm doing, and still some other confounding factor will come in and fuck up my blood sugar. It's not a reason not to keep working at it, but it's a very good argument against seeing health as something at which one can be successful. We may be successful at certain behaviors which can promote good health, but that's not the same thing as being healthy.

But even if your body fucks up you are still successful in not having contributed to that and to other unseen things. Like your arteries, you said you are quite athletic and your arteries as you age will benefit from your success at maintaining your health via exercise.

But generally, yeah, bad choice of words because that's all rather too much parsing and the message people get is they have failed if something goes wrong.

I think it really comes down, again, to the fundamental attribution error, and recognizing the difference between behavior and outcome. I think it's fine to qualify behaviors in terms of success (to a degree), but wrong to qualify outcome in those terms. I will never be successful in perfectly controlling my diabetes, but I can be successful most of the time in doing the behaviors and making the choices that can contribute to better overall management.

To bring it back around to the original topic of having a "successful" life (and I still don't even get what that really means), I think for a lot of people much unhappiness is caused by mistakenly placing value in outcomes and qualifying them in terms of successes and failures. A lot of judgement comes from the same fallacious thinking, too. I can put value only in what I can do and how I react, because in the end I don't really have control over how the cards fall.

 

[thestrangequark]

You should swear more. It's rather fetching.

Fuck off, bitch.

You ruined it with the smiley. Fucker.

I debated the fuck out of whether or not to put that smiley in! It's just hard online, because IRL my cussing is naturally tempered by my rosy complexion, girlish voice, and slight lisp, and with those natural qualities (some of my greatest successes, if I do say so myself), it is hard to gauge the effect size of the different obscenities!

Cunt.

I must revise my earlier statement. "Success in life" equals "Not ruining threads like I've just done".

By deepening the discussion? That's not ruining a thread.

 

[CorporalClegg]

If you like, though I'm sure it's not the most original thing that's ever been said!

Yes. But quoting you directly is sure to raise some eyebrows.

 

[TEACAKE'S PLEATHER DOME]

To bring it back around to the original topic of having a "successful" life (and I still don't even get what that really means), I think for a lot of people much unhappiness is caused by mistakenly placing value in outcomes and qualifying them in terms of successes and failures. A lot of judgement comes from the same fallacious thinking, too. I can put value only in what I can do and how I react, because in the end I don't really have control over how the cards fall.

I've never been very materialistic and I've never bothered much with goals. I've always equated the word 'success' with something other people strive to achieve, something I have neatly stepped around as not being worth bothering with. I've actually been very successful at not bothering with it

(which isn't quite responding to what you've written ..)

 

[TEACAKE'S PLEATHER DOME]

Fuck off, bitch.

You ruined it with the smiley. Fucker.

I debated the fuck out of whether or not to put that smiley in! It's just hard online, because IRL my cussing is naturally tempered by my rosy complexion, girlish voice, and slight lisp, and with those natural qualities (some of my greatest successes, if I do say so myself), it is hard to gauge the effect size of the different obscenities!

Cunt.

The neat thing about the effect size is that it varies from person to person! One cunt will net you everything from meh to notifying the mod. It's a banquet out there (bitch).

 

[Use of Time]

To bring it back around to the original topic of having a "successful" life (and I still don't even get what that really means), I think for a lot of people much unhappiness is caused by mistakenly placing value in outcomes and qualifying them in terms of successes and failures. A lot of judgement comes from the same fallacious thinking, too. I can put value only in what I can do and how I react, because in the end I don't really have control over how the cards fall.

I've never been very materialistic and I've never bothered much with goals. I've always equated the word 'success' with something other people strive to achieve, something I have neatly stepped around as not being worth bothering with. I've actually been very successful at not bothering with it

(which isn't quite responding to what you've written ..)

Couldn't have said it better my self. I don't know if I'm a successful person or not and I wouldn't care to try and establish a metric for that but I do know that I am content right now.