Above the shuttlebay, as seen in "In a Mirror, Darkly" where there are also two phasers.
All the other weapons are from dialogue ("ready phaser 6" or stuff to that effect in background chatter)
how do you account for all of the numerous canon violations in this show?
- Thread starter crashchaos
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All the other weapons are from dialogue ("ready phaser 6" or stuff to that effect in background chatter)
I was surprised to learn that "Vaulting Ambition" supposedly gives some weapons specs on the Defiant, not even "redacted" at that. But didn't I hear them establish just two forward tubes and one aft?
Kirk's ship definitely had more forward tubes, for a total of six at least (possibly but not all that probably including his canonically unmentioned aft ones).
Then again, this is a perfect opportunity to assume that ships around the 1700 registry are of a different variant than ships around the 1760 mark. Many fan works go with two forward tubes, in the top superstructure, because of what Franz Joseph once speculated upon. Now, we know NCC-1764 has at least one forward tube in the usual location at the bottom of the saucer, blasting at opponents in "In a Mirror, Darkly", so she's not of the FJ variant exactly. But we could still go by the "batches with more or less consecutive registry numbers" model here.
Anybody got a good closeup of the Defiant files?
Timo Saloniemi
Kirk's ship definitely had more forward tubes, for a total of six at least (possibly but not all that probably including his canonically unmentioned aft ones).
Then again, this is a perfect opportunity to assume that ships around the 1700 registry are of a different variant than ships around the 1760 mark. Many fan works go with two forward tubes, in the top superstructure, because of what Franz Joseph once speculated upon. Now, we know NCC-1764 has at least one forward tube in the usual location at the bottom of the saucer, blasting at opponents in "In a Mirror, Darkly", so she's not of the FJ variant exactly. But we could still go by the "batches with more or less consecutive registry numbers" model here.
Anybody got a good closeup of the Defiant files?
Timo Saloniemi
King Daniel beat me to it. The TOS model does not really show phasers too well.
No wonder these Mirror Universe people have poor eyesight. Who reads in a font that small??
I do. that way more information fits into the space of those ridiculous small handheld devicesNo wonder these Mirror Universe people have poor eyesight. Who reads in a font that small??
Obviously one shouldn't take text on a padd to be solid canon, it's just visual fluff, but according to the mirror info on the Defiant, the Connie had 2 Forward Torpedo tubes and one aft. It doesn't give the number of phaser arrays.
Rather than deal with numbers and stats you should deal with kind. The Connie and the D7 were considered to be the toughest ships of their time and roughly equivalent to each other. The TMP refit Enterprise and the K'tinga class were improvements on these designs. One set was fast, the other was faster.
If you go by model details, the Enterprise had a couple of surface details (three? five?) that could be considered weapons. The TMP Enterprise had over a dozen! I don't think the TMP E was meant to be THAT much more heavily armed.
If you go by model details, the Enterprise had a couple of surface details (three? five?) that could be considered weapons. The TMP Enterprise had over a dozen! I don't think the TMP E was meant to be THAT much more heavily armed.
And then, of course, we get ENT where we learn that Starfleet early on liked to hide its guns beneath gunports...
I don't think we have anything amounting to a "problem" here. NCC-1701 and NCC-1764 may carry a different number of torpedo tubes as of the late 2260s and still be of the same class and even the same specific subclass, if real naval history is any precedent. Any number of weapon configurations can fit the verbal and visual evidence on NCC-1701, and certainly the text here is in no conflict with the verbal and visual evidence on NCC-1764. And so forth.
Timo Saloniemi
I don't think we have anything amounting to a "problem" here. NCC-1701 and NCC-1764 may carry a different number of torpedo tubes as of the late 2260s and still be of the same class and even the same specific subclass, if real naval history is any precedent. Any number of weapon configurations can fit the verbal and visual evidence on NCC-1701, and certainly the text here is in no conflict with the verbal and visual evidence on NCC-1764. And so forth.
Timo Saloniemi
Were they really? We see the Enterprise effortlessly smash a Klingon battlecruiser a few times when she's fully powered up.
Indeed, those things only dared challenger Kirk solo if they had wily sabotage or other such advantage to their side. Single examples simply fled (although the fleeing ship in "Friday's Child" wasn't originally a D7).
Apparently, the balance was more like 1 Connie to 2 K'Tingas, with three of the latter giving Klingons or Romulans confidence to attack.
Apparently, the balance was more like 1 Connie to 2 K'Tingas, with three of the latter giving Klingons or Romulans confidence to attack.
Go watch ENT - "In a Mirror Darkly II"; as it shows the U.S.S. Defiant's aft torpedo tube in operation and on the TV screen.
I never saw 6 myself, but I did count 3 forward. It could be the Enterprise carried more. As you pointed out, weapon load outs do vary.
The 2 on the PADD is hard to make out. It could be 6.
It says 6 on Memory-Alpha, so that could be it.
I really wish M-A had citations like other Wiki's, I'd like to know which episode the fact was specifically from, not a list of episodes for an entire paragraph of knowledge.
I agree, we do know they have been using MA for research. The TOS ship is super light on detailing.
Journey to Babel:
KIRK: On my order, fire photon torpedoes two, four and six. Widest possible scatter.
That doesn't necessarily mean they're launchers, but it fits with normal navy terminology.
My brain explodes.
Excellent. However, this would not be the first time the script did not fit the model. Six+ 1 Aft is a beast even in TNG era.
In the case of Day of the Dove, there had been internal explosions and the shields were down.
Possibility, the launcher on one side (let's say starboard) fires even numbered torpedoes, while the launcher on other side fires odd numbered ones. Kirk ordered three shots from one tube, for whatever reason.
I find it rather fitting. Archer's ship already had 4 fwd and 2 aft tubes before she got an added capacity for photon warheads and at least one extra aft tube to go with that. In a century, ships would get more heavily armed; in two, the armament itself would change, so that a single bow tube would be more powerful than ten earlier ones.
As for the numbering, "The Changeling" has Kirk first order Sulu to prepare the torpedoes, then fire Torpedo 2. Those really have to be tube numbers, rather than numbers of individual projectiles - firing a single torpedo and not having it be #1 makes no sense.
Timo Saloniemi
As for the numbering, "The Changeling" has Kirk first order Sulu to prepare the torpedoes, then fire Torpedo 2. Those really have to be tube numbers, rather than numbers of individual projectiles - firing a single torpedo and not having it be #1 makes no sense.
Timo Saloniemi
Along with "largest" or "most advanced" there is zero evidence whatsoever of this in canon. Mainly this is because they're the ONLY ships we ever saw in TOS and there's nothing much to compare them to (until now) but there's nothing actually indicating that they are remarkably tough or well armed, let alone "toughest."
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