Heroes 3x23 "1961" Discuss and Grade

Discussion in 'Science Fiction & Fantasy' started by Dream, Apr 13, 2009.


Grade the episode

  1. Excellent

  2. Above Average

  3. Average

  4. Below Average

  5. Poor

  1. Dorian Thompson

    Dorian Thompson Admiral Admiral

    Mar 3, 2003
    Oklahoma City, Oklahoma
    Why can't Claire just have short hair? Toss in a line that she got a bad haircut and there you go.
  2. Hermiod

    Hermiod Admiral Admiral

    Mar 16, 2006
    Excellent - The Peter/Hiro Nerf Modifier = Above Average.

    Even Claire was good here. Hopefully this reconciliation between Peter and Nathan will lead to Peter's powers going back to normal as has been hinted.

    This new Company idea sounds interesting too.
  3. RevDMV

    RevDMV Rear Admiral Rear Admiral

    Sep 3, 1999
    RevDMV in the Bay Area, CA
    Now I have the old B-52's song on the brain, "What's that on your head...":wtf:
  4. Alidar Jarok

    Alidar Jarok Everything in moderation but moderation Moderator

    Apr 14, 2003
    Norfolk, VA
    That would have been my hope back then. Maybe there will still be an opportunity, but I don't think so because Heroes is generally rooted in the present.

    It would have been cool if Adam Monroe had shown up at diner when they formed the company (having just overheard them) and was willing to join in.

    My guess is that Angela was the biggest impetus for recruiting the other founding members (probably had dreams and went out to find them). I'd say Adam is the big one (I'm curious about Kaito as well, but he doesn't have the history). In the comics, aren't Linderman and Arthur wartime buddies (I haven't read them)? It's possible that they met there, so that's not a stretch. Matt's dad is fairly generic and the killed by Adams are extremely generic.
  5. Snaploud

    Snaploud Admiral Admiral

    Jul 5, 2001
    Massachusetts, USA
    Four possibilities:

    1) They assassinated JFK.

    2) They erased JFK's memories prior to his assassination (having nothing to do with the latter incident).

    3) They erased JFK's memories and then had him assassinated when the memory wipe didn't take (for one reason or another...including help from JFK-led specials or advisors reminding JFK of the situation)...

    4) JFK died before the Company became powerful enough to manipulate the White House.
  6. Guy Gardener

    Guy Gardener Fleet Admiral Admiral

    Apr 15, 2000
    In the lap of squalor I assure you.
    Oh my.

    The programmed LBJ, and cleared the way for him?

    Oh no.

    The continued to promote Vietnam past the point of ridiculousness so that America wouldn't have an army to fight/hunt them on the homefront and maybe just a little s o that the nation's spirit would be broken after it found out what it was like to be wrong and lose a war?

    Oh my.

    The Draft.

    What if the company was using the draft to control/remove mundanes from the breeding groups? think about it, if only the superhumans were entirely exempt from the draft, then the next couple generations would be more and more super powered?

    They just needed to never have picked a day with an elipse for the draft sellection.
  7. Lt. Trull

    Lt. Trull Fleet Captain Fleet Captain

    Aug 23, 2001
    Mining colony Sol Asteroid belt, Sol System
    Angela's sister alice reminded me of storm from the xmen.
    baby stop and go needs to give peter his powers back, peter then needs to confront sylar... steal/acquire that mighty morphing power.
    become sylar try to kill sylar while he's posing as his brother.
  8. Checkmate

    Checkmate Commodore

    Mar 23, 2009
    We know from the comics that both Linderman and Mr. Petrelli were in Vietnam.
  9. WeAreTheBorg

    WeAreTheBorg Vice Admiral Admiral

    Jul 28, 2004
    Sector 001
    What are people referring to when they talk about the socks being explained? I mean I remember the socks thing in this episode, but is there some earlier thing that tied into this?
  10. Mr Light

    Mr Light Admiral Admiral

    Dec 7, 1999
    In the pilot of the series when Angela first appears she is arrested for shoplifting socks from a department store. Nathan is outraged because she's rich and acting out because dad just died and was going to upset his campaign.
  11. Guy Gardener

    Guy Gardener Fleet Admiral Admiral

    Apr 15, 2000
    In the lap of squalor I assure you.
    In the pilot or the second episode when Angela got caught shoplifting socks and Nathan and Peter had to bail her out from the mall security?

    Comics are nice, but even the shows continuity is fluid to the needs of the newly written work.
  12. DarthPipes

    DarthPipes Vice Admiral Admiral

    Mar 3, 2006
    I ended up really enjoying this one. Angela has been of the best characters on the show and I'm glad we got an episode on her. I agree that her sister staying there for almost fifty years was a little too much but the scenes between the two were still effective. The last sequence with the shows central character, the family, was great and that kind of moment has been sorely lacking on the show. Also, the Sylar reveal at the end was top-notch too.

    Agreed about Claire being her usual ungrateful self. Also, Nathan is getting on my nerves for refusing to acknowledge just how badly he screwed up. I can't stand Peter but he has every right to be upset at Nathan and Claire should be more upset than Nathan. Unless Suresh's father had his memory erased, that's yet another continuity era.

    About Charles's age, I just checked IMDB. Richard "Shaft" Roundtree, who played Charles was about 65 during the first season of Heroes so that means the writers actually got the age of his character right. About Charles, I can imagine it was very handy for him to have a power like that as an African-American living in the 1960s.
  13. Daneel

    Daneel Rear Admiral Rear Admiral

    Jan 31, 2009
    To elaborate on what I said before, about aspects of this episode being a bit out of place so late in the season, one of the things I was chiefly referring to was the introduction of Angela's heretofore unknown sister, unexpectedly alive and (physically) well. In addition to it being somewhat far-fetched, it just seems a bit pointless to introduce a new, potentially important character with no direct connection to the main plot when the season is almost over. Perhaps they're setting her up to be featured next season, but it still felt like they spent a bit too much time on her.

    That was my main issue with the episode, but other than that, I enjoyed it for the most part.
  14. Dream

    Dream Admiral Admiral

    Dec 2, 2001
    Hotel Transylvania
    They did the same thing with the black and white flashbacks for Company Man. It was cool the first time but it's gotten silly now. Apparently they think people watching are too dumb to figure out which scenes are flashback and which scenes take play in present time. There really is no need to do that anymore.

    The better way to do this is to have the flashback scenes with all characters look much younger or just have the entire episode be a flashback episode.
    Last edited: Apr 15, 2009
  15. Obiwanshinobi

    Obiwanshinobi Rear Admiral Rear Admiral

    Jan 1, 2003
    ^OR whenever they're about to do a flashback, they should have a sound cue, maybe something like a low end-roaring sound, similar to a plane taking off.
  16. Mr. Adventure

    Mr. Adventure Admiral Admiral

    Jun 9, 2001
    Mr. Adventure
    I guess I hadn't noticed, maybe because so much of this episode was in flashback it stood out.
  17. Morpheus 02

    Morpheus 02 Rear Admiral Rear Admiral

    Feb 3, 2003
    Chicago IL
    Somethings i noticed....younger Angela seemed to actually have some innocence...which she loses badly in the course of her life. But this was a good origin story.

    I might have missed this...but who was the guy with glasses? Bob?

    And how did Linderman meet with Petrelli in Vietnam (which was much later, right?)

    Weren't these guys trying to get away from the government?

    p.s. loved the episode --- the "family drama" among the Petrelli's seemed very real. Especially calling Nathan on his selfishness.
  18. Yoda

    Yoda Rear Admiral Rear Admiral

    Jul 13, 2000
    San Diego
    Was bored to tears. I think you should add a rating below 'Poor' called 'Shit Sandwich' so that I can vote my conscience accurately.
  19. Mr Light

    Mr Light Admiral Admiral

    Dec 7, 1999
    The dorky guy with the glasses was Bob Bishop with the Midas Touch who was Kristin Bell's father. I didn't mind the black & white flashbacks. When I think 40s/50s/60s I think black & white not color. Color wasn't invented until the 70s ;)
  20. Sakrysta

    Sakrysta Vice Admiral Admiral

    May 10, 2001
    From what I understand, the reason for the wig is that the constant styling was damaging Hayden's hair. Not sure, but I think the styling would still be necessary regardless of length. Also, the shape of Hayden's face would make a short haircut very difficult to make attractive. Her face is just too round - no matter what you did, she'd look like a cupie doll.

    You know, when they first started dancing, I thought how very taboo that was in the 60s, and how they should not be getting away with it. I think Angela should have been a little more hesitant - at the very least about drawing attention, and maybe even about dancing with a black man - considering the time period. Not saying it would have been the right attitude, merely that it would have been more believable, just a simple, "But, WE can't do that!" I did like how Charles handled it though. I think it would have had just a little more punch if his jedi mind trick had made Angela realize that it didn't matter what people thought, that she could be safe with him, etc.

    I agree that we could have done without Alice having survived, especially since Angela seems convinced that we'll never see her again. That was an awful lot of set up for a one-off guest star. They could easily have introduced a new character, maybe one who could draw on a power that had been used in a certain location and make it his own, or create historical illusions, or something other than having Alice the Hermit show up. Oh, and having the young Alice's eyes be so obviously dark while elder Alice's were bright blue was a distraction. How hard is it to fit your actor with a pair of brown contacts?

    Overall, though, I'm so happy with the direction the show has taken. Characters are sounding like themselves again. I can deal with how fast they're forgiving Nathan because all of this feels like a rush repair job - let's fix all the mistakes of the past couple years as quickly as possible so we can get back to telling a great story. I was SO excited to see Sylar/Nathan on the television! THIS is the story Heroes should have been building to all along, not traipsing off to Japan and South America.