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Heroes 3x17 "Cold Wars" Discuss and Grade

Grade episode

  • Total voters
    58
God, what has happened to this show? It used to rivet me every week, and last night I could barely bring myself to pay attention to what was going on. Yawn, another flashback episode that fills in the blanks for the idiot "heroes." Yawn, another "big bomb" threat, yet again telegraphed by the deus ex machina of prescient visions. Why the hell did they kill Isaac off and take all Peter's and Sylar's powers away just to thrust the prophecy shit onto someone else?

If the only way you can build suspense is to show the audience exactly what will happen if the heroes fail, you have failed at dramatic writing. The threat should be easy enough to decipher without such hand-holding. At least this time, it's Matt predicting himself doing something even he thinks is completely out of character.

And Daphne not being dead--fucking figures. The way they "killed her off" was so out of left field and cast aside so quickly I knew something was up. And Matt can't even bother to act like he thinks his girlfriend is dead. At least he doesn't need to, anymore.

This show has until the end of this volume to prove it still has something interesting to say. If not, I might tune in once in a while, but right now it's a pale imitation of season one, again. :(

Now I know how the people who bailed on NuBSG feel.
 
Magisterfrodo said:
Samurai8472 said:
DarthPipes said:
Can we officially classify Peter, Parkman, and Mohinder to be The Three Stooges? If those clowns shared even half a brain, they would be so dangerous....
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The low point I think, was Parkman and Mohinder fighting it out and letting HRG get away.

It was almost like those two were just two guys that kidnapped a very important person. Henchmen fighting it out.
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I think a slightly lower point than that was Peter, again, pointing a gun at someone without the balls to use it. What was the whole point of him going there if was conflicted?
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That's what really bothered me, as well. I used to really, really like Heroes. But they keep having the main characters, the people we are supposed to identify with and care about, doing one bone-headed thing after another. For the life of me, I don't understand why Peter went to the Hunter's apartment. It made no sense. Neither did Parkman and Mohinder fighting like cartoon characters and letting HRG get away.

I remember some quote by Roger Ebert, where he said that if the audience,when presented with the same information, figures it out long before the character does, it's a sign of bad writing and a sure sign that the audience won't really care what happens. I kept hearing that comment in my head while watching this episode.

And, try as I may, I can NOT understand Nathan's motivation. It just doesn't feel realistic for that character.

I gave the episode an AVERAGE, because I still liked Angela and her scheming ways, and all the sordid plotlines that go with it.

I still like Heroes, just not nearly as much as I used to.
 
Psylent1 said:
Instead of "outing" Nathan, why not just go to the media? There has to be a few reporters with a beef with Nathan.

I am sure there are some nurses from his hospital stay who remember him having conversations with nobody, just before his religious awakening.

Point out that since Nathan started "protecting America", his Brother, his former Political aide and his former Bodyguard have "disapeared".

The mother of his Illegitamate daughter died in a fire two months ago at a Paper plant owned by the Petrelli family, and at exactly the same time it burned, another facility owned by the Petrelli family, Pinehurst also burned and the head scientist Dr Suresh is also missing.

Congressman Petrelli was also seen at an Arkansas Air force base where a plane launched and crashed moments later, and was targeted and hit by missiles fired from that same base minutes later.

Is Congessman Peterlli protecting America or just cleaning up after his family?
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Well said. They don't have to tell the Hunter that he's one of them but everyone else in the government and media.

This inexplicable protection of Nathan is really annoying me. Reminds me of a Twilght Zone episode called Black Leather Jackets. In it, three human-looking aliens with telekinetic powers come to Earth with plans of poisoning the water supply ahead of an invasion. The youngest one though falls in love with a local girl and is determined to stop them. He tells the girl repeatedly that he's an alien but she doesn't believe him. So does he show her his telekinetic powers, which are sure to convince her? Nope. It doesn't even cross his mind as he repeatedly tries to convince her that he's telling the truth and that the Earth is doomed. So he winds up getting caught by fellow aliens on the planet and no one ever believes him. It's not a bad little story but the fact that the alien doesn't bother showing the girl his powers, something that would no doubt convince her that he's speaking the truth, destroys the credibility of the episode.
 
I just figured that if the Heroes ratted out Nathan, no one would believe them or he'd be hunted down as well and the Hunter would have total control. Neither of which are acceptable options.
 
Excellent, except for the very end, which rates DUMB. :rommie: Think of something else to do, writers!

This show improves immensely with the absence of Hiro. No Sylar either, but I'm willing to wait to see what he's up to. This episode focused on characters who have a natural place in the story, so that helped a lot.

I appreciate the way the characters are pretty much acting in character lately. Sure, Mohinder and Nathan got where they are now thru some iffy plot twists, but they are at places where they certainly could plausibly be right now, given competent writers in past episodes. What's done is done, I'm more interested in where this goes.
I've had it with every so-called "Hero" giving Nathan a free pass by NOT revealing his secret. Despite the fact that it would destroy his credibility with the government.
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Wouldn't be a credible charge. Even if Nathan had no powers, wouldn't it be the logical thing for his enemies to claim, in order to sow dissention and mistrust? They'd have to trick him into using his powers (toss Claire off a bridge maybe, hey I could go for that.) :p

Also, are the soldiers chasing the mutants because they are "dangerous" or because they've been told that they are "the enemy"? The latter is usually how things work. Even if the soldiers knew Nathan had powers, would they care? He's still giving the orders. The soldiers are just assigned to hunt down the dangerous ones.

The hunter doesn't know Nathan is special or he wouldn't have asked Nathan how he got there so fast during the confrontation with Peter.
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I'm sure not long after he said that, Danko figured out just exactly how Nathan got there so fast. The issue then becomes, does it matter? Danko will continue to work with Nathan for as long as he's useful and turn on him only when his usefulness is through.

Heroes has a huge budget. I wouldn't renew it with those numbers were the decision up to me.
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NBC execs don't have a lot of options. And Heroes is still their second best performing scripted show. They can't run Leno in every timeslot (but maybe I shouldn't underestimate their complete and utter lameness). :rommie:

While the recent results for Chuck and Heroes on Monday have been down, I believe a combination of the overall devastation at NBC this season, particularly for their new shows, and their seeming inability to come up with anything better, likely keeps those two safe from cancellation. My guess is that the failure (my guess) of the new NBC shows this spring will seal the deal.
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Renew/Cancel guy is right about Kings. That one has Instant Flop written all over it.
 
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The next two episodes will be Sylar focused which should make up for his absence this week.

Bryan Fuller wrote episode 20 and something big is suppose to happen in it.
 
Aragorn said:
Something big? Like the characters start thinking? :p
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Part of the reason I loved this ep is that I've become accustomed to Peter, Mo and Matt being idiots and find it charming. :rommie:
And, try as I may, I can NOT understand Nathan's motivation. It just doesn't feel realistic for that character.
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You'd have to rewrite the last several episodes of the previous volume to give him the right motivation. Something HUGE needed to happen, traumatic enough that he would take extreme measures, and something that would convince any rational person that the Specials would eventually be found out and it would be catastrophic (they will all be executed for certain), so that the one and only responsible thing to do would be to head off total disaster by locking them all up and finding a way to erase their powers via some kind of treatment.

The treatment concept was finally introduced this episode as being part of Nathan's plan, and makes it more humane and sensible. There's been plenty of evidence that such a treatment is at least theoretically possible. Mohinder himself was working on it at one time, last time he was sane, pretty much...
They did the Big Traumatic Events, but they forgot to add the stuff that would solidify Nathan's motivation.
But it still doesn't make sense that none of them would try. Human nature. They're all pissed off at Nathan.
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Who are they going to tell who would care and wouldn't make the situation worse?

The soldiers follow orders. They've been told to get the bad guys. Maybe some mutants are good guys? That's not their job to decide.

The media would love, love, love the idea of superpowered people - ratings gold (ironically enough) - but would be no help. They would turn the whole thing into the biggest circus imaginable. The media would particularly love the fear-mongering possibilities of exposing people who can OMG! CUT YOUR HEAD OPEN JUST BY THINKING ABOUT IT! AND CONTROL YOUR MIND!!! Turn this story over to Fox News and it's ten thousand times worse than anything Nathan could do. There would be lynch mobs in the streets.

They should do that story and get Man Coulter and Sean Manatee as guest stars to spout hystrionic anti-mutant bile. And Limbaugh! It practically writes itself.
 
Below average
I done with this show - I used to love Heroes in it's first series but for me the characters are now so incrediably irritating and the writing so shallow that I cannot be bothered.
This constant teasing about characters suppossed deaths when we know they will be resurrected really does my head in!
I know Mr Fuller is a talented writer/showrunner but I 'm sceptical about how much he can do to improve the show - perhaps recruit his old writing staff from Pushing Diaises!
I do have a suspicion his first episode will get a huge amounts on 'Excellents' from desperate fans ( and I don't blame them) irregardless of its actual quality - or I am being bitter and cynical?
Peace
SJA
 
Heroes beats Lost...in piracy ratings! :rommie:

Seriously, are these figures accurate? A mere 1.6M worldwide? Pffft! The networks hav no right to squawk about piracy eating their profits.

But the real shocker...people bother to pirate Gray's Anatomy?
 
For a Sylar-less episode, I certainly enjoyed it a decent amount. Probably because there was so much more Noah. The show hasn't made be a huge fan again, but it has been so middling that I stick with it.
 
Piss poor.

Just so damn BORING!

The Noah flashbacks were not at all interesting. The reveals weren't worth it at all. The "let's make the flashbacks be black and white" thing is like a magnifying glass for lameness.

I didn't think an episode could be this boring without focusing on Claire. Very few of the characters have motivations that make any sense... least of all Nathan the bad guy. Parkman at least seems to act somewhat consistently, but he's an idiot and a fat lump, and I could really do without the resurrection of his completely unconvincing soul mate.

Out of the entire group of characters in this episode the only one that I ever really liked at all was Mohinder. But they screwed him up bad by having him go all mutant, if not before that.

This show is a complete mess right now.
 
Temis the Vorta said:
Heroes beats Lost...in piracy ratings! :rommie:

Seriously, are these figures accurate? A mere 1.6M worldwide? Pffft! The networks hav no right to squawk about piracy eating their profits.

But the real shocker...people bother to pirate Gray's Anatomy?
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I really doubt the numbers are all that accurate. I don't see anything on that site that explains their methodology. Even if they somehow are doing a decent job of tracking all the torrents out there (which seems unlikely considering all the private trackers, not to mention the DHT protocol extensions) there's still a whole world of piracy beyond torrents that they're not tracking at all.

I like torrents, easy to use, an obvious and visible target to distract the copyright nazis, yet it's impossible to stop every tracker, and overall it does a great job of deflecting attention away from the better ways to pirate.

As to why Heroes is running slightly ahead of Lost, it's hard to say. I'm going to blame foreigners who don't speak English natively. They don't have the level of English knowledge to be able to tell that while both shows make no sense, Lost makes no sense in a 'good way', so they just download both and stare slackjawed at their monitors :)
 
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