Have you ever been turned off of an author's books...

[Nerys Myk]

Nah, when I stop enjoying their work thats when I stop reading. I still read Card's books, he hasn't hit that wall yet. I have stopped reading Peter David because he has. Never met either gentleman, but have seen statements by both I didn't like.

Yet, I have every title released by Terri Osborne, Margaret Wander Bonnanno, & Jean Lorrah. Because they aren't jerks, online or in person. Come to think about it, all three are humble about their work, too

. Come to TNZ and see a different side Margaret Wander Bonanno.

She's a tough, opinionated, no holds barred poster over there. ( and that's why I love her) Though I recall her going a few rounds with poster here when discussing "Burning Dreams".

 

[Starbreaker]

Extensive knowledge isn't a problem--using it with the intent of humiliating others is

And you know the intent in those posts because...?

I think Nerys and myself are talking about the same person. It's very obvious. Instead of disagreeing, they say "no, you're wrong" and go into a full dissertation on why. I don't mind if somebody actually has factual information, but trying to prove me wrong based on their own beliefs is stupid.

 

[Nerys Myk]

Extensive knowledge isn't a problem--using it with the intent of humiliating others is

And you know the intent in those posts because...?

I think Nerys and myself are talking about the same person. It's very obvious. Instead of disagreeing, they say "no, you're wrong" and go into a full dissertation on why. I don't mind if somebody actually has factual information, but trying to prove me wrong based on their own beliefs is stupid.

"beliefs?" "factual information?" Are we talking fiction, religion or science?

 

[Starbreaker]

Just random stuff like

"This TV show creator didn't mean this. What he actually meant was this, and you're just not smart enough to understand the real meaning."

Blah...

 

[Nerys Myk]

That last part is insulting. The first part could be supported by facts.

 

[Starbreaker]

Which is what I don't like. I don't believe anyone on this board actually has extensive knowledge of every subject in the world, otherwise they would probably be the leader of a small country.

 

[Nerys Myk]

Which is what I don't like. I don't believe anyone on this board actually has extensive knowledge of every subject in the world, otherwise they would probably be the leader of a small country.

If only national leaders were that well read.

Though there is a lot information to be found on the interwebs! I use it all time when engaged in discussion. I try to list my sources though and admit I'm not that smart.

ETA: Research is part of the writer trade ( or at least it should be) So its possibe to gain a fair amount of infomation about a wide range of subjects in the course of their writing career. Perhaps not expert level but good enough for discussion purposes. I'm working on a book set in the Caribbean of the 1700s, so I'vwe done some reading on the subject, as well on some other (top secret ) story elements. I would expect other authors do the same whether they are writing a biography, science fiction or an expose of Wall Street.

 

[Nardpuncher]

That last part is insulting. The first part could be supported by facts.

What it is is some people miss the point.
Example: in the thread about Trek Lit Pet Peeves I brought up the little thing about using apostrophes to make an alien name seem more alien. I never said I hated it or that it boiled my blood or anything. It was just that, a pet peeve.

Then came the 2000 word essay and examples of how apostrophes are used by the English language as well as others and that if I didn't like it, then I should take it up 'with reality' (I think that's how he said it)

So the guy came of thinking I had a problem with apostrophes!

 

[Maestro]

There was a very popular trilogy that I returned a couple of years ago (or was it last year?). I didn't care for some of the things promoted within it as well as some of the political parallels it was attempting to draw.

Ah, Star Trek: Vanguard. Great stuff. I had gotten into a few verbals here with David Mack over Titan, so I wasn't planning on buying his books until I saw you concerns. Interested the same way that people who don't like Howard Stern are still interested in listening to him, I picked up the books, and loved them. Even read one of Mack's non-Trek books, The Calling, which was also quite good. And I have your issues with that series to thank!

 

[Allyn Gibson]

Even read one of Mack's non-Trek books, The Calling, which was also quite good.

Try his Wolverine novel, Road of Bones. It's seriously top-notch work.

 

[David Mack]

^ Thanks, Allyn and Maestro. Very kind of you both to say.

 

[trampledamage]

Extensive knowledge isn't a problem--using it with the intent of humiliating others is

And you know the intent in those posts because...?

This can't be emphasized enough. There are no facial expressions or body language in these posts. Most of us don't really know each other. When all you have is a few sentences in text, it's really easy to read in something that isn't there. Anyone who's been online more than fifteen minutes has experienced both sides of that -- misunderstanding someone else, and being misunderstood by someone else.

And that's without getting into all the other things that can cause problems in online conversations, like cultural differences, differences in communication styles, and, sometimes, good people having bad days.

I've got my own notions of what some people around here are like based on their posts. I have serious doubts that many of them would last more than five minutes in the physical presence of said people.

I know, I mean there are some people around here who think I'm nice!

 

[Sci]

Which is what I don't like. I don't believe anyone on this board actually has extensive knowledge of every subject in the world,

Right, it's terribly implausible that anyone would be well-educated and have the ability to conduct research.

otherwise they would probably be the leader of a small country.

How do you know I'm not the President of the Federated States of Micronesia or the Republic of Nauru?

 

[JD]

I can honestly say that I've never really been turned off of someone's based on their words or actions. But I've never actually met anyone who's work I've read/watched so that and the fact I've only really started following stuff online in the last year or two might have something to do with it. One of my best examples is Tom Cruise, who I find rather strange in real life, but who is still one of my favorite actors. Just so you know, I'm not referring to his being a Scientologist, there are alot of normal people who Scientologists, it's just that I've heard him say and seen him do some weird thing in interviews.

I'm kinda suprised by some of the stuff I've been reading in this thread, I've been hanging out here for a few years now, and I don't remember ever seen any of the regulars on here being blatantly purposefully rude with getting a warning or something from the PMs (Just so you don't misunderstand I'm talking about people in general not any one specific person). Now, I have seen alot of stuff that could easily be misinterpreted as being rude. I really think in alot cases this is just the person not necessarily getting their point across in the best possible way, and the other people reading this poorly communicated post as hostile. (Again this is not about any specific people it's just about members and postings in general. I'm just wanting to make sure this is understood, because I know I am very guilty of what I am talking about, both here and in real life.)

 

[Starbreaker]

Which is what I don't like. I don't believe anyone on this board actually has extensive knowledge of every subject in the world,

Right, it's terribly implausible that anyone would be well-educated and have the ability to conduct research.

It's one thing to be knowledgeable about certain areas. It's quite different to spout off Wikipedia type facts in every post. I like having conversations on the TrekBBS, not being lectured.

 

[Lonemagpie]

You know what they say: "people who think they know it all are a burden to those of us who do!"

 

[Nardpuncher]

Which is what I don't like. I don't believe anyone on this board actually has extensive knowledge of every subject in the world,

Right, it's terribly implausible that anyone would be well-educated and have the ability to conduct research.

It's one thing to be knowledgeable about certain areas. It's quite different to spout off Wikipedia type facts in every post. I like having conversations on the TrekBBS, not being lectured.

I know what you mean.
You may be the world's greatest storehouse of knowledge on let's say, apples. If I mention that I don't really like apples but prefer pears you cannot then tell me about how apples and pears are part of the same genus or whatnot and how it doesn't make sense for me not to like apples as they have they same consistency and close to the same taste at the same price as pears.

There are many posts by Christopher that are very intelligent and well-thought out. I can see that he is a logical, reasonable and active minded fellow but he never really seemed to learn how to not hit people over the head with stuff that they may already know, or not think has any relevance to the Trek/Sci-Fi topic at hand. It's a subltety that can be learned with experience.

It's just that he seems to patrol the boards looking for posts to ammend or contradict or point out the one case in ten where the poster's arguement fails. Most of the time I want to post afterwards with a polite Dude, it's OK...just leave it, alright?

 

[Nerys Ghemor]

Right, it's terribly implausible that anyone would be well-educated and have the ability to conduct research.

It's one thing to be knowledgeable about certain areas. It's quite different to spout off Wikipedia type facts in every post. I like having conversations on the TrekBBS, not being lectured.

I know what you mean.
You may be the world's greatest storehouse of knowledge on let's say, apples. If I mention that I don't really like apples but prefer pears you cannot then tell me about how apples and pears are part of the same genus or whatnot and how it doesn't make sense for me not to like apples as they have they same consistency and close to the same taste at the same price as pears.

There are many posts by Christopher that are very intelligent and well-thought out. I can see that he is a logical, reasonable and active minded fellow but he never really seemed to learn how to not hit people over the head with stuff that they may already know, or not think has any relevance to the Trek/Sci-Fi topic at hand. It's a subltety that can be learned with experience.

It's just that he seems to patrol the boards looking for posts to ammend or contradict or point out the one case in ten where the poster's arguement fails. Most of the time I want to post afterwards with a polite Dude, it's OK...just leave it, alright?

Exactly...that sort of thing can very easily appear as arrogance, and it's offputting.

 

[TerriO]

In my own defense--lame as it probably is--getting the functional equivalent of a divorce (if NY had common-law, it would be a divorce) is, well, quite a battering ram at the sense of self. But that's the past, and I'm too busy worried about 2010 right now. 2010 is going to be a big step for me.

One thing that can knock you down a peg or three realbloodyquick is to be told to your face that someone whose opinion you respected at the time doesn't think you're ready to write a novel. I've been writing novel-length fiction since I was 12. Seriously. I had to learn to write short fiction for Trek. I know nothing was perfect. I don't claim anything was. Nobody is perfect, not even you (yes, I'm directing that at everyone individually).

We are all flawed, fallible creatures, full of foibles and fallacies. I suspect that there are a few around here who might benefit from remembering that. *cue raised eyebrow*

 

[reech]

What, asking people who post on forums to take a second look at themselves to see if they can spot any flaws? Inconceivable!

I tend to separate the author from the fiction when I'm reading; I treat it as pure escapism. If someone is pouring particular laid-on-thick metaphors for themselves, or their views, I just shrug and keep on reading; after all, just reading these fictionalised 'intrusions' isn't going to make me think any more or less in the same way that the author does.

Does that mean I'm short changing people who are TRYING to challenge the way I'm thinking through their writing? I hope not; I read Trek books to get a healthy dose of fun and excitement, not to chew through a load of personal prose.

But if I do offend anyone by ignoring the subtleties in their writing, at least I can take one comfort - they'll never know the way I think.

Erm, until now. Borx.