Gotham - Season 1

[Kai "the spy"]

Tell yourself whatever you need to in order to convince yourself that you're an intellectual. The rest of the world know what's going on with the character and the show.

Uh, ... what?!

And she and Jim broke up only a third of the way through the season, so it seems to me she was always meant to break up with him. They wouldn't have made her such a screwed-up character otherwise.

Because people never break up and then get back together again further down the line, do they?

Barbara could end up going down a dark path, and then Jim could be the one to pull her back from the brink, which rekindles their love for each other.

Sure, they could go this route. They also could not go this route.

I don't think Christopher is commenting in absolutes here, he's just giving his impressions on the basis of what we've seen so far, and on that basis, I tend to agree with him.

 

[Neroon]

Tell yourself whatever you need to in order to convince yourself that you're an intellectual. The rest of the world know what's going on with the character and the show.

Whoa, there. It's not necessary to go that route in disagreeing with someone by insulting their intelligence. Take it easy

 

[Enterprise is Great]

I think that they're getting rid of Barbara because they don't know what to do with her beyond being Gordon's girlfriend/ex-girlfriend. The character's been all over the map. She's been pretty useless for almost the entire season.

 

[Mr Light]

They've already jettisoned Allen and Montoya because they didn't know what to do with them. They clearly don't know what to do with Barbara or Fish either. If they're both not smoking corpses by the end of the season finale I'll be utterly shocked.

 

[DWF]

They've already jettisoned Allen and Montoya because they didn't know what to do with them. They clearly don't know what to do with Barbara or Fish either. If they're both not smoking corpses by the end of the season finale I'll be utterly shocked.

Jada Smith has already said she won't be back next season, so Fish's death is a certainty.

 

[Forbin]

If you wanna throw in the TV series and the Bat-movies, Batgirl has been Comissioner Gordon's daughter in one, and Alfred's niece in another.

 

[Christopher]

If you wanna throw in the TV series and the Bat-movies, Batgirl has been Comissioner Gordon's daughter in one, and Alfred's niece in another.

Well, the Barbara Gordon Batgirl has always been Jim Gordon's daughter in every incarnation, even though her mother's identity has varied. The Alicia Silverstone character was Barbara Wilson, essentially a separate person altogether despite the name. There have been other separate individuals to adopt the name Batgirl in the comics, including the original '50s Bat-Girl Betty Kane and the post-Barbara Batgirls Cassandra Cain and Stephanie Brown, with brief turns in the role by Helena Bertinelli and Charlotte Gage-Radcliffe.

 

[TheSeeker]

They've already jettisoned Allen and Montoya because they didn't know what to do with them. They clearly don't know what to do with Barbara or Fish either. If they're both not smoking corpses by the end of the season finale I'll be utterly shocked.

Jada Smith has already said she won't be back next season, so Fish's death is a certainty.

I wouldn't be surprises of she comes back once in a while. The Dollmaker threatened to bring her back as one of his nightmares after all.

 

[The Old Mixer]

Lucius!

And eww on the Stabbler subplot...I'm trying to eat....

Will the trapdoor fireplace open to reveal a pair of poles labeled "Thomas" and "Martha"?

 

[FreezeC77]

I'm not sure I get the Penguins play here. Only reason he is alive is because Maroney was letting him live becausr of Falcone. If he turns on Falcone I woulda put Penguin at the top of the kill list.

 

[Icemizer]

Penguin knows the gang war will keep him busy. Maroney will not want to quickly kill Penguin but savor it so Penguin knows he will save him for later.

 

[Christopher]

This show is just... not very good. The whole Ogre-Barbara thing didn't do much for me; I really didn't need to see yet another story of a female character being made into a helpless victim of a sexual predator. Not that it succeeded in making her sympathetic, though. Although it does seem to have probably driven her crazy, which could potentially make her slightly interesting at last.

There was an odd sort of narrative jump here, as if there were some scenes missing between the last episode and this one. When did Gordon find out that Barbara was missing? When did Alfred find out that Reggie was dead?

David Mazouz is still the best thing about this show by far. He gave a terrific performance when Bruce came clean to Alfred (as I knew he would, because it's not Bruce Wayne's way to cover up a crime). The stuff with Bunderslaw (who came up with that name???) and Lil' Lucius Fox was too cursory and too quickly wrapped up, though.

So we're starting to see the Riddler's obsession for leaving clues. Even though he meant to pass that letter off as being from the guy he killed, he couldn't resist encoding his name into it as an acrostic. That's classic Riddler -- it's self-defeating to insert clues pointing to himself, but he just can't resist challenging people to solve his puzzles. But it frustrated me as a word-puzzle fan that he used the phrase "between the lines" to describe an acrostic, which is not between the lines but at their beginning! A fan of puzzles would not make that mistake!

Will the trapdoor fireplace open to reveal a pair of poles labeled "Thomas" and "Martha"?

I'm not sure I get the Penguins play here. Only reason he is alive is because Maroney was letting him live becausr of Falcone. If he turns on Falcone I woulda put Penguin at the top of the kill list.

His play is to get Falcone and Maroni to wipe each other out, or weaken each other enough that he can more easily finish them off. Perhaps with Maroni enraged with Falcone personally, he'll fixate on that target and won't bother with Penguin. And Pengy probably has plans to protect himself. He has loyal men like Butch around him.

 

[Rat Boy]

I did get a laugh over the homage to the Godfather that went completely wrong. And I wonder if Bruce discovers that his father hid all his dirt on Wayne Enterprises in a secure, subterranean location on the property of Wayne Manor.

 

[CorporalClegg]

This show is just... not very good.

I think it's a case where the whole is less than the sum of the parts.

On an individual level, most bits and pieces are at least okay, and some parts are excellent. But it seems that when everything is put together, that the not-so-good parts over compensate and drag the whole thing down.

I think part of that is because there always seems to be so much going on at once. It seems to me like they're trying to fit a soap opera plot structure into a weekly crime show. And it's not working. There've been two are three season-long arcs that are always being spliced together by two or three multi-episode arcs that are strung together by the episode story--almost like Christmas lights. If one of the bulbs dies, the whole string goes out.

If they don't do some serious restructuring over the summer break, then I don't see the show lasting past next season.

Like you say, Mazouz and Pertwee are far and away the best part of the show. If they were smart, they'd switch the primary focus to them. But they won't because Batman. I predict the reluctance to have a Bruce Wayne centric show (whether it's fear or studio obstruction) will be the thing that holds the series back until its inevitable death.

 

[DWF]

There was an odd sort of narrative jump here, as if there were some scenes missing between the last episode and this one. When did Gordon find out that Barbara was missing? When did Alfred find out that Reggie was dead?

That was last week you missd it.

David Mazouz is still the best thing about this show by far. He gave a terrific performance when Bruce came clean to Alfred (as I knew he would, because it's not Bruce Wayne's way to cover up a crime).

Go rewatch The Dark Knight and for that matter the entire Nolan Batman trilogy, Bruce can and has covered up crimes.

 

[Guy Gardener]

Batman is a vigilante and therefore illegal, and no different than a very well outfitted mugger.

Neil deGrasse Tyson on the Daily Show a couple nights back tried to justify Batman over Superman because Superman was a wierdo who did what he wanted, but Batman had been deputized by Commissioner Gordon.



It's clear that Neil hasn't seen anything Batman since Adam West "retired".

 

[The Old Mixer]

I think we've just seen the tip of iceberg with Lucius and Wayne Enterprises. They seem to be setting things up so that Bruce is going to have to take them down from the inside, and Lucius will be his ally.

I have to wonder where they're going with Barbara at this point, if anywhere.

And I wonder if Bruce discovers that his father hid all his dirt on Wayne Enterprises in a secure, subterranean location on the property of Wayne Manor.

In a big, old computer...powered by its own atomic reactor.

You know, I've just been catching the early episodes of Arrow on Netflix....When they first showed the Queen home, I couldn't help but hearing William Dozier in my head saying, "Meanwhile at Stately Queen Manor, home of millionaire Oliver Queen and his youthful ward, Roy Harper...."

 

[Forbin]

If you wanna throw in the TV series and the Bat-movies, Batgirl has been Comissioner Gordon's daughter in one, and Alfred's niece in another.

Well, the Barbara Gordon Batgirl has always been Jim Gordon's daughter in every incarnation, even though her mother's identity has varied. The Alicia Silverstone character was Barbara Wilson, essentially a separate person altogether despite the name. There have been other separate individuals to adopt the name Batgirl in the comics, including the original '50s Bat-Girl Betty Kane and the post-Barbara Batgirls Cassandra Cain and Stephanie Brown, with brief turns in the role by Helena Bertinelli and Charlotte Gage-Radcliffe.

Wow! I didn't know all that. I'm very unschooled in Batgirl history.

 

[Christopher]

I did get a laugh over the homage to the Godfather that went completely wrong.

I haven't seen that movie. What are you referring to? And do you mean that it went wrong in-story or that it was an attempt by the writers that failed miserably? On this show, it could be either.

And I wonder if Bruce discovers that his father hid all his dirt on Wayne Enterprises in a secure, subterranean location on the property of Wayne Manor.

Yeah, that seems kind of inevitable at this point.

 

[Icemizer]

Christopher please set some time aside and watch The Godfather. Even if you hate the genre, actors, writer, director, etc. the film has created so many references through out modern society its a need to see film.
I also have to disagree that the Ogre was a sexual predator. A predator yes but not a sexual one. He was not motivated by sex or even passion but a twisted sense of love and domination.