Garrett Wang criticizes Rick Berman

[Equinox]

^^^ I don't know much about Wang's academic/theatrical training. If he DID go to an actual acting/film school and get a Bachelor's or higher, I can almost bet he had to take a certain amount of directing classes so that he was QUALIFIED to do that job.

I'm a graphic designer by profession with a Bachelor's degree in it and I can sympathize with Wang because of how he was treated. In my field, an "Art Director" is the equivalent of a movie/tv director. They tell people what to do and how to get stuff done but besides the authority/final-say thing they are at the same level skill-wise as most designers (or in Wang's case, actors with degrees).

In the media industry it's all about who you know and not so much what you know because if it was, there'd be no reason why Wang shouldn't have been given the chance to direct at least ONE episode. ONE episode out of 170+. I mean, if Wang didn't get the directing gig because his first acting job was Voyager that's discriminatory --- apparently he's good enough to be shown on screen and represent the show as an actor but not qualified enough to helm the camera and crew for ONE episode out of 170+!!!


All I'm saying is that Wang deserved a shot at the chair if multiple actors on the show got the chance. If no one on the Voyager acting lineup got that chance, there wouldn't have been any fuss. But there is because Berman said, "Uh, let's stop before we gotta give the token young Asian dude a chance."

 

[Therin of Andor]

stj said:
I am pretty sure that the cast does not attend "production meetings" on ad lib. This sounds like they were brought in as part of training for the directing gig. For that matter, I'm not sure editing bays are open to all and sundry.

They would seek an invitation, and then if granted that, they'd turn up as arranged and be as unobtrusive as possible. (ST sets were also said to be "closed to visitors" but there were many exceptions almost every day.)

There are many, many ways an actor would demonstrate interest in pursuing directing. And there would be many ways an actor on a show would set up an expectation that they didn't really have their heart in it, or weren't prepared to do their "homework", such as by never being on set after their official work was finished, or by building a reputation for running late every day.

Paramount wouldn't be in the practice of letting a cast member direct an episode simply on a whim, or as some "everyone else had a turn" prededent. Casts and crews must trust a director. If everyone on set had a low opinion of someone's commitment to punctuality or professionalism, why would they have trust in that person as a potential director/leader?

We cannot speculate on what actually went on. A lot of political things, both major and minor, happen over a seven year period in Hollywood. And any workplace.

 

[Ariadne]

exodus said:
Well, if everyone in the cast and film crew could make it in on time everyday, then Wang has no excuse. Also from my understanding Voyager films in 14 hour work days. The cast arrives a little after day break and well before rush hour traffic.

How was he getting to work?

I've heard tell that he was taking the bus when he was auditioning (no, I can't cite it), so until he bought a car, arriving well before rush hour traffic would make it harder, not easier.

Equinox said:
^^^ I don't know much about Wang's academic/theatrical training. If he DID go to an actual acting/film school and get a Bachelor's or higher, I can almost bet he had to take a certain amount of directing classes so that he was QUALIFIED to do that job.

He said in an interview (on a podcast that was posted here a few months ago - maybe somebody else can remember which one) that he got a degree in something else, but wound up taking all the required classes to major in theatre - to the extent that a lot of the theatre students and profs thought he was also in theatre.

 

[KitchenWitch]

Toresica said:
How was he getting to work?

I've heard tell that he was taking the bus when he was auditioning (no, I can't cite it), so until he bought a car, arriving well before rush hour traffic would make it harder, not easier.

I'm familiar with LA traffic. It can be an excuse--now and again, but not routinely. If you're habitually late, well, you get up a little earlier or change your route. Or both.

As for mass transit--it runs at night.

Besides, when you're making the kind of money a series regular makes, you can afford hire a car service. Or buy a car.

 

[Ariadne]

^^ Right, but in season 1 he hadn't actually earned (or, presumably, received) said money. Since it was his first major acting job, he was probably running low before he got cast in Voyager, too.

Not an excuse for the later seasons, of course.

 

[Equinox]

I think respect needs to go both ways between actors and execs, that's all I'm saying.

If Berman and Co. were pissed that Wang was "showing up late / leaving right after / etc." then maybe they should have thought about what they were doing that COULD possibly be related to Wang's unusual behavior. I don't think it's a case of chicken or the egg.

Either Wang was lazy to begin with and the folks in charge decided to give him crappier roles and less opportunities or Berman and the writers treated him like crap script-wise and work-wise first and Wang's work attitude changed in response to being treated like crap.

Odds are, based on all we know about Berman's character, Wang wasn't the one who set this in motion.

 

[number6]

^^You seem to make this statement based on the notion that actors, directors and producers are equals. They are not. We have no idea why Wang didn't get to direct, but there wouldn't be any guarantee that he would automatically be entitled in any event. There is always some level of politics and cliques on any set, and if Wang was really interested in directing, all indications from stories by cast and crew were that he wasn't showing any initiative. Given the sheer expense of every frame of film shot on a show like Star Trek, or any other show for that matter, being late only a couple of times for set call is a serious infraction. Such an infraction is serious at this level and does not help Wang's cause in any situation. How someone gets "mistreated" by not getting enough lines or screentime is a crock of shit, too. He was hired and under contract as a support player and this was his first major series. MacNeill and Russ had done Trek before VOY and had an established relationship with the producers. I've been on film sets before. There is a hierarchy and with a crew that large, not everyone is going to get to do much more than what they were hired for. That's a simple known fact. Wang has his reasons for being bitter and that's as may be, but his "criticisms" come off as nothing more than simply being bitter about not getting the same treatment as others who deserved and earned their way, in the same way Takei and Keonig were bitter over getting fewer lines than Shatner. Shatner was the star. deal with it. That's the way it is.

People want to buy into Wang's situation only because bashing Berman is so kewl for some "fans," and nothing more.

 

[exodus]

Toresica said:

exodus said:
Well, if everyone in the cast and film crew could make it in on time everyday, then Wang has no excuse. Also from my understanding Voyager films in 14 hour work days. The cast arrives a little after day break and well before rush hour traffic.

How was he getting to work?

I've heard tell that he was taking the bus when he was auditioning (no, I can't cite it), so until he bought a car, arriving well before rush hour traffic would make it harder, not easier.

Thousands upon thousands of people nation wide take the bus or trains to work. Being repeatedly late is still no excuse. He could have always rented a car.

 

[Opus]

I don't know what I enjoyed more: The actual GW interview, or all the fiction being created on this board.

Regarding the interview, I think GW's assessment about Trek becoming formulaic and stale after 18+ years is a valid criticism. And he is not the first person to complain about Berman's blind adherence to Gene Roddenberry's 1987 vision of Star Trek (which was different form GR's 1979 vision of Star Trek, which was different from GR's 1966 vision of Star Trek,, which was different from his 1964 vision of Star Trek). Behr recognized this as well on DS9, and faught tooth and nail to get the changes he desired past Rick Berman's desk. He's also been a critic of how Berman ran Trek in the same way as GW. Hmmmm, where there's smoke...

 

[stj]

if everyone on set had a low opinion of someone's commitment to punctuality or professionalism, why would they have trust in that person as a potential director/leader?

Somehow we now know what everyone on set was thinking? And this is relevant to the choice of a director how exactly? Did the cast and crew vote?

...but his "criticisms" come off as nothing more than simply being bitter about not getting the same treatment as others who deserved and earned their way...

The point has always been that it is pretty strange to abuse Wang for complaining about his own failures when, despite such reckless assumptions above, we don't know what standards were applied for "deserving" and "earning." If part of that meant being invited to production meetings, as our least biased testimony suggests, the "deserving" was the producers' secret, and the "earning" came after.

Dawson did an energetic job with a badly written role in my opinion, but honestly there didn't appear to be any real intelligence in the way she failed to cope with the Klingon Klaptrap. (Forgot who I stole the phrase from, sorry.) The only real good Dawson episodes in my opinion were the ones where she didn't really play Torres, namely Remember and Muse. That's not a good track record for one of the favored players.

McNiell on the other hand had numerous writers' gifts and wasted them all in my opinion. He was the pilot, he was the lover (all the females, wasn't it?!) he was the nurse (sic!), he was the writer, he was Gary Stu. With his starring episodes we get Threshold, Alice, Vis a Vis, etc. Well, I suppose 30 Days is watchable, but compelling, no.

(Mr. Daddy Issues Paris even costarred in Real Life to spout the profamily message! Which is incidentally an example of Wang's character getting shafted---that should have been Kim. I wouldn't be surprised if Paris wasn't originally supposed to be the lead in Timeless, but he turned it down because he didn't want to play a loser!)
(Yes, this is humorous hyperbole.)

And these are the two who supposedly earned and deserved? Whereas Russ, who did an equally tough job with more distinction just got to direct once?

Well, my opinion about who deserved what is no more significant than any nonproducer's.

The point has always been that abusing Wang for daring to express his view is absurd. (And abusing Berman as well, but there really hasn't been very much of that has there?)

 

[Richard1701]

You say yes to one you have to say yes to them all! You see, what Wang doesn't know is that little Scarlet Pomers (Naomi Wildman) had also at the same time asked Berman if she could direct! If Berman said yes to Garrett, he would have had to say yes to Scarlet! Therefore, he said no! hahaha!

 

[Ariadne]

stj said:
And these are the two who supposedly earned and deserved? Whereas Russ, who did an equally tough job with more distinction just got to direct once?

I know very little about the influence of a director upon an episode.

Is it possible McNeill was better at *directing* (not necessarily acting) then Russ?

 

[stj]

^^^Yes. I was thinking still aabout getting directing jobs, not so much about repeats. And possible that TV directors are not as important as stage directors or movie directors.

Jumping back to the joke about Scarlet Pomers, Wang might have been refused because Berman was sure he was too young. Or Wang was blackballed because a senior actor said he/she wouldn't take direction from the snotnosed kid. Or because Berman had already contracted the rest of the directing slots.

All of these would be embarrassing to explain openly, but not deeply objectionable. Again, the point is that getting indignant at Wang for daring to complain is just loopy.

 

[Jonesy]

Number6 said:
^^You seem to make this statement based on the notion that actors, directors and producers are equals. They are not. We have no idea why Wang didn't get to direct, but there wouldn't be any guarantee that he would automatically be entitled in any event. There is always some level of politics and cliques on any set, and if Wang was really interested in directing, all indications from stories by cast and crew were that he wasn't showing any initiative.

I think that's entirely why it doesn't matter whether or not he was blocked or prevented by studio "politics" or any other factor. If he wasn't interested in putting in extra work aside from his commitments as an actor, politics are kind of irrelevant. Again, if he didn't want to put in extra time on the set, would you really blame the exec producer?

 

[number6]

Jonesy said:

Number6 said:
^^You seem to make this statement based on the notion that actors, directors and producers are equals. They are not. We have no idea why Wang didn't get to direct, but there wouldn't be any guarantee that he would automatically be entitled in any event. There is always some level of politics and cliques on any set, and if Wang was really interested in directing, all indications from stories by cast and crew were that he wasn't showing any initiative.

I think that's entirely why it doesn't matter whether or not he was blocked or prevented by studio "politics" or any other factor. If he wasn't interested in putting in extra work aside from his commitments as an actor, politics are kind of irrelevant. Again, if he didn't want to put in extra time on the set, would you really blame the exec producer?

Exactly my point.

 

[I Love Chakotay]

Isn't the point about him not putting in time on the set made moot by him clearly saying that there was no room around the Director's chair with McNeil, Dawson, and Russ all learning to direct at the same time? He does say that he thought it best to wait until they were done and dusted with the training simply because that was more practical. I can see that.

So, if people are saying he asked to direct but then didn't stick around when he wasn't needed on set, what do they expect? He's already said why he didn't ie: that he planned to do his training in the next round after McNeil, Dawson, and Russ

 

[exodus]

I Love Chakotay said:
Isn't the point about him not putting in time on the set made moot by him clearly saying that there was no room around the Director's chair with McNeil, Dawson, and Russ all learning to direct at the same time? He does say that he thought it best to wait until they were done and dusted with the training simply because that was more practical. I can see that.

So, if people are saying he asked to direct but then didn't stick around when he wasn't needed on set, what do they expect? He's already said why he didn't ie: that he planned to do his training in the next round after McNeil, Dawson, and Russ

But you also learn by observing.

I doubt Russ, McNiel & others would have minded him staying around to watch them work and get pointers. That's how interns and up & comers in the business learn their skills. Going home and waiting your turn never got anybody anywhere. If you want your career to advance, you have to take an active part in it. Nobody but nobody is going to sit around and hand you anything or call your number when it's time.

Garrett Wang simply has a bad work ethic.

 

[I Love Chakotay]

exodus said:

I Love Chakotay said:
Isn't the point about him not putting in time on the set made moot by him clearly saying that there was no room around the Director's chair with McNeil, Dawson, and Russ all learning to direct at the same time? He does say that he thought it best to wait until they were done and dusted with the training simply because that was more practical. I can see that.

So, if people are saying he asked to direct but then didn't stick around when he wasn't needed on set, what do they expect? He's already said why he didn't ie: that he planned to do his training in the next round after McNeil, Dawson, and Russ

But you also learn by observing.

I doubt Russ, McNiel & others would have minded him staying around to watch them work and get pointers. That's how interns and up & comers in the business learn their skills. Going home and waiting your turn never got anybody anywhere. If you want your career to advance, you have to take an active part in it. Nobody but nobody is going to sit around and hand you anything or call your number when it's time.

Garrett Wang simply has a bad work ethic.

I prefer to think he was inexperienced - maybe even naive - and just didn't see it that way, and thought he was doing the best thing at the time. Life is a big learning curve and looking back on some of the things I mistakenly - but with the best intentions - did and didn't do on my first proper job still make me cringe to this day

 

[stj]

Every working actor has put in hours and hours observing directors at work.

The value of a few extra hours, other than to get attention for your "efforts," is moot.

When a senior actor is trying to earn brownie points for extra time, horning in on his/her action may well not be received kindly.

Interns take a lot of crap acting as gophers in the hope that they'll learn something and in the certainty that they'll have an official credit on the resume. An actor is not in that position. In fact, taking crap may lower respect for the actor, and harm his/her acting career. Did you think would-be stars and real stars have an entourage just for the company? For actors, image is everything.

The assertion that Wang has a bad work ethic is supported only by a suspension for tardies. There is no evidence offered the lesson wasn't learned.

Speaking of punctuality, Paris tells Kim, twice, he admires Kim's punctuality, in Favorite Son. Obviously this is a taunt. Reflects poorly on the producers as people in my opinion, but Favorite Son also portrays Kim in promiscuous relations with women. I've also read stories that Wang brought girlfriends to the set. Since the producers taunted Wang with tardiness, does Favorite Son also taunt him with the harpy "girlfriends" who turn on Kim? The very same episode after all. If the early tardiness is relevant, wouldn't that be?

 

[exodus]

I Love Chakotay said:

exodus said:

I Love Chakotay said:
Isn't the point about him not putting in time on the set made moot by him clearly saying that there was no room around the Director's chair with McNeil, Dawson, and Russ all learning to direct at the same time? He does say that he thought it best to wait until they were done and dusted with the training simply because that was more practical. I can see that.

So, if people are saying he asked to direct but then didn't stick around when he wasn't needed on set, what do they expect? He's already said why he didn't ie: that he planned to do his training in the next round after McNeil, Dawson, and Russ

But you also learn by observing.

I doubt Russ, McNiel & others would have minded him staying around to watch them work and get pointers. That's how interns and up & comers in the business learn their skills. Going home and waiting your turn never got anybody anywhere. If you want your career to advance, you have to take an active part in it. Nobody but nobody is going to sit around and hand you anything or call your number when it's time.

Garrett Wang simply has a bad work ethic.

I prefer to think he was inexperienced - maybe even naive - and just didn't see it that way, and thought he was doing the best thing at the time. Life is a big learning curve and looking back on some of the things I mistakenly - but with the best intentions - did and didn't do on my first proper job still make me cringe to this day

That I understand but from your own experances(..and mine as well) you didn't blame anybody for them other than yourself.

That's the issue I think many have with Garrett.

He's putting blame on Berman when the fault was his own.