Garak and "In the Pale Moonlight" (*Spoilers*)

[Too Much Fun]

Where's that Garak bandwagon, 'cause I think I'm ready to jump on! Ever since I joined the forum, I've always found all the Garak worship a little baffling and undeserved. When I was first introduced to the character, I was really annoyed by how talkative and arrogant he was and I still am sometimes, but he's grown on me over time. Now I've just watched "In The Pale Moonlight" for the first time and for once I actually admire the character. When I realized what he had done as Sisko was running to chastise him for it, I literally yelled out loud, "GARAK DID IT! GARAK RULES!". What a brilliant scheme by Garak!

I've been very curious about this episode as it seems to be both popular and controversial around here. A lot of people named it as "episode you've watched the most times", I've heard repeatedly about the "fake" line (I was waiting for it the whole episode and had a huge satisfied grin on my face when it finally came), and read many comments putting down Avery Brooks' performance in it as too hammy.

I agree with both the good and bad things said about it. The line is indeed wonderful and Brooks is indeed WAY over-the-top (but still not as bad as in "Far Beyond the Stars", which I think is the absolute pinnacle of his overacting). I got a little annoyed with the episode at times because of Sisko's hammy monologues and was all set to come on here and denounce it as overrated, but the "fake" line and Garak's GENIUS scheme made it unforgettable in the best way for me.

Like "Whispers", this is an episode I was iffy on...an episode where I felt like whether or not I can consider it a total success (in spite of all the positives along the way) overall depends on if the ending is strong enough for me to overlook its flaws. I wanted an ending that justifies the fact that the episode seems to be building towards something big, which all too often results in a disappointing cop-out of a resolution. To my relief, this ending delivered in spades.

I was feeling like this Dominon War stuff and Garak's endless rambling are starting to wear a little thin. With one season left to go, I was thinking I may not be able to tolerate either of these things much longer. Due to this general burnout with the Dominon arc (and other reasons which I'll mention in another thread), I've been skipping around in this season a bit and not watching every single episode, but all the talk about this one made me think it must be a 'can't miss' episode. It sure was. It really restored my interest and appreciation towards Garak and the war arc. Thank you to everyone who recommended it so much. There may be hope for me yet.

 

[Jono]

"It's a fake" is singularly the most overrated quote from the entire series. Other than that its an okay episode, not in my personal top 5, or even 10 but in my top 20.

 

[JustKate]

Hmmm, I personally don't worship Garak - I enjoy the character, but even now, I wouldn't trust him any farther than I could throw him, and probably not even that far! But I am glad he is on DS9 - he adds an enormous dimension to the show.

 

[pimp]

Garak rules
i think the best line from him is in my signature

 

[RyuRoots]

Garak is terrific from "The Wire" onward if you ask me. He gets a surprising amount of development throughout the show. I love the way he talks and his conversations with Julian and others.

 

[Anticitizen]

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=HXWQIiFxjbc&NR=1

 

[RyuRoots]

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=HXWQIiFxjbc&NR=1

Dear lord, that is terrible. Yet I can't stop laughing.

 

[TheGodBen]

Somebody started a topic about my favourite Trek character and my favourite trek episode? I'll have to try really hard to tone down my adoration.

Garak was okay for his first few episodes, but he became a great character in The Wire and from that point on he was fantastic, particularly in Improbable Cause/The Die is Cast and In the Pale Moonlight. I can understand why you wouldn't like him for being arrogant, but as an arrogant git myself Garak is the person I most admire in Trek.

As for In the Pale Moonlight itself, I loved the episode even before the twist ending, but that sure did knock it out of the park. I don't think that Brooks is overly-hammy as Sisko, I think he reached just the right level of hamminess and that final scene is my favourite scene in Sta Trek.

 

[willg]

This is definitely an episode that Roddenberry (if he was alive) would have objected to. I think the Zimmerman Telegraph is the inspiration for this story, isn't it? I like the dilemma Sisko faces here, he knows that the Romulans have been brought into the war by illegitimate means, but deep down he knows that the Federation and Klingons need the Romulans to help defeat the Dominion.

Garak changed a lot between 1993 and 1999. I liked that he was given a more well-rounded character and that the writers found ways to place him in plotlines.

 

[Navaros]

I don't think Brooks was hammy at all in ITPM, but he certainly was way over-the-top hammy in FBTS.

Brooks' monologues in ITPM are uniformly brilliant. They are a large part of why ITPM is not only hands-down the very best DS9 episode, but also hands-down the very best Star Trek episode ever made.

As for the Dominion 'wearing thin', that's an oxymoron. The Dominion are amazing, and every second they are on-screen is amazing. One of the things wrong with DS9 is that it could have used more Dominion.

 

[Michael]

Gods, I love the character of Garak and the episode In The Pale Moonlight so much that I fail to put it into words. Watch Andrew Robinson as Garak and you watch a genius at work. Nothing I can say could possibly express the adoration I feel for the actor and the character.

This is definitely an episode that Roddenberry (if he was alive) would have objected to.

I'm not so sure about that. Some people close to him have been reported to say that they think he would have liked Deep Space Nine. But then again, why is it important whether he would have liked the series anyway?

EDIT: Oh, and Too Much, it's cute that you put the word Spoilers in the thread title of a thread that's about an episode that's eleven years old!

 

[Anwar]

Frankly, I never really got the love for this particular episode when I kept hearing about how it was "the best ever". Sisko was pretty hammy (but hell, that's fundamentally a part of him...), Garak's scheme was hardly perfect (wouldn't the Romulans be able to track the shuttle back to DS9?), and Sisko acts like he killed Vreenak himself. The worst thing Sisko did was bribe some dudes and make a fake simulation, he hardly is to blame for the whole assassination thing.

I might've liked it more if Sisko became more Machiavellian as a result, or at least was more bitter in episodes afterwards (self-loathing for violating his code of ethics or something). Also, this episode flies in the face of "Far Beyond the Stars", wherein Sisko keeps going about "the dream cannot be allowed to die", and then in this story he destroys that dream himself.

 

[Too Much Fun]

EDIT: Oh, and Too Much, it's cute that you put the word Spoilers in the thread title of a thread that's about an episode that's eleven years old!

Well I debated whether or not I should. Ultimately I made the decision for the benefit of people like trentman (or if there's anybody else here like he or I) who is at the moment watching the series all the way through season by season for the first time.

Also, I want to clarify that while I did praise the "fake" line, I do understand why some people might find it irritating. I enjoyed the corniness of it, but at the same time there was a part of my brain asking, "why oh why did he have to give such a wacky reading of the line that is supposed to be the most important moment of the show?" I mean here we have the suspense building up so intensely with Sisko's fear about whether the ruse will work and then when the pivotal moment comes, we get a line reading that cannot possibly be taken seriously.

I imagine it must have taken a lot of willpower for Avery Brooks to not burst into laughter upon hearing it. Despite the serious context of it, I don't see how anyone hearing that line could take it seriously the way it was read. I've liked Stephen McHattie a lot in other movies and TV shows, but I wonder what the hell he was thinking there. I guess Romulans have always been characters that are supposed to have a unique way of speaking, but this was overdoing it a bit.

 

[Bisz]

EDIT: Oh, and Too Much, it's cute that you put the word Spoilers in the thread title of a thread that's about an episode that's eleven years old!

Well I debated whether or not I should. Ultimately I made the decision for the benefit of people like trentman (or if there's anybody else here like he or I) who is at the moment watching the series all the way through season by season for the first time.

Also, I want to clarify that while I did praise the "fake" line, I do understand why some people might find it irritating. I enjoyed the corniness of it, but at the same time there was a part of my brain asking, "why oh why did he have to give such a wacky reading of the line that is supposed to be the most important moment of the show?" I mean here we have the suspense building up so intensely with Sisko's fear about whether the ruse will work and then when the pivotal moment comes, we get a line reading that cannot possibly be taken seriously.

I imagine it must have taken a lot of willpower for Avery Brooks to not burst into laughter upon hearing it. Despite the serious context of it, I don't see how anyone hearing that line could take it seriously the way it was read. I've liked Stephen McHattie a lot in other movies and TV shows, but I wonder what the hell he was thinking there. I guess Romulans have always been characters that are supposed to have a unique way of speaking, but this was overdoing it a bit.

How do you think it should have been read?

Honest question, not a jab at you. The line seemed fine to me the way it was read and I never really contemplated an alternate reading of it, but now that you have brought it up, I gave it some thought and can't really come up with anything better.

Disregard everything thats not bolded, use it only to get the idea of how the line is said:

"Dude... did you really think that we wouldn't find out that its a fake, gimmie a break!?

"Like my left nut, its a fake."

 

[Navaros]

^

I didn't even know that that line was a pop culture sensation until I read about it on these boards, because the first time I saw ITPM it seemed perfectly in keeping with the situation to me.

They had to express his outrage very clearly to let the audience know that the Sisko is in some deep crap. Additionally, they made the point both very effectively in a very brief amount of time, so that they could spend that precious time on other important things too. Having him have a long conversation about it would have meant they had to leave other things out of the episode, and that would suck.

 

[JustKate]

^ I have to say I really liked it too. It doesn't seem in the least bit forced to me, not considering the magnitude of what was going on. Understatement is fine in the right place, but this wasn't the right place.

Oedipus gets a little overwrought when he finds out he's accidentally killed his own father and married his own mother (if I remember correctly, he stabs out his own eyes)...but I think that was understandable, too, giving the circumstances.

I sometimes wonder if some people find it funny because they think they're supposed to? They expect it to be overdone, and so they see it as overdone even if it really isn't - kind of like people who laugh everytime a commedian uses the f-word, even if the f-word isn't really all that funny.

 

[CommanderRaytas]

Garak rules
i think the best line from him is in my signature

True. Cardassians rock.

The episode is great, apart from Mr. holier-than-thou Sisko. *yeuch*

 

[TheGodBen]

I think that "It's a FAAAAAAKE!" makes sense within the context of the episode and I don't remember it standing out when I first watched it. When you see the clip on its own you don't understand the context and it does sound really overdone and weird, but that's true of a lot of things on television, such as this clip from TNG.

 

[ltcmmanderdata]

i always enjoyed the character of garak. he was very interesting.

 

[Temis the Vorta]

Well I debated whether or not I should. Ultimately I made the decision for the benefit of people like trentman (or if there's anybody else here like he or I) who is at the moment watching the series all the way through season by season for the first time.

Just listing the episode title should do that. It isn't plausible that we wouldn't be talking about the episode, right?

Gods, I love the character of Garak and the episode In The Pale Moonlight so much that I fail to put it into words. Watch Andrew Robinson as Garak and you watch a genius at work. Nothing I can say could possibly express the adoration I feel for the actor and the character.

The only Trek character who beats him in my book is the one and only Spock.