First Contact - 20 Year Anniversary

[Gingerbread Demon]

I have a fondness for The Devil's Heart myself. In college, I wrote a "missing chapter" for the book that revealed the Ko N'ya had been on Earth as the Holy Grail. I was on a Holy Grail kick at the time (I had written a paper in my freshman English class about the myth). The idea, as I remember it, was that it one of its journeys from one Alpha Quadrant power to another, the ship crashed on Earth (creating the Waste Land), and it "ascended" back into space at the end of the Grail knights' Quest. (In other words, another ship recovered it using a tractor beam.) I don't have the story any more -- that was over twenty years ago, and things get lost over time.

I really like that...

It's for me one of those novels I can read, and then months later read again and still enjoy it. It had to me a "film story" which would have suited a huge big budget film with all the little historical bits about the KoN'ya's various journeys through space, especially all that stuff with the Iconians and such.

I haven't got my copy handy at the moment but was the stone part of the Guardian Of Forever?

 

[Allyn Gibson]

I really like that...

Thanks! I wish the story still existed. I remember thinking that the book felt like it was missing an Earth interlude, and that I had the Grail story on my mind, and things fell into place. It wasn't very long, ten or eleven pages. I remember sitting in the library writing it out in on notebook paper.

It's for me one of those novels I can read, and then months later read again and still enjoy it. It had to me a "film story" which would have suited a huge big budget film with all the little historical bits about the KoN'ya's various journeys through space, especially all that stuff with the Iconians and such.

I can see that. I also liked the "historical bits." I liked it when we got hints about the deep past. Things like that made it feel like the galaxy had a history.

I haven't got my copy handy at the moment but was the stone part of the Guardian Of Forever?

Something like that. A shard of it or something. And it went through a wormhole where it would "plant" on a planet and grow into another.

 

[Ghost]

When this movie came out it was one of my favorite Star Trek movies for a long time, much better than Generations before it, and Insurrection and Nemesis after it.

But now looking back at it after all these years I realize that I liked this movie mostly for the visual spectacle than really the storyline.
As other people have pointed it, it feels like two different stories put together with one mostly playing on the background until it becomes of somewhat importance again later near the ending.

I am not a big fan of time travel stories (any more), and I rather wish this movie had just solely focused on a story in which the Enterprise crew had to save the Federation once again from assimilation by the Borg Collective in the present day.
The Collective going back to even prevent First Contact does not even make much sense, the Borg would want the Federation to arise so that they can assimilate its advanced technologies and resources.
Humanity or the Federation for that matter is not a threat to them at all, warranting the Collective to go back in time and "defeat" humanity before it becomes a warp capable civilization.

The ground scenes were also rather disappointing, like someone else here I also thought after seeing the trailer that the Enterprise crew would face the Borg both in space and on Earth.

Looking back I don't think any of the TNG movies are really good.
I wish I had more deeper thoughts to tell like some of the other posters here.

 

[Gingerbread Demon]

Yeah OK now that a few of you have mentioned this and I have thought about it can I join you guys in wondering what's the point of the Borg stopping First Contact?

Sure they get to assimilate Earth in the past. But what's the point? 2063 technology won't help them.

Remember after the sphere had vanished the Earth changed right before their eyes. The ship's sensors showed the planet had been assimilated.

So howcome when they arrived at the sphere's destination things hadn't changed?

 

[Smellmet]

When this movie came out it was one of my favorite Star Trek movies for a long time, much better than Generations before it, and Insurrection and Nemesis after it.

But now looking back at it after all these years I realize that I liked this movie mostly for the visual spectacle than really the storyline.
As other people have pointed it, it feels like two different stories put together with one mostly playing on the background until it becomes of somewhat importance again later near the ending.

I am not a big fan of time travel stories (any more), and I rather wish this movie had just solely focused on a story in which the Enterprise crew had to save the Federation once again from assimilation by the Borg Collective in the present day.
The Collective going back to even prevent First Contact does not even make much sense, the Borg would want the Federation to arise so that they can assimilate its advanced technologies and resources.
Humanity or the Federation for that matter is not a threat to them at all, warranting the Collective to go back in time and "defeat" humanity before it becomes a warp capable civilization.

The ground scenes were also rather disappointing, like someone else here I also thought after seeing the trailer that the Enterprise crew would face the Borg both in space and on Earth.

Looking back I don't think any of the TNG movies are really good.
I wish I had more deeper thoughts to tell like some of the other posters here.

You've summed up quite well the problems I have with the film. The ground scenes and some of the Enterprise sets are the bits of the film that screamed 'low budget' to me. Like you, I like FC these days for it's entertainment value - it's still a good rollicking adventure, but time hasn't been kind to it in my eyes and the silly plot holes make the film come off as very superficial to me. It's still a good Trek film, but it's slipped down my rankings in the last few years. I don't think it's much if any better than Generations, depending on my mood and what I fancy watching at the time.

Yeah OK now that a few of you have mentioned this and I have thought about it can I join you guys in wondering what's the point of the Borg stopping First Contact?

Sure they get to assimilate Earth in the past. But what's the point? 2063 technology won't help them.

Remember after the sphere had vanished the Earth changed right before their eyes. The ship's sensors showed the planet had been assimilated.

So howcome when they arrived at the sphere's destination things hadn't changed?

Because technobabble.

 

[Gingerbread Demon]

Because technobabble.

I thought they called it Treknobabble

 

[Smellmet]

I thought they called it Treknobabble

Either way it was a load of mumbo-jumbo (as is a lot of Trek to be fair)

 

[jaime]

Yeah OK now that a few of you have mentioned this and I have thought about it can I join you guys in wondering what's the point of the Borg stopping First Contact?

Sure they get to assimilate Earth in the past. But what's the point? 2063 technology won't help them.

Remember after the sphere had vanished the Earth changed right before their eyes. The ship's sensors showed the planet had been assimilated.

So howcome when they arrived at the sphere's destination things hadn't changed?

Because the Borg saw humanity as a threat, it was no longer just about assimilation, certainly not of tech...they wanted human behaviour for their collective as much as anything.

Nothing has changed when they get to the Spheres destination, because the Borg have not yet actually stopped first contact, and when the enterprise follows them back it ensures it happens.

Why first contact? Because as they say, Earth at this point is weak and first contact is the tipping point for its development in regards to the rest of its future. For a minimum of work, they get the Alpha and Beta quadrants basically.

It's pretty much all explained in the dialogue on the bridge as the sphere goes back. There's no plot hole there certainly. (Well, there's a bit of fraying around why not even earlier in history, but that's easily addressed with a bit of extrapolation in story terms, and we know the production reasons)

I will be honest...if that set up is too much technobabble for people, I can probably recommend some romantic comedies, but they should avoid The Lake House or The Time Travellers Wife. Or The Girl Who Leapt Through Time.

 

[Gingerbread Demon]

Because the Borg saw humanity as a threat, it was no longer just about assimilation, certainly not of tech...they wanted human behaviour for their collective as much as anything.

Nothing has changed when they get to the Spheres destination, because the Borg have not yet actually stopped first contact, and when the enterprise follows them back it ensures it happens.

Why first contact? Because as they say, Earth at this point is weak and first contact is the tipping point for its development in regards to the rest of its future. For a minimum of work, they get the Alpha and Beta quadrants basically.

It's pretty much all explained in the dialogue on the bridge as the sphere goes back. There's no plot hole there certainly. (Well, there's a bit of fraying around why not even earlier in history, but that's easily addressed with a bit of extrapolation in story terms, and we know the production reasons)

I will be honest...if that set up is too much technobabble for people, I can probably recommend some romantic comedies, but they should avoid The Lake House or The Time Travellers Wife. Or The Girl Who Leapt Through Time.

Oh no I liked the movie.. I watch it every few months.

It's just that bit of the plot niggles at me. If they saw Earth changed before they left how far did the change ripple?

Was there now a Borg Starfleet?

 

[jaime]

Oh no I liked the movie.. I watch it every few months.

It's just that bit of the plot niggles at me. If they saw Earth changed before they left how far did the change ripple?

Was there now a Borg Starfleet?

Starfleet probably never came into existence. No warp travel. And the sphere could have just sat there and waited for reinforcements from Borg space in that century. The whole federation probably had its lunch eaten and then some.

 

[Ghost]

Because the Borg saw humanity as a threat, it was no longer just about assimilation, certainly not of tech...they wanted human behaviour for their collective as much as anything.

But humanity is not that exceptional, there are much more advanced civilizations that have a higher resistance factor. The Borg have mentioned that themselves.

Only in First Contact and in some of the Voyager episodes the Borg suddenly developed this big interest in humanity, and to be honest that was a sign of bad writing.

Why should a super organism like the Borg Collective care for some distant species that is biologically and in most regards technologically inferior to them?
They don't even send fleets to assimilate Earth, that should tell how high on the list of assimilation humanity is.

 

[jaime]

But humanity is not that exceptional, there are much more advanced civilizations that have a higher resistance factor. The Borg have mentioned that themselves.

Only in First Contact and in some of the Voyager episodes the Borg suddenly developed this big interest in humanity, and to be honest that was a sign of bad writing.

Why should a super organism like the Borg Collective care for some distant species that is biologically and in most regards technologically inferior to them?
They don't even send fleets to assimilate Earth, that should tell how high on the list of assimilation humanity is.

You can say it's bad writing (that is subjective to be honest) but the Borg made it personal to humanity in The Best Of Both Worlds, and more so, to Picard (as is revealed in First Contact.) They didn't assimilate the federation, (as would be more sound logically and tactically, they didn't even try for a starship.) they went straight for Earth. The Borg are pretty consistent from that point on. It's a slight retcon over Q-Who and their ultimate consumer, but it's a necessary step to keep using them.

Why do they want us? Who knows. Genetic material...we are good at breeding with alien species. Our potential...even the Q seem to believe we have something. Ultimately because the show is about us. It's literally like trying to look into the mind of god...it doesn't matter why, when they are on your doorstep for some unknown reason, you kind of have to deal with the issue.

They don't send fleets because historically they haven't needed fleets. But pesky humans and federation...we keep overcoming that technological superiority somehow. We have even made things like VGer happen. We are snowflakes.

Which is probably why they want to add our biological distinctiveness to their own. The Queen is a bunny boiler who hated being rejected by Picard, though frankly, if she wanted to get that personal with him she could have bought him dinner first.

(Short version, the Borg want assimilate our plot armour, theirs has been breaking ever since BoBW)

 

[Turd Ferguson]

Yeah OK now that a few of you have mentioned this and I have thought about it can I join you guys in wondering what's the point of the Borg stopping First Contact?

Sure they get to assimilate Earth in the past. But what's the point? 2063 technology won't help them.

Remember after the sphere had vanished the Earth changed right before their eyes. The ship's sensors showed the planet had been assimilated.

So howcome when they arrived at the sphere's destination things hadn't changed?

True, 2063's technology won't help the Borg, but, when you have the state of the art Sovereign-class Enterprise-E with Captain Locutus hearing all your plans in his brain, the Borg gets the, umm... Best of Both Worlds, if you will Not only is humanity not a threat anymore and is also a part of your collective, but you also have a freshly assimilated Federation flagship in your possession. As well as Federation battle plans and strategies that can be used against other Alpha/Beta/Gamma/Delta Quadrant races. Well, until Data fucked that all up, that is.

 

[Gingerbread Demon]

True, 2063's technology won't help the Borg, but, when you have the state of the art Sovereign-class Enterprise-E with Captain Locutus hearing all your plans in his brain, the Borg gets the, umm... Best of Both Worlds, if you will Not only is humanity not a threat anymore and is also a part of your collective, but you also have a freshly assimilated Federation flagship in your possession. As well as Federation battle plans and strategies that can be used against other Alpha/Beta/Gamma/Delta Quadrant races. Well, until Data fucked that all up, that is.

Yeah if it wasn't for that rather convenient coolant tank....

Do the Borg have an actual homeworld, a planet that they originated from?

 

[suarezguy]

Because the Borg saw humanity as a threat, it was no longer just about assimilation, certainly not of tech...they wanted human behaviour for their collective as much as anything.

Why first contact? Because as they say, Earth at this point is weak and first contact is the tipping point for its development in regards to the rest of its future. For a minimum of work, they get the Alpha and Beta quadrants basically.

I don't know, those seem a little inconsistent. I like the idea that the Borg tend to expend the minimum amount of resources on a mission, that explains why send only one cube, but if they thought of humanity as a big threat it would, after they previously came close to succeeding with one cube, make more sense to just send two or a few more and easily completely win.
But it does still make sense that, after being beaten twice (or being beaten once and so having time travel as a contingent plan the second time) the Borg decide that it's better to just prevent the Federation even if that means not getting some of the 24th century Federation technology.

 

[Turd Ferguson]

I don't know, those seem a little inconsistent. I like the idea that the Borg tend to expend the minimum amount of resources on a mission, that explains why send only one cube, but if they thought of humanity as a big threat it would, after they previously came close to succeeding with one cube, make more sense to just send two or a few more and easily completely win.
But it does still make sense that, after being beaten twice (or being beaten once and so having time travel as a contingent plan the second time) the Borg decide that it's better to just prevent the Federation even if that means not getting some of the 24th century Federation technology.

But, in the "Stop First Contact" scenario, they DO get the 24th century tech on top of assimilating Earth when it's hit rock bottom: they assimilate the aforementioned Enterprise-E that followed them back AND get Locutus and gain a Data

 

[Gingerbread Demon]

Haha this got me wondering what a Borgified USS Enterprise would look like had the Borg got the Federation in Kirk's time.

 

[gamer1]

First Trek movie I was old enough to watch. In Sweden where I am from Star Trek is hardly popular so They don't show Trek movies on Cinema. But they did a try with First Contact and it was quite the success. I remember how it was incredibly cinematic compared to the tv show Voyager which was on TV at the time. Then FC came, and they put that on the cinema too and nobody saw it, well except me and my father. That was that and Nemesis wasn't put on the big screen.

 

[Decker1017]

Today is the 22nd of November 2016, 20 years to the day since the US release of First Contact, or Star Trek VIII.

In my opinion this was the pinnacle event in the best year (30!) of Trek. A beautiful new ship, a bolder and more matured vision of the TNG cast as well as new uniforms for Starfleet personnel, which would carry over to the two concurrently running series', DS9 and Voyager.

It was an exciting time to be alive for a Trek fan. My anniversary won't come until the 28th November, Australia's release date.

This was all at once a fun, yet horrifying film. By far the best of TNG films. The battle scene & characters were great. And who wouldn't want to command, crew, stow away, on that beautiful Sovereign Class vessel!!!?????