Final two parter

[john titor]

First half excellent, second half --bbbbbbbbeeeeeeeeeeeehhhhhhhhhhh!!!!!!!!!!!

Problems with second half

1. War ended too quickly (due to budget?)
2. The Dukat scenes could have been extended greatly. I mean come on this is a really cool intergalactic tyrant, he should have tortured Sisco for at least 15 minutes and given long speeches on being evil and why its so cool to be evil. In fact he should have used his super powers to destroy DS9 from the planet or something similarly malign.
3. The flashback sequences were so lame. That was just filler.
4. Lot of filler scenes with Quark and the crew standing around, looking at their watches, waiting for the show to end.

DS9 didn't end badly, at least it tied up all the loose ends and it made some sense according to the logic of plot resolution but the second half was diluted of any grandiosity.

 

[NCC-1701-B]

I felt the same way watching it yesterday on virgin 1, i guess you did too...

I was hoping to see some really good battle scenes against the dominion, but odo does his jelly trick and its all over? come on. bit of an anticlimax.

Also, i was hoping to see the second part of Equinox tonight but instead, theyve put TNG on... I hope its the later series, or i will be pissed off. the amount of times i have seen farpoint, or mr crushers picard machine...

 

[Thor Damar]

Ah come oh, admit it you loved the KosstDukat scene as much as I did.

"You are pathetic!"

"Then how com you the one on his knees?"

 

[john titor]

Ah come oh, admit it you loved the KosstDukat scene as much as I did.

"You are pathetic!"

"Then how com you the one on his knees?"

oh absolutely, my point is that those scenes could have been extended. Dukat was one of the best, if not the best character in DS9 and the actor who portrayed him did an excellent job. That scene you mention is brilliant, but it would have been even better if he shot energy at Sisco repeatedly, lift him up into the air jedi style and slammed him against the cave wall. It was cool the way he disposed of Kai Winn, "oh you're still here," loved that line.

 

[Thor Damar]

Ah come oh, admit it you loved the KosstDukat scene as much as I did.

"You are pathetic!"

"Then how com you the one on his knees?"

oh absolutely, my point is that those scenes could have been extended. Dukat was one of the best, if not the best character in DS9 and the actor who portrayed him did an excellent job. That scene you mention is brilliant, but it would have been even better if he shot energy at Sisco repeatedly, lift him up into the air jedi style and slammed him against the cave wall. It was cool the way he disposed of Kai Winn, "oh you're still here," loved that line.

Indeed, letting Dukat the supervillian out was damn cool and he should have done the Standard Cardassian Monologue(TM), for even longer.

Also this Line:

"you certainly have a talent for picking the losing side..."

 

[john titor]

Yar. As much I was wanted Dukat to win, that was the turning point in the episode. I would have preferred if he survived and was restored leader of the Cardassian empire, it would have been funny.

Also Damar was another excellent character, complex in the respect that he was noble yet very flawed, his adherence to political dogma was his greatest strength and weakness. Garak obviously gets a mention. I think the Cardassians are probably the best race in ST, they're assholes yet not.

 

[Damask]

DS9 didn't end badly, at least it tied up all the loose ends and it made some sense according to the logic of plot resolution but the second half was diluted of any grandiosity.

Eh, Kira and Jake looking out and the pullback makes it for me. I even enjoyed the flashbacks. I enjoyed the fact that after 9 "final" episodes the characters were allowed to decompress. To hang out at Quarks, to say goodbye etc.

I can see where you're coming from and it's not perfect but I still love it.

 

[Anthony Sabre]

WYLB did end poorly. Behr's obsession with bad endings got the better of this episode. There was no need for Sisko to die or leave in the end. After seven years of the Emissary crap, why not just let him go on with life? They should have resolved the Emissary stuff earlier in the season and focused completely on the war.

 

[Navaros]

I agree with the OP, although I say WYLB has big problems of being way too rushed in both parts not just part II.

 

[Damask]

They should have resolved the Emissary stuff earlier in the season and focused completely on the war.

That's where we differ I think. I never thought DS9 should have been all about the war. In fact I probably would have preferred the war to end an episode earlier and have WYLB be about Sisko, The Emissary/Prophets, Bajor's entry to the Federation and the goodbyes.

 

[JoeD80]

1. War ended too quickly (due to budget?)

According to the DS9 companion it was a studio edict that the war couldn't be in the second half.

3. The flashback sequences were so lame. That was just filler.

They lasted all of 90 seconds, so I would hardly classify it as "filler."

 

[BenRoethig]

WYLB did end poorly. Behr's obsession with bad endings got the better of this episode. There was no need for Sisko to die or leave in the end. After seven years of the Emissary crap, why not just let him go on with life? They should have resolved the Emissary stuff earlier in the season and focused completely on the war.

They left it completely open for that to happen. Remember, time has no meaning where he is and Sisko could return at any time.

 

[Anthony Sabre]

WYLB did end poorly. Behr's obsession with bad endings got the better of this episode. There was no need for Sisko to die or leave in the end. After seven years of the Emissary crap, why not just let him go on with life? They should have resolved the Emissary stuff earlier in the season and focused completely on the war.

They left it completely open for that to happen. Remember, time has no meaning where he is and Sisko could return at any time.

True, but that's not the ending I wanted to see. Don't get me wrong, the pull back shot with Jake and Kira was very touching. But what I wanted was Sisko standing there with Jake or sitting in his office, tossing the baseball up one last time. I just felt him "leaving" at the end as heavy handed. Forcing some sadness into a finale that didn't need it.

 

[john titor]

WYLB did end poorly. Behr's obsession with bad endings got the better of this episode. There was no need for Sisko to die or leave in the end. After seven years of the Emissary crap, why not just let him go on with life? They should have resolved the Emissary stuff earlier in the season and focused completely on the war.

They left it completely open for that to happen. Remember, time has no meaning where he is and Sisko could return at any time.

True, but that's not the ending I wanted to see. Don't get me wrong, the pull back shot with Jake and Kira was very touching. But what I wanted was Sisko standing there with Jake or sitting in his office, tossing the baseball up one last time. I just felt him "leaving" at the end as heavy handed. Forcing some sadness into a finale that didn't need it.

The sad aspect though was established a few episodes back when the Prophets told him not to marry whoever it was he married. What I can't understand is why did he contact her from the wormhole and not his son?! I mean he should have contacted both.

 

[Thor Damar]

Yar. As much I was wanted Dukat to win, that was the turning point in the episode. I would have preferred if he survived and was restored leader of the Cardassian empire, it would have been funny.

Also Damar was another excellent character, complex in the respect that he was noble yet very flawed, his adherence to political dogma was his greatest strength and weakness. Garak obviously gets a mention. I think the Cardassians are probably the best race in ST, they're assholes yet not.

Absolutely agreed on all the points made there, especially the arseholes bit!

 

[Praetorian]

A shame they didn't show Bajor joining the Federation..wasn't that the point of the mission in DS9? Also more Dukat and less clips/vic's would be nice...

 

[Jono]

The sad aspect though was established a few episodes back when the Prophets told him not to marry whoever it was he married. What I can't understand is why did he contact her from the wormhole and not his son?! I mean he should have contacted both.

That is really my only beef with the finale. The relationship between Ben and Jake was one of the strongest points of the show that it was a mistake in my eyes that they did not have Ben say goodbye to Jake as well. The only good thing to come out of it was the relaunch novel, Rising Son, which is probably my favourite relaunch work.

Other then that I have no problem with the finale...except for killing Damar.

 

[Thor Damar]

The sad aspect though was established a few episodes back when the Prophets told him not to marry whoever it was he married. What I can't understand is why did he contact her from the wormhole and not his son?! I mean he should have contacted both.

That is really my only beef with the finale. The relationship between Ben and Jake was one of the strongest points of the show that it was a mistake in my eyes that they did not have Ben say goodbye to Jake as well. The only good thing to come out of it was the relaunch novel, Rising Son, which is probably my favourite relaunch work.

Other then that I have no problem with the finale...except for killing Damar.

But he died so well...

"It was so artistically done..."

 

[john titor]

The sad aspect though was established a few episodes back when the Prophets told him not to marry whoever it was he married. What I can't understand is why did he contact her from the wormhole and not his son?! I mean he should have contacted both.

That is really my only beef with the finale. The relationship between Ben and Jake was one of the strongest points of the show that it was a mistake in my eyes that they did not have Ben say goodbye to Jake as well. The only good thing to come out of it was the relaunch novel, Rising Son, which is probably my favourite relaunch work.

Other then that I have no problem with the finale...except for killing Damar.

We can assume however that Sisco never really liked Jake, given that Jake was a failure in his eyes in becoming a "journalist" whose career was limited to pestering the staff while he lazed about like a bum on DS9. This is why he tried for another kid with whatshername because he wanted his next child to become a success by pursuing the career in starfleet that Jake never followed up. You could tell this when Sisco announces that whatshername is preggers and Jake looks on morosely. In the ST universe you are a second class citizen unless you join star fleet.

 

[Jono]

^ It's spelt "Sisko".