Final Ruling: Best Post-"Aliens" Franchise Sequel

[Vger23]

Stealing this thread idea from @Gaith who had a good idea to look at the Terminator franchise in the same way.

Not counting the AvP films, what film in the Alien franchise is your favorite after Alien and Aliens? It is a similar franchise to Terminator, in that you have the lower-budget classic, the big Cameron action sequel, and then a bunch of polarizing sequels that followed. Unlike many, I really like them all to some extent.

Alien3 is so damn dark and oppressive and so off-the-beaten-path that it really gets under my skin the way I want an Alien flick to. And I like that it had thebballs to go completely opposite expectations

Alien Resurrection has some interesting characters and I like seeing humans try to control and experiment on the xenomorphs. It's got some snappy dialogue and it's really frigging weird, which is fun.

Prometheus is such a visual masterpiece, and is more of a science fiction movie in the Alien universe than a straight-up Alien movie. I love the Shaw and David characters as well.

Alien Covenant is also a visual masterpiece, has good action, some genuine terror (more than the previous few films) and used the Alien3 card (well) of killing off a major character off screen and also having a tough ending.

Overall, I honestly have to go with the highly controversial opinion that Alien3 is my next favorite.

If you can get over the absolute shock of Hicks and Newt dying before the credits roll, this really is a unique and troubled masterpiece. It's claustrophobic, oppressive, moody, nihilistic, savage and unforgiving. It has some very good supporting characters (Dillon, Clemons, and Aaron are all interesting and well-performed). The setting is beautifully realized on this dank, run down planet. Ripley's character is so world-weary and defeated that it is a fascinating character development. The backstory of the prison, the convicts, the religious following they develop, and the raw, gritty redemption arc are all just fascinating to me. I also like how the menacing backdrop of the evil Company is the real villain in this film, moreso than the Xenomorph even.

Nothing is over-played like Alien Resurrection, much of which comes off as cartoonish. It's not the "Fuck yeah Marines!!!" sequel everyone seems to have wanted after the second film, which I think is actually in its favor. It also doesn't go too much into the "Alien Origin" territory like Scott's last two films.

I admit that I do prefer the Assembly Cut or whatever you call the extended version on the BR disk quadrilogy, but either way, it's a disturbing and unapologetic trip into hell, and I think it's great.

What say you?

A3

A: C
PRO



A: R

 

[M'rk son of Mogh]

Alien 3, I liked how different it was. It almost didn't fit in the universe (almost) and for some reason, that didn't bother me. It's a nice science fiction movie that happens to be squished into the alien franchise.

Considering I hated the other movies, especially Prometheus (so much so that I won't watch the follow up), it's not even a struggle for me to say that. Prometheus made me angry to have wasted my time and money on.

 

[Gaith]

Haven't seen 3, and have no interest in it. Could see myself watching Resurrection someday, but haven't.

For all their faults, I really like both Prometheus and Covenant, and have a hard time deciding between the two. Covenant is more fun, so I'd be more likely to revisit it, but it doesn't have any moment as brilliant as Prometheus' surgery pod scene. I guess I'll go with Covenant for its two Fassbenders, but only by a hair.

 

[Starbreaker]

Alien³. I also enjoy the others to some degree, except Covenant. Unnecessary.

 

[DWMarch]

I didn't like Alien 3 at all except for one scene, when Ripley goes screaming to the warden that "it's here! It's here!" He's in the middle of telling her to STFU when the xenomorph grabs him. That was awesome.

Alien Resurrection gave us Firefly, so it has that going for it. There was some good humor in the movie, Sigourney kicked a lot of ass and that was about it. The newborn sucked.

Although the AvP films aren't on your list, I did actually enjoy the first AvP, especially seeing the Queen in action at the end. AvP Requiem was not as good. Too dark, literally and figuratively.

Prometheus had some cool moments. I am not a fan of surgery scenes in general but it was well done. The Deacon looked absolutely terrible though.

I think Covenant was the best overall but the pacing is weird. I also don't really see David's experiments leading to the universe of Alien (although I guess he has time to refine his results as of the end of Covenant).

 

[The Wormhole]

Resurrection, but mostly because of the nostalgia attached to it since it was the first Alien movie I was able to see in theatres. To this day I still get warm fuzzy feelings when I watch it because of that. And it's the one movie in the franchise that's just fun. Good, solid, mindless fun.

Alien 3 isn't bad, but I do consider Resurrection a better movie. Prometheus and Covenant I enjoyed the first time I saw them, but they don't really hold up on repeated viewings.

 

[Timby]

Alien3 (the assembly cut, that is) is by far the best. Prometheus is one of Ridley Scott's most intense, philosophical and meaningful films. Covenant falls apart a bit in the last 25 minutes or so but there's so much to unpack in it and I love it.

Resurrection is utter trash with zero redeeming values whatsoever outside of some decent production design and casting.

 

[Relayer1]

Alien 3 is a franchise destroying turd that left me and my mate in the pub looking blankly at each other until one of us eventually muttered "How the **** could they do that ?".

Sadly it wasn't quite franchise destroying enough, and the films continued.

Someone keeps letting Ridley Scott make movies, which is a very bad idea. He had his lucky couple and all he's doing now is proving over and over that Alien and Blade Runner were flukes.

So, by default, I choose Resurrection, which may be flawed and a bit ridiculous, but is enjoyable and the best of the bunch.

 

[Cyrus]

easy choice: Prometheus. Really liked it. The others are just bad.

 

[Lord Garth]

Cutting and pasting something I posted elsewhere (not TrekBBS) back in 2017. Just to give you a sense of what I think of these movies. It's an oldie but a goodie...

How I rank the "Alien" movies:

1. Alien
2. Aliens
3. Prometheus
4. Alien 3
5. Alien Resurrection

-- insert gap --

Toenail Fungus
6-7. Alien vs. Predator (both of them)

-- insert gap --

The Food Poisoning I had in 2011 where I violently threw up 40 times, lost 20 pounds, and spent three days in the hospital, dehydrated, with my kidneys shut down, and an I.V. hooked up into my arm. There were times, during that, when I seriously thought I'd die.

-- insert yet another gap --

8. Alien: Covenant

 

[Tosk]

1. Alien 3 (Assembly Cut)
2. Prometheus
3. Alien 3 (Theatrical)
4. Alien Resurrection
4. Alien Covenant

 

[Mage]

Judging the first 4 Alien movies as a single entity is a bit unfair, since all 4 movies are so incredibly different.
Alien is a classic 70's horror movie, that builds on actual suspense and fear, not over the top gore like many modern horrormovies do.
Aliens was a classic 80's actionflick with horror and gore in it, but definitely much more actionmovie.
Alien3 (I like both cuts on the dvd) is almost a sort of 90's EuroNoir movie, if that makes any sense? Very British movie.... God that sounds so stupid, but I think some people will get it. Not as strong a movie perhaps as the first two, but still a worthy closure to the Ridley-arc.
Alien: Resurrection..... Somehow it's a bit ahead of the curve, because in the very early 2000's Europe (and especially France) were making a lot of action movies in what they felt the 90's USA was doing. And some of them were incredibly entertaining. Others, not so much. Whedon himself has gone on record that they completely butchered what he wrote. There's some interesting stuff going on, with some great moments by Ron Perlman, but all in all, it just doesn't work. Mind you, if I'm bored AF I might get some beers and a bag of chips and zone out while I'm texting and doing other stuff on my phone or laptop with that movie in the background.

Now..... Here we go....

Prometheus and Covenant..... I am a HUGE fan of both of these movies, for several reasons. Even though I realize both movies have some flaws (not all of the flaws mentioned by others are flaws I agree with). And I've made my cases for both several times on the forum, so I won't go to deep into it.
I think the biggest flaw lies with two things: Prometheus wasn't very well received by some fans because they felt it stood to far apart from the Alien franchise, not connecting enough with the universe it was set in. Something I believe Ridley wanted to reach in the third movie of a trilogy.
And there's the second part: taking those complaints, and perhaps with studio pressure, he went to far with that connection in Covenant. Reaching a place where we see proto-xenomorphs, the first hints of the eggs perhaps. That would have worked very well. But full-out xenomorph at the end was too soon I felt.

Both movies resonate very deeply with me, for the mythology it creates, some amazing performances, breathtaking cinematography and some intensely disturbing scenes. Especially Fassbender in Covenant. Let me put it this way.... Three years ago when it was in cinemas, my ex girlfriend and I after having just bought a house and did all the moving and getting our house in order, felt like a date would be great. Little dinner, Covenant in cinemas and then going home for a intimate evening together. The movie left us both so numb and feeling disturbed by the actions of David, portrayed so perfectly by Fassbender, we both kinda sat on the couch for 10 minutes after getting home, looked at each other and basically decided we should just try and get some sleep. I'd say that says something about that movie. It does to me anyway.

 

[RPOW0614]

I liked Covenant. It was creepy and that final scene, OMG.
Alien 3 was "no guns" PC nonsense.
Resurrection was clone crap. Weaver must have needed the money.
Prometheus was just a bad movie in general. Worst spaceship crew ever!
(And I've seen Dark Star and Galaxina)

 

[Tosk]

Alien 3 was "no guns" PC nonsense.

If they'd had guns, the movie would have been over in ten minutes.

 

[Allyn Gibson]

Alien 3. It's a bleak, nihilistic masterpiece.

I do find Ridley Scott's two additions worthwhile. Resurrection is fine on its own terms (ie., Whedon's rough draft of Firefly), but I don't like it as an Alien movie.

 

[Vger23]

Alien 3 was "no guns" PC nonsense.

I'm not sure what this means. The fact that its setting had no guns made it PC nonsense? They were inmates in a prison. "It is not a good idea to allow prisoners access to firearms."

Was Alien also PC nonsense given the Noatromo crew also had no guns?

 

[Vger23]

Cutting and pasting something I posted elsewhere (not TrekBBS) back in 2017. Just to give you a sense of what I think of these movies. It's an oldie but a goodie...

How I rank the "Alien" movies:

1. Alien
2. Aliens
3. Prometheus
4. Alien 3
5. Alien Resurrection

-- insert gap --

Toenail Fungus
6-7. Alien vs. Predator (both of them)

-- insert gap --

The Food Poisoning I had in 2011 where I violently threw up 40 times, lost 20 pounds, and spent three days in the hospital, dehydrated, with my kidneys shut down, and an I.V. hooked up into my arm. There were times, during that, when I seriously thought I'd die.

-- insert yet another gap --

8. Alien: Covenant

Yikes!!

 

[Reverend]

I'm not really one for rankings and honestly find it to be a fairly pointless exercise in the shallowest of shallow critique. Indeed the only thing I find more tedious than writing out a ranking list, is having to scroll through everyone else's.

That said, if I had to pick a personal favourite post 'Aliens' instalment there's really only two contenders: 'Alien³' and 'Prometheus'. Both deeply flawed and contentious from a story, plot and character POV, both featuring wonderful cinematography, solid (if occasionally underused) extended casts. and both underwent significant alterations in post production. They also were both at least trying to be something profound and only just fell short, which most of the other entries in the franchise either didn't even try or were trying *way* too hard.

I ended up voting for 'Alien³' because given the hell the director was put through, it'd astonishing if the movie managed to just be coherent, let alone as memorable as it was. That's taking it on it's own merits of course. If one were to judge it solely as a sequel to 'Aliens', then it's a terrible sequel and the vote goes to 'Prometheus'.

 

[Mage]

I will say..... All of this talk is making me want to do a back to back viewing of Prometheus and Covenant.

 

[DarrenTR1970]

Alien 3 was "no guns" PC nonsense.

I thought the 'No Guns' was a part of Sigourney Weaver's terms if she was to return to the role of Ripley. I think I read that in the chapter about the making of Alien 3 in the book 'The Greatest Sci-Fi Movies Never Made'. For a long time while the script was going through development hell the character of Ripley was constantly being written in or out depending upon the overtures being made. At various points it was Ripley and Hicks, just Ripley, just Hicks or a brand new character and they would kill Ripley off-screen. It was also going to be set either in a 'space monastery' with monks, some kind of orbiting 'shopping mall', or a 'planet of political prisoners', which evolved into the prison planet seen in the film. Guns were never a big factor in any of the scripts; the characters had to come up other ways to kill the alien or aliens. I believe the guns were finally removed at Sigourney's request because she didn't like the 'militarization' of the previous movie.