Maybe they're being promised an extra 350 million quatloos a week for their health service
It was on a big red shuttle that the Dominion paid for
Federation Brexit
- Thread starter I_like_andorians
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It was on a big red shuttle that the Dominion paid for
The odd and potentially confusing thing here is the use of the past tense. But it's not odd in context of the Ktarian membership: there, it refers to the Maquis question, which indeed is a full year in the past of "The Voyager Conspiracy", having come to a conclusion in "Extreme Risk". Ktarian membership may be ongoing at the moment of the discussion; the Maquis issue is not.
The really odd bit is the past tense as refers to Naomi's dad. We learn of no death and no divorce. Why is Seven choosing to distance daddy from the circumstances grammatically?
Timo Saloniemi
Kentucky was (past tense) sympathetic toward the Confederacy even though it was (past tense) a State in the Union.
The grammar is fine and does not indicate Kentucky was removed or left the United States. Likewise the grammar from the Voyager episode is correct and yet does not indicate Ktarians left the Federation despite supporting the Maquis
The grammar is fine and does not indicate Kentucky was removed or left the United States. Likewise the grammar from the Voyager episode is correct and yet does not indicate Ktarians left the Federation despite supporting the Maquis
The United Kitarian Independant Party have denied that promiseMaybe they're being promised an extra 350 million quatloos a week for their health service
This case is slightly dissimilar in that the average reader readily recognizes that the Confederacy is a past thing, but might not recognize that the Maquis are, and therefore would mistake the membership for the necessary past element.
If neither half of the argument is recognizably explicitly past-related, then it makes no sense to use the past tense. "I was a TrekBBS member even though I wasn't a citizen of the US" makes no sense because as of this writing, neither my membership or the existence of US citizens is in the past.
Unless, for some reason, the overall discussion is about a past moment. But Seven is interrogating Ms. Wildman on her current loyalties...
Timo Saloniemi
I knew the writers of DS9 heavily considered the idea of Vulcan leaving the Federation (and later wanted Vulcan to be conquered by the Dominion - man, they really didn't like Vulcans ).
But I always thought that was a bad idea. Why the Vulcans? Because they are the only "good guy" -species well known. That's why they were blown' up by J.J. Abrams as well. But it never made sense for the most logical of races to do that, witout turning the whole Federation into a crapsack world.
I think the idea of a "Federation brexit" would actually be really, really interesting if it were another species. A more emotional species would make much more sense - the whole thing would be a mostly emotional matter anyway! One where we didn't knew the outcome. Like the Andorians, or Tellarite, or Bolians. Someone familiar, but not too familiar. Maybe that's a story worth telling some time. Depending on how big the real life "Brexit"-splash is actually going to be, there might be LOTS and lots of interesting stories happening worth to be told as well.
).But I always thought that was a bad idea. Why the Vulcans? Because they are the only "good guy" -species well known. That's why they were blown' up by J.J. Abrams as well. But it never made sense for the most logical of races to do that, witout turning the whole Federation into a crapsack world.
I think the idea of a "Federation brexit" would actually be really, really interesting if it were another species. A more emotional species would make much more sense - the whole thing would be a mostly emotional matter anyway! One where we didn't knew the outcome. Like the Andorians, or Tellarite, or Bolians. Someone familiar, but not too familiar. Maybe that's a story worth telling some time. Depending on how big the real life "Brexit"-splash is actually going to be, there might be LOTS and lots of interesting stories happening worth to be told as well.
They would not be allowed to leave. Section 31 protects the federation from threats from inside and out.
I thought for a while that the Vulcan terrorists agitating to leave the federation at the start of Discovery was going to develop in to a Brexit parallel but it didn’t come to pass.
Of the races we’ve met with any real development the Vulcans to me seem like the most likely to leave. The federation is dominated by Earth western philosophy, a far cry from their own teachings, how they tolerate a political union with humans when they show such overt disdain toward us is a mystery to me. Mutual defence and non aggression treaties is one thing, sharing a government, a legal system, economic model etc is quite another.
I thought for a while that the Vulcan terrorists agitating to leave the federation at the start of Discovery was going to develop in to a Brexit parallel but it didn’t come to pass.
Of the races we’ve met with any real development the Vulcans to me seem like the most likely to leave. The federation is dominated by Earth western philosophy, a far cry from their own teachings, how they tolerate a political union with humans when they show such overt disdain toward us is a mystery to me. Mutual defence and non aggression treaties is one thing, sharing a government, a legal system, economic model etc is quite another.
A race wishing to leave the Federation is not, in and of itself, a threat.
Given the circumstances surrounding that specific President, that's hardly surprising.
Section 31 threatened to spike the water with Ponn Farr juice if they left, either that or T'Pau only wanted to leave to spite Archer, she never got over what Surak did lol
I think it would be fun if Earth left and no one else in the Federation noticed lol
Earth at the Federation council - We are leaving and taking Starfleet with us!
Vulcan response - Live long and prosper, (we will no longer need to wear nasal numbing agents Thank Surak!)
Andorian response - Bye pinkskins!
Tellarite response - About time,
Klingon response - Can we rejoin now?
So is MI6, but for whatever reason that test Farage hasn't had an 'incident' yet.
They are too busy keeping charlatan Boris from number 10.
The Ktarian line only makes some sense if the Ktarian Government was sympathetic to the Maquis, perhaps getting censured for providing aid and assistance or even just turning a blind eye as their populace sheltered them. Perhaps Ktaria is close enough to Cardassia that this altered their perception abit.
Also, "The Game" implies that maybe Ktarians were somewhat new to the Federation, and some rogue elements had ulterior motives. If these rogue elements had sympathy with the Maquis in large enough numbers, they may have brought down any Ktarian goodwill with them.
Also, "The Game" implies that maybe Ktarians were somewhat new to the Federation, and some rogue elements had ulterior motives. If these rogue elements had sympathy with the Maquis in large enough numbers, they may have brought down any Ktarian goodwill with them.
"With" as opposed to "in" the Federation?
Technically that was what the Maquis themselves did. A lot of the border colonies tried to give up their Fed citizenship and formed the Maquis. Later they were going to declare themselves an "independent nation".
It's a really controversial decision, but I still don't know how smart it was. And independent human nation on the border with the Cardassians . It would resemble all the mid east conflicts times 30.
There are some real good reasons on both sides for the colonists obeying the treaty or taking up arms and staying put. The Maquis situation was an intentional but unsanctioned type of Brexit.
I always wondered what would happen if the Federation got too bloated with members, to the point when they add its 300th member. By then would the core worlds even know about or care about the newer members? The more members they add, the farther away they are and the more they have to keep track of.
It's a really controversial decision, but I still don't know how smart it was. And independent human nation on the border with the Cardassians . It would resemble all the mid east conflicts times 30.
There are some real good reasons on both sides for the colonists obeying the treaty or taking up arms and staying put. The Maquis situation was an intentional but unsanctioned type of Brexit.
I always wondered what would happen if the Federation got too bloated with members, to the point when they add its 300th member. By then would the core worlds even know about or care about the newer members? The more members they add, the farther away they are and the more they have to keep track of.
Maybe they're being promised an extra 350 million quatloos a week for their health service
I'm sure there are some misguided reasons, but with the benefits of security, commerce, legalities, and political clout that being a member would bring, I don't see much negatives outweighing the overall benefits.
Obviously, calling it a 'brexit' conjures certain contexts that make it hard to see past the bs motivations of the real world event.
But there are plenty of possible scenarios in which this idea could be perfectly reasonable. It all depends on the circumstances of the story.
If nothing else, we have clear and extensive evidence that the Federation is far from perfect and has repeatedly come close to having its entire social model upended by reactionary elements. I certainly wouldn't want to live in a Federation where Admiral Leyton won, nor one where the Ktarians took over, or one run by those conspiracy aliens.
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Hey now, they just wanted peaceful coexistence! (throat swells rhythmically)
Reading the comments on this thread makes me wonder why there would be an assumption that a) separating from the Federation would be a difficult process to begin with, and, b) that a split is based on xenophobia. I also wonder why is there a need to even join the Federation, or align with any particular power within the Alpha Quadrant. And finally, there could be any number of reasons to remain independent from the Federation. Just because the Federation is the default "good guys", that doesn't mean a government's orientation aligns with the Federation's objectives overall, which could be perfectly benign.
Since we've brought up the Maquis, let's review Eddington's diatribe to Sisko:
This is how a lot of British voters feel about the European Union.
This is how a lot of British voters feel about the European Union.
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