Essential Kes Episodes

[Michael]

I'm thinking about doing a little marathon of all essential Kes and/or Jen Lien episodes of the show, but am a bit unsure about which episodes to include. I guess episodes like "Elogium", "Warlord" and "Before and After" would have to be part of that. What do you guys think?

 

[Use of Time]

The Gift...The End.

 

[BirdInJetstream]

What is your aim?

I am not really sure if you refer to Kes' mental abilities or character development in general. I think the main step stones concerning her powers are:

Elogium
Persistence of vision
Cold Fire
Warlord
Before and After
The Gift

But I feel that these episodes are not enough to do justice to the character development. Other episodes might not have centered Kes in the main storyline, but reveal aspects of her personality and how she is "growing up".

 

[Michael]

What is your aim?

I am not really sure if you refer to Kes' mental abilities or character development in general.

A little bit of both, I guess. Plus episodes that best showcase Lien's abilities as an actress. Yes, there's her 'mental abilities' arc, but I would also love to revisit the best moments with her interacting with other characters, like when she pushes for the doctor to be treated better, for example. To find those little moments – amoung the episodes that really do feature her in the starring role – would be very cool.

 

[BirdInJetstream]

There are a couple of moments that pop up in my head:
As you mentioned Eye of a needle, when she tells Janeway that the Doctor is treated like a hypospray. (I adore his reaction, when Janeway comes down to sickbay to ask him about his wishes - that switch from the arrogant, confident medical genius to a sudden vulnerability.)

Another episode is Tuvix: Kes feels guilty for wanting Neelix (and Tuvok) back which means killing Tuvix. She speaks and expresses what Janeway thinks and feels and has to contain within herself.

Or The swarm when the Doctor looses his memory and Kes convinces Janeway and Torres (and later the holo-Zimmerman) to try and repair the Doctor's programme and allow him to keep his personality achievements.



Actually I found it sad that Kes left Voyager. She could have been an interesting character - I liked her a lot. Mainly because of her kindness and compassion and the fact that she developed into a very mature person although she wasn't given much opportunity.
In the beginning she was that naive kid that needed to be guided and protected, which was not very appealing to me. But she became a very intelligent, fierce person, willing to stand her ground to fight for those she loved.

 

[Kegg]

^
It was a shame they let Kes go, as she was quite a promising character (and I liked her relationship with the Doctor in particular - been years since I've seen an episode of Voyager, but as memory serves Kes was the first person to actually treat the Doctor as a person.) The ambiguous telepathic/telekinetic powers was something where it's not clear where they planned to go with it - and really I don't think the writers had a clear idea either - but it could have become pretty cool over the years.

IIRC, the plan was though to let Garret Wang go at the end of the third season, hence his brush with death at the hands of Species 8472, but when a list in Vogue or something ranked him as one of the top twenty hottest men on TV he got to keep his job.

On topic: "Warlord" was pretty much the first episode that came to mind, as it's the one where Lien really stretches herself the most and was also my favourite Kes episode. See you are already waaay ahead of me on that one.

 

[Piano&Startrek]

Tuvix is for me one of the best Kes episodes. I love stories about inner conflict. I don't think anyone has mentioned Scorpion? Remember that's where her mental abilities explode because of contact with Species 8472, and hence "The Gift" episode. It might be interesting to watch Caretaker alongside some later Kes episodes, just to see the contrast of how her character has changed over four years.

 

[R. Star]

The main problem with Kes and I would assume the primary reason they cut her, was the writers just seemed to have no clue what to do with her.

 

[TEACAKE'S PLEATHER DOME]

For Lien's acting I suggest Warlord. I thought it her best.

 

[R. Star]

For Lien's acting I suggest Warlord. I thought it her best.

I'll agree with that one. The plot was silly at best, but you could definitely tell Lien was putting her all into that one.

 

[exodus]

I found "Twisted" is a good ep. with Kes.
It's the first indication of her strong memory.
She's the first person on the ship to notice things are out of order.

I still enjoy "Fury" due to the underlying theme of, what do you do with someone psychokinetic when they get old and senile? It was an element that Voyager brought up in "Elogium" and "Before & After". While the time travel element takes the ep. in an unneeded direction, I enjoy the scenes between Kes and Janeway coming to grips with her Ocampian Alzheimers.

 

[lurok]

Just to second that Eye of The Needleand The Swarm are great for Kes-Doctor relationship. But that Jekyll & Hyde EMH episode sucks.

 

[Lynx]

The most essential Kes episodes where Kes is the main character, one of the main characters or plays an important role are:

Caretaker
Time and Again
Phage
Eye Of The Needle
Jetrel
Elogium
Parturition
Persistence Of Vision
Tattoo
Cold Fire
Lifesigns
Tuvix
The Swarm
Warlord
Coda
The Darkling
Before And After

Of those I consider:
Cold Fire
Persistence Of Vision
Warlord
Caretaker
The Swarm
The Darkling
Before And After
as the best Kes episodes.

 

[The Overlord]

The problem with Kes is most of the episodes with Kes are about things that happened to Kes through the course of the episode, rather then episodes that are about making her tick. The Kes had a lot of potential, if she was kept on the ship she could have been a great character, she just needed a little more development. This video is a good character study on Kes:

http://blip.tv/sf-debris-opinionated-reviews/a-look-at-kes-5381557

It would have better to get rid of Harry or Neelix instead of Kes.

 

[Lynx]

^^
Thanks for the video clip! Some really good points in the comments. I was also happy to see some of my favorite scenes in that video clip, although there were some I missed too.

 

[exodus]

The problem with Kes is most of the episodes with Kes are about things that happened to Kes through the course of the episode, rather then episodes that are about making her tick. The Kes had a lot of potential, if she was kept on the ship she could have been a great character, she just needed a little more development. This video is a good character study on Kes:

http://blip.tv/sf-debris-opinionated-reviews/a-look-at-kes-5381557

It would have better to get rid of Harry or Neelix instead of Kes.

I agree with your assessment of Kes. All the time she was on the ship, you never knew what she wanted out of life. Every little girl or boy dreams of growing up to become something. If Kes didn't meet the EMH and become a nurse, what did she want be in life? Besides the sun, whatelse did she want to see? We never even learned what the gold head statue in her quarters was?


I don't know if getting rid of Harry or Neelix would have improved Kes. They didnt do much development of her before she left and they didn't develop Harry or Neelix much the whole series. If nobody else but Janeway, the EMH & Seven were used to full potential, what chance would a character like Kes have regardless of who left the show? If they didn't develop Kes in the first 3 season, they weren't going to bother after Seven joined. It's obvious they never thought much of what to do with Kes beyond "Caretaker". That's what ruined her IMO, the fact they never thought of what direction they wanted to take her in.

 

[Lynx]

I thhink it was very clear that Kes wanted out of life. She wanted to learn and explore, that's why she joined the Voyager crew.

Despite that her full potential wasn't used, she was never "ruined" as a character (except for one disgusting attempt from those in charge which we, like the video clip said, don't have to go into now). In that case, all the other characters, except Seven, The Doctor and maybe Janeway were "ruined" because their full potential weren't used either.

I must also state that Kes did at least have some development. she came on board as nothing more than Neelix's girlfriend who he had rescued fro the Kazon. Then she developed into an important member of the crew. She became a nurse, she was the first one who regarde The Doctor as a sentient being, she grew fruit and vegetables in the Hydroponics bay and she did actually save the ship on some occasions.

Compare that to the development of Kim who remained "young ensign Kim", the whipping boy of the series. In fact, Kes had more development in three seasons than Kim had in seven seasons.

Note also that there werent much development of the other characters either after season 3. B'Elanna became superfluous after Seven arrived and they had to come up with the Paris/Torres relationship to show that both of them werestill on the ship. Tuvok was shoved in the background as well as Chakotay. Paris gradually lost all that had made him a great character in the first three seasons, Neelix was basically the same but Janeway was actually badly and inconsequently written in the later seasons.

That leaves only Seven, who became the new main character in season 4 and The Doctor who was the only character who really had some development during the whole series (soemtimes too much development like when he got that mobile emitter).

If they didn't have any plans for Kes, they surely didn't have any plans for the other characters either, except for Seven, The Doctor and maybe Janeway.

 

[BruntFCA]

I never really cared much for the character but I think Kes was one of the biggest missed opportunitys in the history of Trek. With the Ocampion life span you had the chance to show essentially a characters entire life over the course of the 7 seasons (we got glances at what could have been in Before and After and Fury). It could have been a creative gold mine but apparently the VOY writers didn't see any potential.

 

[exodus]

I thhink it was very clear that Kes wanted out of life. She wanted to learn and explore, that's why she joined the Voyager crew.

So did everybody else on Voyager but they all spoke of dreams of wanting to be something else if they didn't go into Starfleet. If Kes never met Voyager, what did she dream to be when she grew up? Did she have any other goals in life besides seeing the sun? If she was meant to live her life in 9 years before our eyes, then I would have liked to know a little bit more about her. They didn't do a good enough job IMO making the audience bond with the character.

I must also state that Kes did at least have some development. she came on board as nothing more than Neelix's girlfriend who he had rescued fro the Kazon. Then she developed into an important member of the crew. She became a nurse, she was the first one who regarde The Doctor as a sentient being, she grew fruit and vegetables in the Hydroponics bay and she did actually save the ship on some occasions.

She had just as much opportunity to be a nurse or grow veggies on Ocampia. Wasn't Voyager supposed to be her opportunity to become something she couldn't be back home? With Kes' ability to learn faster, she could have been an Engineer. Should could have returned to Ocampia and revolutionized their way of life. She could have given the Ocampia replicators and warp drive. She could have shown the Ocampia more than just the sun, she could have taken them into space.

Compare that to the development of Kim who remained "young ensign Kim", the whipping boy of the series. In fact, Kes had more development in three seasons than Kim had in seven seasons.

Harry built the Delta Flier while B'Elanna was in crisis. Harry not B'Elanna built the slip steam drive. Harry was the only one capable of working with Seven and learning Borg technology. Harry may have been a shitty character in personality but Harry created technology to get them home faster. Kes should have been more than just a nurse or growing veggies. Between her ability to learn and mental abilities, Kes could have gotten them home. Kes should have been THAT character. That's the wasted potential of Kes IMO.

If they didn't have any plans for Kes, they surely didn't have any plans for the other characters either, except for Seven, The Doctor and maybe Janeway.

Agreed

 

[Use of Time]

It looks like others may have beat me to it but making her choose to be a glorified nurse pretty much pidgeon holed her character. She was the Doc's assistant. That's it. That pretty much means she doesn't get to join in the main discussions in the conference room or become essential for away team duty. (she did manage to find her way onto some) They needed to have something that made her character important or valuable to the ship. Neelix was at first a guide which enabled his character a lot of relevance early on as they frequently called him to the bridge, included him on first contacts, etc. Maybe in the early planning they should have just had Neelix be the only guest passenger.