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Enterprise Class or Constiution-refit?

asdf1

Lieutenant Commander
Red Shirt
Was the Enterprise refit an entirely new class or just a refit? If it was a new class then it would be the Enterprise class, right, as it was as the first ship of its class, as far as we know. In TMP didn't Decker say it was almost an entirely new ship, or something. Thoughts?
 
Decker stated that, yes. It's listed here and there as Constitution-II class. I don't know the source, though.
 
Isn't there an FAQ on this or something? If you guys search on past threads, you'll see several that run for pages and pages debating this, with plenty of folks saying constitution and other (like me) saying Enterprise class. We both have onscreen and offscreen basis for our views, but geez, don't stir this pot up again so soon after the last one.
 
I like Constitution-refit, and canon seems to agree with that designation, for the most part. Enterprise-class doesn't sound as good, in my opinion.
 
Personally I find "Constitution Refit" to be a pretty clunky and awkward designation. But real world militaries have come up with real designations that are just as clunky. "M1928 Folding Entrenching Tool" comes to mind, which I suppose is the origin of the phrase "call a spade a spade".


Marian
 
Actually, the term was created by Andrew Probert although it has appeared in FASA and a lot of other fanon tech sources. I prefer the term myself, since it's clearly a new design and not a "refit."
 
Actually, the term was created by Andrew Probert although it has appeared in FASA and a lot of other fanon tech sources. I prefer the term myself, since it's clearly a new design and not a "refit."

I prefer the term "Reconstructed", which has historical precedent in regards to ships, but nobody seems to agree with me.
 
Personally I find "Constitution Refit" to be a pretty clunky and awkward designation. But real world militaries have come up with real designations that are just as clunky. "M1928 Folding Entrenching Tool" comes to mind, which I suppose is the origin of the phrase "call a spade a spade".


Marian
I kinda like "Constitution II"
 
...Of course, if in the real world two outwardly similar ships had powerplants as different as those of the E-refit and the E-A, they'd probably be considered wholly separate classes. Such things have happened in practice on two recent historical junctures: between the world wars, when old coal-firing battleships were refitted for oil powerplants, and during the cold war, when the USN built two lineages of near-identical carriers, one with oil boilers and another with pressure-water nuclear reactors.

I rather like to think in these terms of overarching if complex logic:

1) All Starfleet ship classes are named either after the first ship commissioned, or the first ship recommissioned to a refitted standard.

2) Kirk's ship was originally part of Constitution class, as she was built to the specs pioneered by USS Constitution.

3) Kirk's ship became the first and possibly only member of the Enterprise class when radically refitted for TMP.

4) A bit later, USS Constitution was refitted to a different standard which featured a less-modified shuttlebay and a more extensively modified main powerplant that looked a lot like the later Galaxy class one... This class became known as the Constitution(II) class for a while, until the last original Constitution was kicked out of active service, at which point the refit reverted to plain simple Constitution class designation.

5) The E-A ends up representing the new Constitution specs, either through refitting and renaming, or then newbuilding (and possible renaming).

6) By the 24th century, all this becomes a bit fuzzy, and people speak generically about the Constitution class. Still, Picard is formally perfectly correct when calling the "Relics" bridge simulation as representative of the "old Constitution class"...

Timo Saloniemi
 
Not sure if it's been mentioned but the bridge simulator doors say Enterprise Class.

It only means the class of students that are training to be assigned to the Enterprise per McCoy's line of "Wouldn't it be easier to put an experienced crew back on the ship?".
 
I wouldn't even give it that much credence. At best, it's an ex post facto rationalization. And a stretch of one, at that.


Marian
 
Not sure if it's been mentioned but the bridge simulator doors say Enterprise Class.

It only means the class of students that are training to be assigned to the Enterprise per McCoy's line of "Wouldn't it be easier to put an experienced crew back on the ship?".

That's one interpretation.

Think of this. Why even put "Enterprise class" on the door? Over the PA we hear "mantainance crew report to bridge simulator......" Do you really think Starfleet Academy has bridge simulators for every class starship? We've seen many other ships bridges that were similar to the Enterprise. If you look the sign doesn't look like a permanent ficture and can be changed depending on what is going on in the simulator.

I still think of the refit as a Constitution Class Enterprise variant or subclass.
 
The sign in ST II either means the *simulator* is Enterprise class (since that's the ship it was built to resemble) or the Academy class that's training there. I could go with either, really.

As for the ship itself: It seems clear that it's still Constitution class. For two reasons:

- It was in TOS, and why would a refit change the name of the class?

- The Enterprise-A is clearly Constitution class, as per ST VI. Since it and the TMP Enterprise are visually identical...I'd believe they are the same class.
 
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