Here's a couple linkys for ya. Aridas work is still the best cross-section overall, IMHO.
http://www.federationreference.com/Federation_Reference/Focus_1701.html
http://federationreference.prophpbb.com/
Engineering -- Warp Engines?
- Thread starter Smellincoffee
- Start date
Here's a couple linkys for ya. Aridas work is still the best cross-section overall, IMHO.
http://www.federationreference.com/Federation_Reference/Focus_1701.html
http://federationreference.prophpbb.com/
The problem I see with this FJ cutaway schematic is that it only shows the aft part of the engineering set. It doesn't show the forward alcove where Scotty's desk is located or the separate chamber where Watkins met his demise. So that FJ drawing only managed to fit part of the "engine room" set in behind the undercut.
I would also like to point out that FJ's 1975 drawings of the Constitution-class starships also include a second engine room in the secondary hull, this one appearing (to my eye, at least) to look like the engine room seen in TOS Year 1.
So if you go by FJ's drawings, that just seems to muddy up the waters even more.
It helps if you look at the floor plan (see links below), not all info can be expected to appear in a cross-section. Especially when said cross-section looks toward the starboard side and the "chamber where Watkins met his demise" is on the port side. But even so, we can see the entry foyer (with Scotty's desk/console) in the cross-section posted above.
http://www.ottens.co.uk/forgottentrek/images/blueprints/deck07.gif
http://www.cygnus-x1.net/links/lcars/blueprints/sftm/03-08-10.jpg
Yes, it was meant to correspond to the Year 1 engine room in spirit, if not in exact detail, I suppose?
I disagree, I'd say it was the retconning by GR and others from TNG onwards that muddied the waters?
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^ Yes, but that floor plan from FJ's 1975 blueprints doesn't confirm that there is actually room for the alcoves aft of the undercut. From what I can see from Aridas' drawings, it looks like the undercut should go far enough aft to make Soctty's and Watkins' area impossible in the saucer.
Well, let's make sure we're talking about the same thing?
If you're evaluating FJ's design on it's own terms, then everything works out for the most part. He had to tweak a few things here and there to make it all fit together, such as changeing the depth and width of the "undercut", for example. He also raised the floor of the engine room just a bit, and relies on the thickness of the hull under there to "fudge" things a bit.
But if your comparing the actual sets with the shapes and contours of the 11 foot model at correct corresponding scales (which is what Aridas did), then no, it doesn't apear to fit together in this way. The undercut is indeed too wide and deep for Watkins' area? We will have to wait for Aridas' floor plan to see how he works all this out.
Keep in mind though, that Scotty's alcove is on the centerline and therefore stradles the dorsal, so the undercut is not an issue in this area.
If you're evaluating FJ's design on it's own terms, then everything works out for the most part. He had to tweak a few things here and there to make it all fit together, such as changeing the depth and width of the "undercut", for example. He also raised the floor of the engine room just a bit, and relies on the thickness of the hull under there to "fudge" things a bit.
But if your comparing the actual sets with the shapes and contours of the 11 foot model at correct corresponding scales (which is what Aridas did), then no, it doesn't apear to fit together in this way. The undercut is indeed too wide and deep for Watkins' area? We will have to wait for Aridas' floor plan to see how he works all this out.
Keep in mind though, that Scotty's alcove is on the centerline and therefore stradles the dorsal, so the undercut is not an issue in this area.
And nobody sees a problem with FJ having the only entrance to Engineering being a turbolift and not the oft-cited circular corridor?
I have no problem with it, at least no more of a problem than I'd have with TMP blueprints which don't put that ship's engine room at the top of a "T" intersection between a long stright corridor and a circular corridor.
And as TIN MAN said, there are additional ways to access the FJ TOS engine room than just via turbolift.
None of them, however, correspond with what we saw on screen.
Thank you very much. I look forward to seeing his deck plans.
I would point out one thing about those FJ Tech Manual drawings: they don't seem to match what we saw in TOS. In TOS, the main entrance to the Engine Room (regardless of which one) opens to a corridor outside. I do not recall a scene showing a turbolift opening directly into a large engine room.
I like that interpretation as well. In fact, it could be that the TMP-refitted ship had the same types of "shirtsleeves" control rooms, but we didn't see them because the untested brand-new engine required hands-on care in TMP and the cadets got hands-on training in STII. In turn, the TOS ship had the same glowing power shafts that could only be safely accessed with radsuits on, but we didn't see them because things were more or less okay down below and Scotty was supervising the operations from the shirtsleeves facilities.
Or then, as in TMP, the engineers got their hands dirty with axle grease on the maiden voyage, and only retreated to their control rooms on later missions when all the necessary fine-tuning had been completed.
To be sure, we don't see Enterprise engineers at work in the Engineering maze in STXI, least of all the big names Olsen or Scotty. We see various intruders and intruder control parties playing cat and mouse there instead (echoes of "Court Martial"...). Quite possibly Olsen's principal workstation was a sterile room upstairs, gleaming in white much like the bridge, the sickbay or the transporter control booth, and nobody went down to the pits in normal circumstances.
Timo Saloniemi
Alright, check this one out - there's some weird ''warp core'' design:
http://www.cygnus-x1.net/links/lcars/constitution-class-starship.php
http://www.cygnus-x1.net/links/lcars/constitution-class-starship.php
Hmm....the nacelle innards are interesting, but I'm not sure about that intermix chamber...
Funny thing about that installation in the middle of the engine room floor is that it wasn't in the set for Year 1 of TOS. (Unless we're assuming that the Year 1 set is a different engine room.)
The floor installation bears a very strong resemblance to turbine housing covers in a hydro-electric plant I visited in 2001. The turbines are much larger, of course, but the shape and arrangement are very similar.
When Scotty started messing with the dilithium crystal assembly there in "Elaan of Troyus" and "The Paradise Syndrome", it was clear to me that this assembly was some kind of power-generating apparatus. I simply don't accept that it is the only such reactor for the entire ship, as TNG lore seems to suggest.
The floor installation bears a very strong resemblance to turbine housing covers in a hydro-electric plant I visited in 2001. The turbines are much larger, of course, but the shape and arrangement are very similar.
When Scotty started messing with the dilithium crystal assembly there in "Elaan of Troyus" and "The Paradise Syndrome", it was clear to me that this assembly was some kind of power-generating apparatus. I simply don't accept that it is the only such reactor for the entire ship, as TNG lore seems to suggest.
...Indeed, an industrial installation (a bit like a modern brewery, say) filling most of the engineering hull with multiple parallel and redundant power production units in compact armored casings (looking much like today's reactor vessels or fluid tanks) all pumping power through a central regulating dilithium installation (because the high cost of dilithium precludes individual dilithium foci for each reactor), all normally controlled from a small cluster of "shirtsleeves" monitoring rooms, would make a lot of sense, now wouldn't it...?
As technology evolved, things would get more compact, so each successive refit would free up more internal room in the engineering hull - just like happened to WWI battleships modified for WWII. If one lacked better ideas, one could use the liberated volume for, say, cargo storage.
Timo Saloniemi
As technology evolved, things would get more compact, so each successive refit would free up more internal room in the engineering hull - just like happened to WWI battleships modified for WWII. If one lacked better ideas, one could use the liberated volume for, say, cargo storage.
Timo Saloniemi
I think we're dealing with one matter-antimatter reactor and several fusion reactors.
For one thing, whenever there's a direct reference to the matter-antimatter reactor, it's always in the singular, whereas there's plenty of references to nonspecific "reactors".
For one thing, whenever there's a direct reference to the matter-antimatter reactor, it's always in the singular, whereas there's plenty of references to nonspecific "reactors".
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