Endgame & Relativity

[Unicron]

The time line that leads to the Temporal Prime Directive, of course. Once you have the power, you want to make sure nobody can take it away from you by changing the past that led to your having the power.

I don't trust anyone with that sort of power. Not even the improved humans of future Starfleet. Besides, look at some of the temporal changes in "Year of Hell." Suppose you could change history so that it remained largely the same, but the Dominion War never happened? There's still a peace between the major powers (to some degree at least), but the thousands of casualties never happen. Why should this alternative be necessarily worse than the normal timeline?

 

[kimc]

All i Gotta Say is Janeway is the most abusive Captain when it come to the TPD and nothing would have stoped her

Is that based solely on "Endgame"?

 

[Timewalker]

The time line that leads to the Temporal Prime Directive, of course. Once you have the power, you want to make sure nobody can take it away from you by changing the past that led to your having the power.

I don't trust anyone with that sort of power. Not even the improved humans of future Starfleet. Besides, look at some of the temporal changes in "Year of Hell." Suppose you could change history so that it remained largely the same, but the Dominion War never happened? There's still a peace between the major powers (to some degree at least), but the thousands of casualties never happen. Why should this alternative be necessarily worse than the normal timeline?

It can be argued that the Dominion War saw Jake and Nog finally maturing into men due at least in part to events they experienced during the war. Assuming they both have much more ahead of them -- perhaps important deeds that would have a significant impact on other people or places -- erasing the War from history would also erase whatever changes had occurred with Jake and Nog.

 

[Unicron]

From those versions of them, yes. But Nog would never have lost a leg, and it's certainly possible that they would have other accomplishments in a different timeline.

 

[Herkimer Jitty]

Maybe the Temporal Prime Directive is more of a Temporal Prime Suggestion, just like the non-temporal Prime Directive?

 

[foxmulder710]

Adm. Janeway beat the Borg, why would that want to change that?

I'm still not sure that that victory was as all-the-Borg-killing as most people seem to presume.

 

[exodus]

Adm. Janeway beat the Borg, why would that want to change that?

I'm still not sure that that victory was as all-the-Borg-killing as most people seem to presume.

I agree.

Janeway did say "crippling blow", not destroyed.

As long as one or more Borg still exists, they will be back.

 

[Mr. Laser Beam]

^ You should all be reading the TNG Relaunch novels...

Spoiler: TNGR

The sumbitches have pretty much been nothing BUT Borg-fests! Turns out that what happened in "Endgame" barely even put a DENT in the wee beasties. And you may not want to know what ultimately happens to Janeway...

 

[kimc]

^ You should all be reading the TNG Relaunch novels...

Spoiler: TNGR

The sumbitches have pretty much been nothing BUT Borg-fests! Turns out that what happened in "Endgame" barely even put a DENT in the wee beasties. And you may not want to know what ultimately happens to Janeway...

I'll pass.

 

[exodus]

^ You should all be reading the TNG Relaunch novels...

Spoiler: TNGR

The sumbitches have pretty much been nothing BUT Borg-fests! Turns out that what happened in "Endgame" barely even put a DENT in the wee beasties. And you may not want to know what ultimately happens to Janeway...

I can't, they're published by our rival publisher that formerly belonged to us.

I refuse to give those backstabbers a dime.

 

[PhoenixIreland]

I love this unwritten rule among Star Trek fans that no character is ever allowed to die

 

[Mr. Laser Beam]

I love this unwritten rule among Star Trek fans that no character is ever allowed to die

Well, it's the manner of death that's the problem, many times...

 

[Jeri]

Few would say Arthur Conan-Doyle was a no-talent hack, and even he brought Sherlock Holmes back from the dead due to fan pressure.

 

[exodus]

I love this unwritten rule among Star Trek fans that no character is ever allowed to die

True but it's because people get attached to characters and often stop watching a show if a certain characters die.

Fortunately, other shows like "ER" seem to buck the system.
Even the writers of "LOST" are afraid to kill off Jack.

 

[Lynx]

I love this unwritten rule among Star Trek fans that no character is ever allowed to die

True but it's because people get attached to characters and often stop watching a show if a certain characters die.

Fortunately, other shows like "ER" seem to buck the system.
Even the writers of "LOST" are afraid to kill off Jack.

You are right. I guess that is typical for fans, we do get attached to certain favorites. And who wants to see a favorite being killed off?

And that's not only for TV-shows and movies. I know about an ardent fan of a certain rock band who was very dissapointed when the guitar player left (due to some conflicts) and is constantly trashing the new guitarist and everything the band have done since tie former guitar player left.

As for "Lost", it wouldn't be the same if Jack "left".

 

[Lynx]

Few would say Arthur Conan-Doyle was a no-talent hack, and even he brought Sherlock Holmes back from the dead due to fan pressure.

Don't forget that Spock was brought back too, probably one of the smartest things those in charge of the TOS movies did. TOS would never have been the same without Spock and the movies wouldn't have become as successful as they were.

 

[PhoenixIreland]

I get that someone would like to see their hero go out in a more glamorous way but unfortunately famous people who accomplish a lot don't aways die a heroic death.

Alexander the Great was poisoned, after conquering so much of the world, hardly a good end.

Ronald Reagan died with alzimers and when he died did not even remember that he was one of the most popular presidents in history, or that he was president at all.

Big life does not mean cool death.

(tho they do handle it badly in ST, except Spocks maybe I still dont' know why they said Tasha died an "empty death without purpose" when in the episode she did during she was attacked while trying to get around the oil thing to rescue Troi

 

[exodus]

I love this unwritten rule among Star Trek fans that no character is ever allowed to die

True but it's because people get attached to characters and often stop watching a show if a certain characters die.

Fortunately, other shows like "ER" seem to buck the system.
Even the writers of "LOST" are afraid to kill off Jack.

You are right. I guess that is typical for fans, we do get attached to certain favorites. And who wants to see a favorite being killed off?

And that's not only for TV-shows and movies. I know about an ardent fan of a certain rock band who was very dissapointed when the guitar player left (due to some conflicts) and is constantly trashing the new guitarist and everything the band have done since tie former guitar player left.

As for "Lost", it wouldn't be the same if Jack "left".

Honestly, I'm all for killing off characters.

While I like DS9 & Voy. as they are, it's also a little hard to dispend belief that DS9 could endure a war where none of the main character's died due to it. Same with Voy. flying thru what was supposed to be hostile space and none of the main cast ever really dying. I think it lessens the dramatic elements of the shows. How is it supposed to be hostile if every one is always safe?

 

[ria 75]

But what show kills off the main protagonist(s)?
If you haven't yet, you should watch Six Feet Under.

 

[exodus]

But what show kills off the main protagonist(s)?
If you haven't yet, you should watch Six Feet Under.

B5 did just fine without Sinclaire.
X-Files went two years without Mulder
I think DS9 had enough well developed characters that it could have continued even without Sisko if it wanted too.

It done right & the replacement is as good if not better than the original, it can be done.