Empress Of Mars (Grade & Discussion Thread)

[The Wormhole]

I quite liked this one. Sure, it's not the most original script out there, and the Redcoats did feel a bit of a retread of the submarine crew from Cold War, even if this second in command was a bit more ambitious. But for some reason everything just clicked. The combination of Victorian era soldiers in a sci-fi/fantasy setting could have been played with a bit more, but eventually everything led to an ending that was pretty cool and made for some great TV. Why can't the show deliver something of this calibre every week?

I loved the Alpha Centauri cameo, and I find it a bit amusing that they were careful not to show too much of him(?). Alas, I always found Alpha Centauri's somewhat phallic appearance quite amusing and it adds a layer of unintentional humour to the Peladon stories and is a primary reason why I've always wanted them brought back in the new series. But whatever, it's great they're added all the same.

It does seem somewhat ironic that here we are nearing the end of Moffat's final season running the show and only now do we finally get a new spacesuit after a decade of using that old Satan Pit suit.

One thing I don't get: What was the whole point of the TARDIS whisking Nardole away, which forces him to free Missy in order to get back to Mars, if The Doctor just looks her up again? I thought the point would be The Doctor takes Missy along with him before she decides to break away with her own mischief after next episode. Further, why would Nardole would be so willing to let her free after being so stubborn about The Doctor keeping his pledge to guard her in the Vault? And speaking of which, why were they gallivanting about in the first place? Not that I wanted to stay Earthbound, but Moffat isn't staying internally consistent.

It seems more to me to be trying to sell Missy's whole redemption act. Even after Nardole releases her from the Vault and gives her access to the TARDIS she still gladly turns it back over to the Doctor and agrees to go back in the Vault. I agree that this trip to Victorian Era Mars does seem to go against the whole Vault Vigil thing, but really, that bridge was already crossed when Extremis made retconned Doctor Myseterio as taking place during the Vault Vigil despite the fact that the Doctor and Nardole aren't concerned about the Vault at all in that episode. Whatever, the arcs are typically the weakest part of Moffat's seasons anyway.

 

[Lakenheath 72]

I came across a funny story tonight. To many, the Alpha Centauri ambassador was shaped like a penis. When a cape was added to the design, the director exclaimed that it looked like a penis in a cape.

 

[kirk55555]

This was a solid episode. Not an all time great, but a well done adventure with a Classic Who alien. I'm curious to find out why the TARDIS took off on its onw, and what Missy means when she asks The Doctor if he is ok.

Also, it looks like we get another story set in the past next week, which is nice. Its kind of funny to say it, but the past doesn't get enough attention from NuWho, so two stories set in the past in a row is cool.

 

[Mr Awe]

4/5. I really enjoyed that. The best of the series so far. I enjoyed how this was a romp and a good mix of Victorians on the Mars with Ice Warriors. That mix worked out better than I thought! I absolutely loved the Victorian space suits!!

A couple of things let this story down. It felt rushed at points. That's probably more the fault of the 42 minute format. And, I didn't like the ending. Last week we had the love fixes everything solution. This week it was the honorable warrior feelings that fixed everything. The Ice Warriors were a bit too much like TNG's Klingons.

The TARDIS taking Nardole away didn't make sense. However, I'm guessing that is setting up a future plot point.

It was great that Alpha Centauri was back. I didn't expect that. When I heard the voice, I knew I recognized it but didn't immediately place it.

 

[Xerxes82]

The TARDIS taking Nardole away didn't make sense. However, I'm guessing that is setting up a future plot point.

Until they tell us otherwise, I'm assuming that the TARDIS' actions in this episode are related to Missy's response to the Doctor at the end. Something is wrong with the Doctor. The TARDIS recognizes this and sends Nardole to Missy because she'll see it as well. So, what's wrong with the Doctor? Is he, as somebody earlier in this thread speculated, regenerating already? If so, what is the source of the terminal condition? I feel like they're building to something here, but I have not the slightest idea what it might be.

 

[Mr. Adventure]

A real classic old-school throwback, OK for what it is but not really my cuppa (Who always brings out my Britishisms). I did like the warrior queen character and design.

Instead of rope the Doctor could've just used the TARDIS to get to Bill. I might've given this a pass but they actually went to the TARDIS to get the rope.

The Doctor and Co. never treats NASA with much respect or deference.

On a superficial note I really like how BIll/Pearl looked here with her hair down (and maybe different makeup?). Capaldi looks really good with the longer hair this season as well. And well Lucas....

 

[Marc]

And if you're going to have character into some thieving of shiny things why not call him Jackdaw

 

[The Wormhole]

I'm curious to find out why the TARDIS took off on its onw, and what Missy means when she asks The Doctor if he is ok.

The TARDIS taking Nardole away didn't make sense. However, I'm guessing that is setting up a future plot point.

Until they tell us otherwise, I'm assuming that the TARDIS' actions in this episode are related to Missy's response to the Doctor at the end. Something is wrong with the Doctor. The TARDIS recognizes this and sends Nardole to Missy because she'll see it as well. So, what's wrong with the Doctor? Is he, as somebody earlier in this thread speculated, regenerating already? If so, what is the source of the terminal condition? I feel like they're building to something here, but I have not the slightest idea what it might be.

Am I really the only one who didn't see anything significant to the TARDIS disappearing and just assumed it was the HADS triggering an emergency withdraw, which Nardole was just unlucky enough to be stuck inside when this occurred? Likewise, I assumed Missy just knew a way to override the HADS.

So either I missed something that's triggering everyone's suspicions, or you're all making things more complex than they in fact are by seeing things which aren't there.

 

[Lonemagpie]

[QUOTE="The Wormhole, post: 12047897, member: 751
So either I missed something that's triggering everyone's suspicions, or you're all making things more complex than they in fact are by seeing things which aren't there.[/QUOTE]

Missy looks at the console, looks at the Doctor, and immediately asks whether he's all right...

 

[Solariabsg25]

Yeah, something is definitely wrong with The Doctor. What it is for sure, we don't yet know, and that's probably going to be unfolding over the next couple of weeks.

 

[Photoman15]

Maybe the fact that he DIDN'T use regeneration energy to fix his blindness means something.

 

[kirk55555]

Am I really the only one who didn't see anything significant to the TARDIS disappearing and just assumed it was the HADS triggering an emergency withdraw, which Nardole was just unlucky enough to be stuck inside when this occurred? Likewise, I assumed Missy just knew a way to override the HADS.

So either I missed something that's triggering everyone's suspicions, or you're all making things more complex than they in fact are by seeing things which aren't there.

The TARDIS has stuck around in situations much more dangerous then the one on Mars. There is no way the TARDIS disappeared because the situation was too "dangerous". Its a few ice warriors possibly starting a war. That's a fairly tame adventure when it comes to dangerous situations, at least from the TARDIS's perspective. There was absolutely no reason shown for the TARDIS to flee, and especially for it to not come back until Missy could override it.

 

[Riverside2233]

Not a bad stand-aloneish episode with the Ice Warriors. It certainly flowed better than the previous three episodes. I didn't really want to buy into the Victorian soldier ordeal, but it wasn't too cheesetastic. Hopefully we are due for some really strong episodes here with Missy and Nardole playing some larger roles, seeing as they tend to carry the scenes they are in.

Also, the largest thing I've recognized these last few episodes is the constant Bill hair change. Lol. But seriously, she is a solid actress and a good companion for Capaldi.

 

[matthunter]

The key question is, if the Doctor IS already regenerating, why is he holding it back? OK, there's the Vault to guard, but it seems quite secure and Nardole can keep watch while the Doctor recovers. Nardole was VERY worried about the Doctor getting injured on a TARDIS jaunt, which OK was set up for the "I'm still blind!" revelation but Nardole KNOWS about regeneration so his reaction seems a bit strong. Does he know there's something up? If the Doctor got killed whilst already regenerating, he's dead for good, as we learned in The Impossible Astronaut, so is Nardole worried about that instead?

Come to that, Missy's sentence (Post-death) was a thousand years, wasn't it? Eleven managed about that (given the time gap in Series 7a and then his time on Trenzalore), but it seems to be about the upper limit of a particular incarnation for a Time Lord (albeit he didn't have access to the TARDIS for a lot of Time of the Doctor and maybe she could sustain him longer), so the notion that he may naturally need to regenerate whilst on Vault duty might have occurred to him and/or Nardole.

Anyway, if he's regenerating, why couldn't he use the "reset" to heal his eyes like Ten got rid of his injuries in The End Of Time?

 

[Nightowl1701]

Theory: The Doctor's unable to regenerate (or, rather, to complete a regeneration) because his new life cycle was completely squandered on the Daleks in 'The Witches' Familiar.' There's just enough energy left in the tank for a light show, but little else. And after his last trip to Gallifrey, there's less than zero chance the Time Lords will be willing to save him again.

He's going on sheer willpower now, desperately trying to stay alive until Missy's redemption is complete - at which point his last act will be to give her the keys to the TARDIS & have her take his place as 'the Doctor.'

And if she truly can't be redeemed, his last act will instead be to take her with him.

 

[Mr. Adventure]

The AV Club had a good point, it was a shame we were deprived of being able to see the Missy/Nardole team have an adventure in the TARDIS.

Also, as someone who didn't know/remember Alpha Centauri from the classic episodes that cameo was bizarre. It makes more sense now that I know but it was a bit "WTH is this?" while watching the episode.

I know they're nutty Victorians and all but "God Save the Queen" seems an odd marker to leave. Is NASA still scratching their hands on Earth trying to figure that one out?

 

[Timelord79 (he/him)]

The GstQ mark was a predestination paradox?
The Doctor left it there because he saw it on the NASA transmission and it got him there?
No other reason.

 

[Steve Roby]

Not the best episode of the season, but a welcome step up after the last few.

I'd like to think of this as another fun standalone, but things like the Tardis taking off and Missy's concern for the Doctor, as others have pointed out, have to mean something. This is the winding down of the Moffat era, so I suspect anything odd in these episodes seems likely to be building up to something.

 

[publiusr]

I liked the Victorian mishmash (more so than I thought I would) with all of its pompous and arrogant superiority.

That and a proper villain.

Godsacre's turn of honor and unintentionally appealing to Iraxxa's sense of Ice Warrior honor was a nice turn

Shades of Lursa and B'Etor

 

[Mr. Adventure]

I just thought of something, apparently Bill's cinematic knowledge doesn't include "Robinson Crusoe on Mars".

The GstQ mark was a predestination paradox?
The Doctor left it there because he saw it on the NASA transmission and it got him there?
No other reason.

I just thought the message itself was an odd one for them to leave as a message. Like Americans leaving "Let Freedom Ring" or "Don't Tread on Me" or something. I guess the message itself didn't matter really as long as it was something that could be spotted.