Li2 is a molecule and can exist as a gas
Element 115 and Star Trek?
- Thread starter dominicdom
- Start date
You are thinking about this too much! "At that time" things in the past had been completed...
1 - 1968 Elaan of Troyius.
2 - The Star Trek medical manual.
(I'm assuming you have Asperger's?)
Lazar mentions element 115.
Lazar mentions in an interview that he was a science fiction and Star Trek fan.
Algobarium provides a link to element 115 and Algobarium was mentioned in the Star Trek manual.
Anyway, I think you understand what I'm saying. There's just a possibility that this is where he got element 115 from. Think about it, he could have used any number of descriptions like "we couldn't determine what it was but it is assumed to be high up on the periodic table, like element 224 (island of stability)" You get what I mean?
Bob Lazar also calls the UFO propulsion system and "Antimatter Reactor".... Where is that mentioned?
Star Trek......
Which is not what "transperiodic" would mean either. It simply means "beyond periodic," i.e. no longer having a periodically repeating pattern of chemical properties as atomic number increases. Which would never happen as long as they still have electron shells.
Again, I think you'd need a different prefix for that, since "contra-" means "against" or "opposite to." Mirror matter, maybe, but strange quarks are a variety of normal matter.
On the contrary, I'd say you're overthinking it by imagining a connection for no valid reason. The point is that the SFMRM is not the only work in the universe that had the idea that there could be a 115th element. I mean, it's just a number. You add more elements, you'll inevitably get to 115 and beyond. There's nothing special about that particular one, either in the MRM or anywhere else. It's just one number in the list, and the book does not single it out for any particular attention. Assuming that this Lazar guy's ideas were inspired by the MRM just because they both have an element 115 in them is like assuming that one book was inspired by another because they both have the word "pomegranate" in them.
If you start out with what you want to prove, you can always cherrypick isolated data points and claim they fit your theory, which is where conspiracy theories come from. The human brain is very good at manufacturing patterns where none exist. In this case, there is no reason to think this guy was inspired by any specific book, because anyone imagining unknown chemical elements will inevitably reach a 115th one eventually, and the MRM did not single that number out as any more noteworthy than any of the others. You're manufacturing a pattern out of complete randomness because you want to see a pattern. That is the definition of overthinking something.
Star Trek used antimatter because antimatter was already a well-known scientific concept that had been in use in science fiction for decades. Roddenberry's science advisors informed him that it was the only plausible energy source powerful enough to drive an interstellar starship. So naturally it's common for UFO aficionados to latch onto the idea as well.
Sure, it's possible that some guy making up stuff about UFOs got the idea from ST, because UFO believers are generally poorly educated about science and get their ideas from mass media. But that doesn't prove a connection to the MRM in particular.
Last edited:
This is totally inappropriate, and not allowed here.
Discuss the post, not the poster.
It was a fair assessment given the hyper focus on irrelevant details, you have to admit!
Whatever you may think, stick to post, not poster.
Also, you’re new so I’ll give you a pass this time, but arguing mod actions in threads is also not allowed, as it derails the conversation.
Let’s consider this matter closed. Move on.
Thanks
Note: Please read the above warning before you accuse the current writer of geekism. 
When Dmitri Mendeleev drew up his Periodic Table circa 1865, he named undiscovered elements whose properties he predicted by affixing a prefix to the name of a known element in the same family. He employed the Sanskrit words for one (eka), two (dvi) and three (tri).
His eka-aluminum was an undiscovered element in the table cell just below aluminum. When such was discovered, it was named gallium. His eka-silicon was later discovered and named germanium in similar fashion. He used the dvi- and tri- prefixes for more distant cells.
20th century scientists adopted this convention for designating still undiscovered transuranic elements. 104/rutherfordium was referred to eka-hafnium prior to its discovery/synthesis and official naming.
So, seeing the word/non-word “algobarium,” I wondered if the author was trying to designate something in the beryllium family (which includes barium).
Nope! 115/moscovium is in the nitrogen family, and would have been referred to as eka-bismuth prior to its synthesis.
So, I guess the author just made up the name. Maybe it’s supposed to be something first detected in Algol’s solar system, just a hop and a skip away in the Trek era.
When Dmitri Mendeleev drew up his Periodic Table circa 1865, he named undiscovered elements whose properties he predicted by affixing a prefix to the name of a known element in the same family. He employed the Sanskrit words for one (eka), two (dvi) and three (tri).
His eka-aluminum was an undiscovered element in the table cell just below aluminum. When such was discovered, it was named gallium. His eka-silicon was later discovered and named germanium in similar fashion. He used the dvi- and tri- prefixes for more distant cells.
20th century scientists adopted this convention for designating still undiscovered transuranic elements. 104/rutherfordium was referred to eka-hafnium prior to its discovery/synthesis and official naming.
So, seeing the word/non-word “algobarium,” I wondered if the author was trying to designate something in the beryllium family (which includes barium).
Nope! 115/moscovium is in the nitrogen family, and would have been referred to as eka-bismuth prior to its synthesis.
So, I guess the author just made up the name. Maybe it’s supposed to be something first detected in Algol’s solar system, just a hop and a skip away in the Trek era.
Last edited:
Hmm, consulting Wikipedia for some cut-and-paste info to make it seem like I know stuff...
The name Algol derives from the Arabic raʾs al-ghūl, which means head of the ogre. The word algorithm is derived from the name of the 9th-century Persian mathematician Muḥammad ibn Mūsā al-Khwārizmī, whose nisba (identifying him as being from Khwarazm) was Latinized as Algoritmi. The name of the mineral baryte aka barite, from which barium was first extracted, derives from the Ancient Greek βαρύς or barús, meaning heavy (as does the name of the subatomic particle type baryon).
However, I'm guessing the writer of "Elaan of Troyius", John Meredyth Lucas, just smashed two scientific-sounding words together on the spur of the moment. I might be doing him a disservice though.
The name Algol derives from the Arabic raʾs al-ghūl, which means head of the ogre. The word algorithm is derived from the name of the 9th-century Persian mathematician Muḥammad ibn Mūsā al-Khwārizmī, whose nisba (identifying him as being from Khwarazm) was Latinized as Algoritmi. The name of the mineral baryte aka barite, from which barium was first extracted, derives from the Ancient Greek βαρύς or barús, meaning heavy (as does the name of the subatomic particle type baryon).
However, I'm guessing the writer of "Elaan of Troyius", John Meredyth Lucas, just smashed two scientific-sounding words together on the spur of the moment. I might be doing him a disservice though.
Right. The stars of the constellation Perseus depict said hero holding the severed head of Medusa (if you've got a lot of imagination). The brightest star was a rare variable star, and supposed to be a demonic eye, hence the name "The Ghoul" = Algol. An evocative name. Better than "Blinky."
Oh no, I've been spocked!
I have my version of the updated Periodic Table.
If anybody who has a deeper chemistry background can help on the organization, that'd be great.
I tried my best with my limited HS Chemistry knowledge to organize it in as readable a format as possible.
Some groupings weren't all that great IMO.
A few elements, I'm not sure exactly which group I should stick them into?
I tried my best with my limited HS Chemistry knowledge to organize it in as readable a format as possible.
Some groupings weren't all that great IMO.
A few elements, I'm not sure exactly which group I should stick them into?
There's a dedicated Wikipedia article on extended periodic tables.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Extended_periodic_table
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Extended_periodic_table
"Some groupings weren't all that great IMO.
A few elements, I'm not sure exactly which group I should stick them into?"
That's been a debate amongst chemists for over a century. The structure of the electron shells and sub-shells complicates everything. Also, as the atomic numbers go up, the atoms get heavier and heavier, physics gets more involved. So, projecting what properties element 151 or 233 might have is really tricky.
If you're writing fiction ... pick a number and run with it!
A few elements, I'm not sure exactly which group I should stick them into?"
That's been a debate amongst chemists for over a century. The structure of the electron shells and sub-shells complicates everything. Also, as the atomic numbers go up, the atoms get heavier and heavier, physics gets more involved. So, projecting what properties element 151 or 233 might have is really tricky.
If you're writing fiction ... pick a number and run with it!
Most of them don't last long enough to have a chemistry. Someone I know did his PhD looking for evidence of naturally occurring superheavy elements (transactinides with Z > 103). He didn't find any where he looked.
That's where I started, but so many different chemists have different interpretations as to what predicted element belongs where that I'm getting confused.
Nature always seems to have a way to surprise you.
For instance--maybe a galactic barrier has some reality?
https://phys.org/news/2022-09-hubble-shield-defending-pair-dwarf.html
This discovery, which was just published in Nature, addresses a novel aspect of galaxy evolution. "Galaxies envelope themselves in gaseous cocoons, which act as defensive shields against other galaxies," said co-investigator Andrew Fox of the Space Telescope Science Institute in Baltimore, Maryland.
For instance--maybe a galactic barrier has some reality?
https://phys.org/news/2022-09-hubble-shield-defending-pair-dwarf.html
This discovery, which was just published in Nature, addresses a novel aspect of galaxy evolution. "Galaxies envelope themselves in gaseous cocoons, which act as defensive shields against other galaxies," said co-investigator Andrew Fox of the Space Telescope Science Institute in Baltimore, Maryland.
Exactly. And since they can't do chemistry on 'em, they resort to physics and math. Measure the electron orbits and try to figure out how the strongly or weakly the valence electrons will form bonds. And, don't forget to account for the atomic mass of the heavy nucleus. I quit trying to understand it long ago.
While the chemistry is largely the same, the atomic mass does affect the speed of chemical reactions of different isotopes of the same element. It also affects the orbital sizes of atoms, hence bond length, and the vibrational properties in molecules. The effect is greatest for the isotopes of hydrogen dues to the large differences in relative atomic masses. Covalent bonds formed by tritium are strongest of the three, followed by deuterium and then protium.
Similar threads
