Since Federation citizens pay for drinks etc. at Quark's bar and other non-UFP establishments, is the credit basically UFP currency? Does it say that credits are earned for work, or that they're exchanged for goods and services within the Federation, ie. transporter or replicator use for non-Starfleet?
Economy of the Federation
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The whole "there's no money in the future" thing is silly and unrealistic. The argument that it's somehow worse than a barter system doesn't really make any sense because, at its most basic form, currency is just regulated barter. All it does is give a quantifiable relative value to the goods and services being traded.
"The acquisition of wealth is no longer the driving force in our lives," is a fine ideal to live by. But wealth and money are mutually exclusive. Just because a person collects a paycheck doesn't mean it's the primary reason he does his job.
As far as people paying for things, the simplest answer is they're granted some kind of stipend to spend on non-Federation worlds. You know ... a paycheck.
"The acquisition of wealth is no longer the driving force in our lives," is a fine ideal to live by. But wealth and money are mutually exclusive. Just because a person collects a paycheck doesn't mean it's the primary reason he does his job.
As far as people paying for things, the simplest answer is they're granted some kind of stipend to spend on non-Federation worlds. You know ... a paycheck.
It was never a completely straightforward doctrine. I remember in one of the first episodes of TNG, Crusher buys a whole bolt of cloth on a planet and has it 'charged to Dr. Crusher on the Enterprise' - or something similar.
My answer to this question is that it is almost useless to examine closely, because they are using a system that has been discovered/developed between now and then that is superior to our own. But by definition, we CAN'T know what it is, because if we did, we'd be using it.
It's one of those places where the MST3K theme really got it right - "repeat to yourself 'it's just a show - I should really just relax'".
But hey, go ahead. Maybe you'll be the one to figure out what they would be using, and will revolutionize economics. Or at least make some sweet loot for yourself.
It's one of those places where the MST3K theme really got it right - "repeat to yourself 'it's just a show - I should really just relax'".
But hey, go ahead. Maybe you'll be the one to figure out what they would be using, and will revolutionize economics. Or at least make some sweet loot for yourself.
Whether the Federation Credit qualifies as money, in the strictest sense...we can't say. I tend to think that it does. It's not money in the sense of being bills, coins, etc., but it IS money in the sense that it is a medium of exchange.
And before anyone mentions the replicator for the 1,000,000th time as the cure of all society's economic ills: Some people refuse to USE the replicator. Picard's family, for instance - his brother Robert would not allow replicators in their home. So what do they do? They make "money" selling the family wine, of course. You can't seriously tell me they go to all that work just to give it away for free...
And before anyone mentions the replicator for the 1,000,000th time as the cure of all society's economic ills: Some people refuse to USE the replicator. Picard's family, for instance - his brother Robert would not allow replicators in their home. So what do they do? They make "money" selling the family wine, of course. You can't seriously tell me they go to all that work just to give it away for free...
You only ever hear Starfleet people make the claim that they've transcended traditional economics and the accumulation of wealth. They also seem to have every possible need anticipated and fulfilled. The people we see involving themselves in businesses are civilians, and they seem very concerned with paychecks and profit margins.
I'll use Ezri's family as an example. Trill is a Federation world. Money is enough of a concern to them to cause Ezri's brother to commit murder. To get them to fall in line with the Orion Syndicate. Clearly, the Federation has not truly done away with the concept of currency and it's value, it's just that Starfleet officers are so cushioned that they don't have to think about it.
I'll use Ezri's family as an example. Trill is a Federation world. Money is enough of a concern to them to cause Ezri's brother to commit murder. To get them to fall in line with the Orion Syndicate. Clearly, the Federation has not truly done away with the concept of currency and it's value, it's just that Starfleet officers are so cushioned that they don't have to think about it.
Picard is the only I remember pontificating about how "evolved" the 24th century is. He's so sheltered from the necessity to pay for anything, Ro has to remind him that prostitutes expect to be paid (in the episode where they were undercover).
I don't see how the Federation could possibly function without some sort of economy. Even Voyager had an economy, where the currencies were replicator rations, holodeck time, and duty shifts.
I'm just going to go with Picard is telling half-truths so that he would be in less trouble with the DTI. For example, he says the Enterprise has 24 decks... after the audience hears that the Borg control decks "26 up to 11" earlier in the movie.
Acquisition of wealth is no longer a driving force... probably for a lot of people, but not everyone. Perhaps money doesn't exist... but we know that Federation credits do. Et cetera.
Acquisition of wealth is no longer a driving force... probably for a lot of people, but not everyone. Perhaps money doesn't exist... but we know that Federation credits do. Et cetera.
What's the diff?
Earth isn't some kind of special case - it's just a Federation member world, like any other. As for Ezri's family: Trill is a Federation member, yes. But the planet that the Tigans were living on was New Sydney, which is not part of the Federation.
I just go with the idea that there's no physical money used within the Federation and that not everyone in the Galaxy accepts "Federation Express."
^ Don't leave the quadrant without it!
It's pretty clear that on Earth you can live just fine without money. That doesn't necessarily mean currency is never exchanged on Earth. Also it's likely that influence acts like a currency.
I don't know how many of you are familiar with coop housing developments, but my mother lives in one. They've got a common house with a shared kitchen and a lot of other shared stuff such as exercise machines, games and a hot tub, and people agree to various duties throughout the community. They have their own houses and own private possessions too, of course. That's similar to how I see 24th century Earth working, everybody has their own private possessions but basic commodities and certain things are shared and everybody is very social within the community.
Some kind of currency probably exists, but it's not commonly used in every day life on Earth.
I don't know how many of you are familiar with coop housing developments, but my mother lives in one. They've got a common house with a shared kitchen and a lot of other shared stuff such as exercise machines, games and a hot tub, and people agree to various duties throughout the community. They have their own houses and own private possessions too, of course. That's similar to how I see 24th century Earth working, everybody has their own private possessions but basic commodities and certain things are shared and everybody is very social within the community.
Some kind of currency probably exists, but it's not commonly used in every day life on Earth.
it's inconsistent
there's the occasional talk of credits even after characters say money is gone
my theory is that on the main federation planets there's no need for money and everyone, even the lazy that do nothing, get at least basic housing and food. They can do this due to basically limitless energy from a combination of highly efficient orbital solar collectors, fusion reactors, and anti-matter reactors. With this energy they can replicate all basic needs and most other things too
on the backwater planets and new colonies I highly doubt someone would be taken care of if they refused to be productive though.
I think doing work does result in earning some kind of credit that can be used to get better housing, buy one of a kind items, be exchanged into foreign currency if traveling outside the federation, etc. This would include serving in starfleet and is how sf personnel could get served at quarks
evidence of starfleet people earning some form of "money" include Uhura buying a tribble, the negotiations for the barzan wormhole, Crusher telling the cloth seller at Farpoint to bill her account on the Enterprise, and (according to memory alpha, I didn't remember this one on my own) Quark accepted credits as payment from the starfleet personnel on DS9
there's the occasional talk of credits even after characters say money is gone
my theory is that on the main federation planets there's no need for money and everyone, even the lazy that do nothing, get at least basic housing and food. They can do this due to basically limitless energy from a combination of highly efficient orbital solar collectors, fusion reactors, and anti-matter reactors. With this energy they can replicate all basic needs and most other things too
on the backwater planets and new colonies I highly doubt someone would be taken care of if they refused to be productive though.
I think doing work does result in earning some kind of credit that can be used to get better housing, buy one of a kind items, be exchanged into foreign currency if traveling outside the federation, etc. This would include serving in starfleet and is how sf personnel could get served at quarks
evidence of starfleet people earning some form of "money" include Uhura buying a tribble, the negotiations for the barzan wormhole, Crusher telling the cloth seller at Farpoint to bill her account on the Enterprise, and (according to memory alpha, I didn't remember this one on my own) Quark accepted credits as payment from the starfleet personnel on DS9
Such things work fine on a micro scale but would be impossible to sustain on a macro scale. There are way too many variables and potential disruptions.
The existence of the replicator and sentient holograms solve nearly every human need. Not just basic needs quite elaborate ones as well. Don't really need a large dwelling if you can break down your unneeded junk for matter recycling. Half a millennium worth of recorded music and literature means you would not be bored either.
The credit system seems to exist soley for relestate and tourism purposes.
I am not even convinced large homes would be in vogue if environmental awareness is still valued. Certainly large scale agriculture would be gone by TNG.
The credit system seems to exist soley for relestate and tourism purposes.
I am not even convinced large homes would be in vogue if environmental awareness is still valued. Certainly large scale agriculture would be gone by TNG.
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^ Remember what I just said: not everybody uses replicators.
I believe, the civilian population (non-starfleet) would pay to use a transporter and replicators, when Worf's mother brought Alexander to the Enterprise so Alexander could live with Worf, she paid for the journey.
When Worf replicated a wedding gift for Miles and Keiko, using the Enterprise's replicator, he paid for it. It wasn't duty related.
Drinks at Ten-forward, pay for.
Similarly, when the officers on DS9 went to the repli-mat for lunch and Klingon coffee, they pay for it. When you order something and you then take it, funds are transferred from your account. Simply ordering is a agreement to pay, by voice print. One of the things Starfleet might have done prior to sending it's people to the station would be setting up financial services for it's personnel.
You also might have to be a bit more formal if purchasing from a business or a vender. Beverly Crusher at Farpoint buying cloth ...
First there's the legal purchase authorization;
I'll take the entire bolt.
Next there's the delivery instructions;
Send it to our starship when it arrives.
Finally there is the billing authorization, in her voice;
Charge to Doctor Crusher.
All done in Beverly voice, I want it, ship it please, here's the payment. Fulfilling all the purchase requirements.
The funds in your account are the result of your Starfleet salary and any outside income (like weekly poker games).
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