Dungeons & Dragons Tabletop Anyone?

[Geck]

A group and I started playing in October, using 4e - some had experience with previous editions, but for most like myself, it was the first time. I enjoy it, and my friends who used to play with 3e and 3.5e seem to like 4e as well, and find some improvements though they do find other aspects lacking.

We have two campaigns going (one started in February) and usually play each once/week, sometimes more. It's gotten a bit frustrating though as a former player just switched roles with the DM, and he hasn't quite gotten the hang of balancing things yet. Most of our battles now take 4 hours and kill consistently 3/5 of our party, plus we have a lot more arguing about basic gameplay rules...

 

[ATimson]

I played a little bit of 3.5E, and a lot of 4E. Then WOTC ditched PDFs, and I in turn ditched them.

 

[Islander]

Whenever I was playing back in the days, we never bothered about any set of rules. We had a few books for references and inspiration but whoever was DM always had the luxury of doing whatever he wanted. The point of the game for us was really just the role playing and adventure part. And being a DM was fun from a creative standpoint.

 

[Mistral]

Whenever I was playing back in the days, we never bothered about any set of rules. We had a few books for references and inspiration but whoever was DM always had the luxury of doing whatever he wanted. The point of the game for us was really just the role playing and adventure part. And being a DM was fun from a creative standpoint.

Now we're talking true D&D from my viewpoint. I was a DM for several years and other than the combat charts and select magic modifiers the only stuff I used were monster charts and spell descriptions. This allowed me to incorporate whatever wild ideas I came up with. Ask me sometime about the characters who stumbled across a Logan's Run Maze car and went for an unexpected ride. Or the Drow with the Luger.

 

[Goliath]

Whenever I was playing back in the days, we never bothered about any set of rules. We had a few books for references and inspiration but whoever was DM always had the luxury of doing whatever he wanted. The point of the game for us was really just the role playing and adventure part. And being a DM was fun from a creative standpoint.

Now we're talking true D&D from my viewpoint. I was a DM for several years and other than the combat charts and select magic modifiers the only stuff I used were monster charts and spell descriptions. This allowed me to incorporate whatever wild ideas I came up with. Ask me sometime about the characters who stumbled across a Logan's Run Maze car and went for an unexpected ride. Or the Drow with the Luger.

I once sent my players to the tomb of a mad wizard that was done up like a funhouse from hell. Some of their deadliest opponents were demonic killer klowns, who would bowl them over with cartwheels, beat them with slapsticks, spray them with acid seltzer, and pelt them with green-slime creampies.

 

[Cain]

This Saturday June 20th is Free RPG day. Like Free Comic Book day, games stores give out free stuff. Their website has participating stores and the free stuff that is being given away. http://www.freerpgday.com/

 

[Pindar]

Really? I skimmed through v3 and v3.5 books and didn't notice anything related to minis for combat situations.

You must have really skimmed.

All combat is laid out with diagrams of battlemats telling you how to move around with mini's.

The 5 foot square is god in 3.5.

I played 1st edition, and we used miniatures all the time.

I started playing D&D in the autumn of 1979. 1st edition AD&D had just recently come out, and you could still buy the original game, in its white box, along with its supplements (Greyhawk, Blackmoor, et al.)

I started with the blue Basic D&D booklet. I bought it with babysitting money. But we soon moved up to AD&D.

Jesus Christ--was that really thirty years ago?

I am afraid it was.

I think I was 11 when I got my basic set.

1980 it must have been.

This Saturday June 20th is Free RPG day. Like Free Comic Book day, games stores give out free stuff. Their website has participating stores and the free stuff that is being given away. http://www.freerpgday.com/

That's pretty cool.

Too bad we don't have this in the UK.

 

[USS Triumphant]

Wow, is 4.0 really that bad?

From a certain point of view, yes. I was a roleplayer since 1984. My group moved permanently to 4th Edition after it was formally released, and I quit roleplaying.

I should mention that my name is somewhere (I won't say exactly where) on page 316 of the 4th Edition Player's Handbook. And, I moved smoothly - happily even - from 2nd Edition to 3rd Edition "back in the day". So I didn't quit out of fear of change.

Even though I'm playing 3.5 right now, the simplicity of the 4th edition seems more appealing. As a new player to RPG, 3.5 can be overwhelming and sometimes seem to be needlessly complex. So, 4e may be a little more beginner friendly.

I can definitely see this. If the idea were to start people playing 4th Edition and then graduate them to 3.5, I could definitely get that. But I can't see wanting to give up the rich complexity of 3.5 to play, as Pindar correctly put it, a table-top game.

The biggest advantage I can see to 4th edition is the online playability of the rules - both play-by-post and for video game development. And I'll concede that that may be a BIG advantage for some people. But I'm not one of them.

 

[Trekker4747]

I just played my first Dungeons and Dragons tabletop game a few weeks ago and I'm hooked. I've wanted to play D&D for a while now, but never had the opportunity to try. I went to a local Meetup.com event, jumped into a game and now, like I said, I'm hooked. We're playing a 3.5 version game. I'm looking for to trying out a 4.0 (the latest version of D&D) game soon.

Anyone else into D&D?

It's been a while since I played but I want to get back into it. I called my old DM a couple weeks ago and told him to let me know when he's got room in a camapaign to let me in.

 

[Skywalker]

Wow, is 4.0 really that bad?

From a certain point of view, yes. I was a roleplayer since 1984. My group moved permanently to 4th Edition after it was formally released, and I quit roleplaying.

I should mention that my name is somewhere (I won't say exactly where) on page 316 of the 4th Edition Player's Handbook. And, I moved smoothly - happily even - from 2nd Edition to 3rd Edition "back in the day". So I didn't quit out of fear of change.

So what are the major differences between it and 3E? 3.5 came out after I'd left school, so I never played it. It didn't seem too much different from 3E, from what I can remember.

 

[SicOne]

I played 1st edition, and we used miniatures all the time.

I started playing D&D in the autumn of 1979. 1st edition AD&D had just recently come out, and you could still buy the original game, in its white box, along with its supplements (Greyhawk, Blackmoor, et al.)

I started with the blue Basic D&D booklet. I bought it with babysitting money. But we soon moved up to AD&D.

Jesus Christ--was that really thirty years ago?

Yep, it was. We're not getting old...we ARE old!

Played the old red-box Basic, then blue-box Expert in 1982 and 1983, then graduated to AD&D, which we played pretty heavily until 1985, when I went to college (and RPGs fell by the wayside in favor of alcohol and women...). I still have much of my old D&D books and modules (how are those items faring on eBay, anyway?), and every once in a while find an old module at a bookstore. Plenty of old Dragon magazines, also.

While in college, did experiment with Twilight:2000 as well as Morrow Project...would like to find some of those old rulebooks!

 

[SicOne]

^I also had occasion to pick up a few back issues of Dragon Magazine that were put out two or three years back...and was almost totally lost. D&D got a lot more complicated.

 

[the Dagman]

Ah, the old days of D&D. I used to play with a group that played a hybrid campaign of AD&D and Arduin. Anyone remember Arduin? I knew its creator, Dave Hargrave, may he rest in peace. I actually had him sign one of my old Arduin pamphlets. My playing group moved on from that game to RuneQuest back around 1981 or so. We had met up with some guys from Chaosium Games and started gaming at Chaosium HQ doing the playtesting for games like RuneQuest, Call of Cthulhu, Stormbringer, Superworld and tons more that never really got off the ground. We also went to the local DunDraCon every February for years.

 

[SicOne]

Ah, the old days of D&D. I used to play with a group that played a hybrid campaign of AD&D and Arduin. Anyone remember Arduin? I knew its creator, Dave Hargrave, may he rest in peace. I actually had him sign one of my old Arduin pamphlets. My playing group moved on from that game to RuneQuest back around 1981 or so. We had met up with some guys from Chaosium Games and started gaming at Chaosium HQ doing the playtesting for games like RuneQuest, Call of Cthulhu, Stormbringer, Superworld and tons more that never really got off the ground. We also went to the local DunDraCon every February for years.

I did play Call of Cthulhu briefly...but my PCs always ended up going insane.

 

[the Dagman]

Ah, the old days of D&D. I used to play with a group that played a hybrid campaign of AD&D and Arduin. Anyone remember Arduin? I knew its creator, Dave Hargrave, may he rest in peace. I actually had him sign one of my old Arduin pamphlets. My playing group moved on from that game to RuneQuest back around 1981 or so. We had met up with some guys from Chaosium Games and started gaming at Chaosium HQ doing the playtesting for games like RuneQuest, Call of Cthulhu, Stormbringer, Superworld and tons more that never really got off the ground. We also went to the local DunDraCon every February for years.

I did play Call of Cthulhu briefly...but my PCs always ended up going insane.

Yeah, Sandy [creator of Call Of Cthulhu] did make that the most likely outcome for most PCs in that game. He had a rep for being one of the most difficult GMs for a player to succeed with, with a very horrific death waiting for most of his players.

I remember bringing in a new character as a joke just daring him to do his worst to it. You see, Sandy Peterson is a big time horror fan and idolized H.P. Lovecraft (after Chaosium, he went on to design a lot of the monsters in Doom for instance). So as a joke and dare, I created a new character named P.H. Hatecraft who's profession was to write cheap romance novels. After looking over the character to approve it for the game, Sandy, a normally jovial and upbeat person and all around nice guy, looked me dead in the eye with almost anger and said "change the name". I refused, of course, because he had just told me with that look that I got him. It was hilarious. He spent that evening's game trying his best to kill the character off, and failing. I was the only player to ever not have a character killed in Sandy's games. It always seemed that when I played with him, I always made my rolls at crunch time. And yes, I threw my dice right in front of him so he could see it just as soon as I did.

He came the closest to killing one of them in the RuneQuest 3rd ed playtesting, with my character Simon the Fanatic who was a Sword of Humakt. But I always seemed able to just barely survive. Although after I had stopped playing in that campaign I was told he did kill off Simon. But I contend you cannot kill off a player character when that player is not there. It is a chickenshit move. You want me dead? Fine. Blue bolt my ass when I am there. But to do it months after I have stopped playing in his campaign was pretty petty.

 

[Goliath]

I did play Call of Cthulhu briefly...but my PCs always ended up going insane.

Dying and going insane is part of the fun.

It is a horror game, after all. Plus, Lovecraft is all about a cold, indifferent, incomprehensible universe that would laugh cruelly and mockingly at human hopes and dreams--if it gave them any thought. So if PCs aren't dying or going insane, then the GM isn't doing his job.

Once I got some experience as a CoC GM, I always made my players generate two Investigators: their primary character, and a backup, with some close connection to their primary character, who could be plugged into the game quickly when the first one died or went mad.

(Note that I said 'when,' not 'if')

But it's a balancing act. If PCs start dying or going insane too often, then the game starts to resemble a slasher movie, or Paranoia, or something. The prospect of death or insanity has to be real--even inevitable--but not so frequent that it ceases to be shocking.

Like the song says: an Investigator is here for a good time--not a long time.

 

[clint g]

Id like to try it sometime but the problem with a game like D and D is that you need outer people who want to play with you lol. The closest I've gotten to it is playing KOTOR

 

[FPAlpha]

Yeah, Sandy [creator of Call Of Cthulhu] did make that the most likely outcome for most PCs in that game. He had a rep for being one of the most difficult GMs for a player to succeed with, with a very horrific death waiting for most of his players.

I remember bringing in a new character as a joke just daring him to do his worst to it. You see, Sandy Peterson is a big time horror fan and idolized H.P. Lovecraft (after Chaosium, he went on to design a lot of the monsters in Doom for instance). So as a joke and dare, I created a new character named P.H. Hatecraft who's profession was to write cheap romance novels. After looking over the character to approve it for the game, Sandy, a normally jovial and upbeat person and all around nice guy, looked me dead in the eye with almost anger and said "change the name". I refused, of course, because he had just told me with that look that I got him. It was hilarious. He spent that evening's game trying his best to kill the character off, and failing. I was the only player to ever not have a character killed in Sandy's games. It always seemed that when I played with him, I always made my rolls at crunch time. And yes, I threw my dice right in front of him so he could see it just as soon as I did.

He came the closest to killing one of them in the RuneQuest 3rd ed playtesting, with my character Simon the Fanatic who was a Sword of Humakt. But I always seemed able to just barely survive. Although after I had stopped playing in that campaign I was told he did kill off Simon. But I contend you cannot kill off a player character when that player is not there. It is a chickenshit move. You want me dead? Fine. Blue bolt my ass when I am there. But to do it months after I have stopped playing in his campaign was pretty petty.

Wow.. talk about going way too far, especially for a games designer.

If you take it personal as a GM you should quit. If you take a joke way too serious it is time you take a step back and evaluate yourself.

That guy sounds like a real dick and i've met some in my time.. people who take this way to serious and really get upset if a GM doesn't allow a certain character or if a GM gets outwitted by the group.. it happens.+

I've been a GM for over 10 years with various games and a player a little bit longer and it never came to this that i took something personal. If a player of mine started to powergame and ruin the balance and "peace" within our group i'd have a personal talk and mostly that was enough.

But killing a character "off-screen" just out of spite? Uncool..

 

[Mistral]

Yeah, Sandy [creator of Call Of Cthulhu] did make that the most likely outcome for most PCs in that game. He had a rep for being one of the most difficult GMs for a player to succeed with, with a very horrific death waiting for most of his players.

I remember bringing in a new character as a joke just daring him to do his worst to it. You see, Sandy Peterson is a big time horror fan and idolized H.P. Lovecraft (after Chaosium, he went on to design a lot of the monsters in Doom for instance). So as a joke and dare, I created a new character named P.H. Hatecraft who's profession was to write cheap romance novels. After looking over the character to approve it for the game, Sandy, a normally jovial and upbeat person and all around nice guy, looked me dead in the eye with almost anger and said "change the name". I refused, of course, because he had just told me with that look that I got him. It was hilarious. He spent that evening's game trying his best to kill the character off, and failing. I was the only player to ever not have a character killed in Sandy's games. It always seemed that when I played with him, I always made my rolls at crunch time. And yes, I threw my dice right in front of him so he could see it just as soon as I did.

He came the closest to killing one of them in the RuneQuest 3rd ed playtesting, with my character Simon the Fanatic who was a Sword of Humakt. But I always seemed able to just barely survive. Although after I had stopped playing in that campaign I was told he did kill off Simon. But I contend you cannot kill off a player character when that player is not there. It is a chickenshit move. You want me dead? Fine. Blue bolt my ass when I am there. But to do it months after I have stopped playing in his campaign was pretty petty.

Wow.. talk about going way too far, especially for a games designer.

If you take it personal as a GM you should quit. If you take a joke way too serious it is time you take a step back and evaluate yourself.

That guy sounds like a real dick and i've met some in my time.. people who take this way to serious and really get upset if a GM doesn't allow a certain character or if a GM gets outwitted by the group.. it happens.+

I've been a GM for over 10 years with various games and a player a little bit longer and it never came to this that i took something personal. If a player of mine started to powergame and ruin the balance and "peace" within our group i'd have a personal talk and mostly that was enough.

But killing a character "off-screen" just out of spite? Uncool..

I never did anything to a PC "offscreen in a decade of DMing. I agree-screw with them all you want when they are there to respond but treat them as unkillable when they aren't around. I may have hospitalized a few, though...

 

[Goliath]

Well, in the DM's defence, Dagman did say that he had stopped playing in the campaign months before his character's death.

I agree that, if someone can't make it to a playing session or two, then their PC should get a pass.

But if someone drops out of a campaign, they can hardly fault the DM for treating their former player character like any other NPC.

To not do so would be unfair to the active players. Why should a former player's character be treated as invulnerable and untouchable, when their characters aren't?