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Spoilers DSC Starships and Technology - Season Two Thread

It's possible, I suppose, that the Kelpians arbitrarily transition from prey to predator without it being a phase in their life-cycle. The only real evidence against vahar'ai happening randomly is that Saru was convinced the sphere had triggered it, so he must've expected to have some warning beyond just waking up one day with sore ganglia. Well, that and if it didn't happen (on average) after Kelpians had had (on average) 2-point-whatever kids, the species would've dwindled to extinction. And then there's the question of if Kelpians ever die of old age on Kaminar, or if they all reach vahar'ai barring injury or illness. If it was like any number of diseases that can strike at any time but just become more likely with age, then presumably some Kelpians would just not live long enough for it to hit them.
 
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Well if they die out because of this, that would be a reason we very saw them in the TNG era.
 
Or the Ba'ul had a backup genocide weapon like a Species specific Genetic Bio Weapon!

Wouldn't be the first time in Trek that that idea was used!
 
Any tech worth commenting in the newest outing? "Light and Shadows" gives us lots of shuttlecraft action and a couple of looks at Vulcan, but what else?

- So now our heroes witness "extreme tachyon interference" where the earlier two times they missed the phenomenon altogether, and the second time a dedicated science ship just barely sensed the tachyons without any comment on this being "extreme" (or our heroes would have commented on the comment, or found the extremeness less worthy of a comment). Is the Red Angel making a greater effort at this with every adventure, or does every time-piercing point slowly grow more extreme like an infected wound?
- Pike was a test pilot on his first Starfleet assignment, from which it follows he knows the DSC shuttles better than the other heroes (or so he claims). Does this establish something about the age of those shuttles? Or has Pike merely been reading the relevant literature in the field as new stuff gets introduced?
- On that vein, is the forest of flip switches on the shuttle dashboard a sign of the age of the design? And in which way? Brand new supertech or outdated interfaces?
- For a rare once (indeed a Trek first?), we see where a probe comes from when leaving a shuttle. Yay for CGI. It's a big probe, and a big bay - barely enough room for it underfloor. The same shape as the torpedo we followed up close when Pike fired at Spock's/Georgiou's shuttle? Not the classic Ray-Ban casing at any rate, which is sorta odd for the torp even if not for the probe.
- The shuttle also has mechanical shutters for the windows (called "external shielding"). TOS style, except not, because these big windows require a lot of clickety-clack action...
- It also has a set of "Farenheit tools", which include a crowbar.
- Using plasma venting and ignition is an established Starfleet trick for calling attention. Spock's "The Galileo Seven" awesome factor isn't decreased by this: he's aware of a test pilot trick that the other DSC heroes don't seem all that well informed on.
- Doing it thrice means the shuttle is nearly out of fuel. In a storm where it probably needs to actively stationkeep, though, so we don't learn any exact consumption figures or tank sizes here.

In the meantime, Burnham takes a shuttle to Vulcan. Or then she hitchhikes on a starship (there might be plenty of Starfleet ships swarming over Kaminar at the time) and only completes the last leg of her trip in that red shuttlecraft, the exact markings of which I forget.

- Local flight control only challenges Burnham when she's already flying between some Vulcan skyscrapers. That's a Mathias Rust level incident, really... Regardless of whether Burnham was challenged sixteen times previously and the information never reached this final bureaucrat, or whether nobody spotted her before she was...
-...Yes, where was she? She requested permission to land at the Sarek residence, but was she in downtown Shi'Kahr (which looked nothing like the TAS/TOS-R place) at the time, or somewhere else? If the latter, why buzz the skyscrapers?

Later, Burnham delivers Spock to the S31 ship (callsign NCIA 93) in that same shuttle. And then has to bail him out when Georgiou convinces her this was a bad idea...

- She bails out shortly after the ship was "less than four hours from SB23", which is relevant in terms of what happens between this episode and the next, and SB11, and stuff...
- Three of the S31 ships chase her, but she hides inside a hole in a small asteroid (and nothing tries to eat her). The ships fly in extremely tight formation, each busily scanning a specific "sector". Sign of them having fairly poor sensing abilities and having to cluster up to bring enough sensors to bear? It's not as if they'd need three ships to overpower or corner a single shuttle.
- Burnham finally figures out Spock's ranting: the string of numbers is the set of coordinates to Talos IV. Although actually the shuttle computer does this figuring, supposedly without accessing the internet or the S31 ships would home in on her in a heartbeat. The logic of how the search engine decides that 749148 can be nothing but "749 mark 148" which equals coordinates to Talos IV is fascinating, to say the least!
- That is, okay, even though Burnham didn't tell the computer the search concerned Lieutenant Spock specifically, the computer may have realized (or may have been told earlier) to do the search in this context only. It's still a whopper of a hit, even before we come to the next hurdles:
- "749 mark 148" would be one of those headings where you apparently first gather momentum by doing two full circles before launching towards "29 mark 148"!
- Regardless of whether it's a heading or a location in a spherical coordinate grid - where does the third coordinate come from?
- If it's a heading - what is the starting point? Vulcan, or that rock they are hiding in? Was Spock prescient with exactly where and when Burnham would get his meaning?
- Even if it's a set of spherical coordinates - how come they nail "Talos IV", and not, say, "Talos"? If the accuracy is sufficient for specifying the planet (but how could it be with that few digits?), then again Spock is prescient with the exact moment when Talos IV happens to be exactly there and not millions of kilometers to some other direction, easily confused with Talos III or Talos VI. If it's only good for nailing the star, why then jump to the conclusion that it's relevant to the planet instead?

But again, the computer probably thinks in terms of context. And in the context, "749 mark 148" need not be the coordinates to Talos IV as such. When the computer says "One planetary system, located at 749 mark 148, identification: Talos IV", it may skipping a conclusion or fifty. But it still seems that "749 mark 148" specifies the location of Talos, in what Burnham immediately calls "coordinates", rather than, say, a catalog number.

All right, one final attempt to wriggle out of this jam... Perhaps Spock's 2254 logs contain a bit where he writes down "I am studying an intriguing SOS and trying to locate its origin. So far, I have only found one candidate: one planetary system, located at 749 mark 148 (as seen from the then-location of Pike's ship, that is), identification: Talos IV" and this is what the computer quotes in full?

Also, Spock used to suffer from spatial and order dysphasia as a kid, having inherited it from Amanda; Lewis Carroll helped with that. And it rains on Shi'Kahr at least every now and then, perhaps helping that cherry orchard live long and prosper.

Timo Saloniemi
 
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- "749 mark 148" would be one of those headings where you apparently first gather momentum by doing two full circles before launching towards "29 mark 148"!
- Regardless of whether it's a heading or a location in a spherical coordinate grid - where does the third coordinate come from?
- If it's a heading - what is the starting point? Vulcan, or that rock they are hiding in? Was Spock prescient with exactly where and when Burnham would get his meaning?

Which is why I would have prefered that they use something like "74 mark 91 mark 48" or "7.4 mark 9 mark 148" rather than the formats used in the episode.
 
They got the transporter coordinates exactly right in "Thunder", following the "Mark of Gideon" format of three clusters of three. I wonder if somebody thought him- or herself clever for doing the classic Trek thing here, too, not realizing that Trek has basically never given coordinates, merely headings or bearings.

Timo Saloniemi
 
Shi'Kahr looked different from
Where Burnhsm was flying. Sarek lives in Shi'Kahr,so is that another residence or retcon?
 
- If it's a heading - what is the starting point? Vulcan, or that rock they are hiding in? Was Spock prescient with exactly where and when Burnham would get his meaning?

I've been looking at this over the past few days. The coordinates are from the old FASA RPG, and IIRC, their system was that it was a right ascension and declination from the geographic center of the Federation. That's not a very sensible system for a large area of 3D space, but no one asked me, probably because I wouldn't be born for another four years.
 
...How does that even work? It's missing some key data, namely distance from said center. Cool anyway that it's another obscure reference by an insider fan.

I'm sort of growing tired of the Vulcan CGI tropes: the absence of any sort of flying craft other than the endless copies of the "Vulcan cruiser", and the copy-pasting of the architecture with the oddly canted floors. Gimme just one different design, even if it's an upside-down Starfleet ship painted red! The criscrossing "railroad" tracks with very small vehicles are odd, but not necessarily dull. But Sarek's house and garden were pure coolness again.

More of those displays that appear transparent yet feature different graphics when viewed from different sides (that is, the same graphic, but it's the right way around on both sides). That's rather desirable tech. Tilly and Stamets look at the time coordinate mess at Engineering, but there's also an exploded view of the shuttle there. Can we identify the components?

When Burnham escapes from the S31 shuttlebay, there are two craft parked there that are of an all-new, faceted design. I wonder how complete and detailed those things are...

Finally, my eyes are watering from trying to read the numbers off the sides of the two DSC shuttles featured here. Are they both 05 or perhaps 06 or 08 or what? How can the CGI be so sharp and so blurry at the same time?

Timo Saloniemi
 
- Sarek could have more than one house. He seems the type of Fed 1%er, honestly. :)

- Burnham's shuttle only gets one real external view where you can see the side of the hull. It definitely looks like DSC is painted there, but the number could be 05, 06 or even 08. In any case we could surmise a minimum number of boarded shuttles to Discovery. It's still not NCC-1031/6 or whatever, though.

- Flying in the face of last week's sighting of a holo display that seems to be correctly oriented to its viewer regardless of the side of the table they're on, this week we see Tilly and Stamets on either side of an Engineering console, and on Tilly's side it's definitely reversed. In this case though it's a little excusable, as the display is a physical OLED prop and the graphics thereon would only be visible to the camera in one orientation, and not the free-floating "window" we saw in the Burnham lab last week.

- Speaking of, this week the doors to the Bridge Lab are consistently open, and we even see some extras crossing back and forth in there, during the action on the bridge proper in the first act (it's closed thereafter). Someone forget to close the door? The shot gives the bridge a nice sense of depth, admittedly.

- When Burnham approaches the S31 ship, the comms traffic between them is perforated with an Apollo-era "beep" when people are done talking. That's cute and all, but later on when the S31 triplet ships go a-searching, there's no "beep" between the communicating officers.

- Is this the first time we've seen a medical (?) person wearing a transparent plastic lab coat? Interesting call-back to the JJ-era.

- The S31 ship scenes start expanding on their sets, which all seem to be new-build, including a short corridor and sickbay / interrogation room / Spock cell. Oddly, at one point Burnham and co. pass in front of a wall section that seems to be a force field. The force field isn't visible in the reverse shot. Artistic license? Brig located right in the corridor? Secret hallway with a one-way holo concealing the entrance?

- I forgot tot note previously, but there is a male extra walking around the hallways wearing the USS Shenzhou's robot head prop. I wonder if the prop has been refitted to say "USS Discovery" over the old labels. Also, the robot head was originally intended to be a specific device to assist tactical functions on the Shenzhou's bridge, from BTS comments from the props people. Same purpose here? If so why don't we see this guy more often? They were on the bridge during Tilly's May freak-out a couple episodes ago.

Mark
 
- So now our heroes witness "extreme tachyon interference" where the earlier two times they missed the phenomenon altogether, and the second time a dedicated science ship just barely sensed the tachyons without any comment on this being "extreme" (or our heroes would have commented on the comment, or found the extremeness less worthy of a comment). Is the Red Angel making a greater effort at this with every adventure, or does every time-piercing point slowly grow more extreme like an infected wound?
I think it has more to do with timing and showing up at the temporal incursion that the "Red Angel" chooses to interfere in. Even Tachyons have a certain amount of time before they dissipate from the area of incursion. If you're late to the party, you see squat. And as you've stated, they missed the phenomenon the first 2x times. Some other science ship barely got there in time. Only this time did they get to witness it up close & personal. Part of it is timing / luck / plot device!

- Pike was a test pilot on his first Starfleet assignment, from which it follows he knows the DSC shuttles better than the other heroes (or so he claims). Does this establish something about the age of those shuttles? Or has Pike merely been reading the relevant literature in the field as new stuff gets introduced?
With that statement from pike, I'm willing to make the assumption that he was a test pilot to certify that class of shuttles into mass production / fleet wide usage. He was probably one of the many test pilots who help validate all the stock systems for that shuttle when it was his first assignment. I would assume the age of service life for that shuttle is similar to how long he has been in StarFleet since Shuttle Certification for fleet use was done when it was his first assignment and he probably was a pilot / conn officer right out of StarFleet with an amazing piloting record and lots of hrs to get him such a premiere position that is in modern day reserved for more Senior Pilots. The current F-35 JSF certification usually has all their test pilots with at least 1,000+ flight hrs on multiple aircraft behind each Test Pilot and they are much older (average age seems to be >= 35) before they are chosen to be part of the Test Pilot / Certification program for IOC (Initial Operating Capability). IOC is separate from FOC (Full Operational Capability). Given the complexities of modern systems, I wouldn't be surprised if it took over a decade+ to certify every single system, sub-system, maintenance train, logistic supplies, etc.

- On that vein, is the forest of flip switches on the shuttle dashboard a sign of the age of the design? And in which way? Brand new supertech or outdated interfaces?
I wouldn't call it outdated, many aircraft in current day are switching over to "Glass Avionics" where there are plenty of touch screens, but there are also buttons, switch, and dials everywhere as well. It's just that the prevelance of AIO (All-In-One) big screens is currently coming to trend after lengthy certification by FAA for the civilian side while the F-35 is the first figher with a Heavily Glass focused cockpit. Think of the paradigm shift from Dumb Phones to Smart Phones is what the F-35 is bringing to the fleet. Even then, the F-35 still has some switches and buttons, just not as many as in past eras.

The individual dials / switches is a more classic way of doing things where each sub system has it's own physical interface. But given TNG era with it's all glass panels, I wouldn't be surprised if all the sub systems were far more integrated and programmable like a Smart Phone.

The STS / Space Shuttle wasn't that integrated and even current day rockets aren't nearly as integrated, but eventually they will be.

The current one big screen at each seat and then lots of buttons, switches, and dials above seems to be a half way point similar to what's going on IRL in civilian aviation.

- For a rare once (indeed a Trek first?), we see where a probe comes from when leaving a shuttle. Yay for CGI. It's a big probe, and a big bay - barely enough room for it underfloor. The same shape as the torpedo we followed up close when Pike fired at Spock's/Georgiou's shuttle? Not the classic Ray-Ban casing at any rate, which is sorta odd for the torp even if not for the probe.
It looks similar enough, but hard to tell given the Go-Pro esque PoV for when the Torpedo was in flight. But the torpedo casing seems closer to ENT era casings with modifications and a size enhancement.

- The shuttle also has mechanical shutters for the windows (called "external shielding"). TOS style, except not, because these big windows require a lot of clickety-clack action...
I like Window Armor =D, but I wish there was a Camera view projected virtually in place when the shutters go up!

- It also has a set of "Farenheit tools", which include a crowbar.
Oh Yeah! The CrowBar is still relevant that far in the future =P

- Using plasma venting and ignition is an established Starfleet trick for calling attention. Spock's "The Galileo Seven" awesome factor isn't decreased by this: he's aware of a test pilot trick that the other DSC heroes don't seem all that well informed on.
It's probably not taught in regular piloting school because it's not necessary except in a worst case scenario that would rarely happen to regular pilots in regular situations. Test Pilots can get into all sorts of tricky situations since a lot of the systems are experiemental. Just look at X-Planes and Aircraft Certification, all sorts of things can and do go wrong while the systems are being tested / validated / jurry rigged to work.

- Doing it thrice means the shuttle is nearly out of fuel. In a storm where it probably needs to actively stationkeep, though, so we don't learn any exact consumption figures or tank sizes here.
The size of the bursts aren't mentioned, so we can't get enough info to guestimate the size of the plasma tanks.

In the meantime, Burnham takes a shuttle to Vulcan. Or then she hitchhikes on a starship (there might be plenty of Starfleet ships swarming over Kaminar at the time) and only completes the last leg of her trip in that red shuttlecraft, the exact markings of which I forget.
It looked like a 05 or 06 in white big numbers on the bottom of the small printed numbers on top at the Aft StarBoard side of the shuttle. There seems to be 3 Alphabetical letters on top that looked like DSC, but that's me guestimating based on a fuzzy screen shot blown up.

- Local flight control only challenges Burnham when she's already flying between some Vulcan skyscrapers. That's a Mathias Rust level incident, really... Regardless of whether Burnham was challenged sixteen times previously and the information never reached this final bureaucrat, or whether nobody spotted her before she was...
-...Yes, where was she? She requested permission to land at the Sarek residence, but was she in downtown Shi'Kahr (which looked nothing like the TAS/TOS-R place) at the time, or somewhere else? If the latter, why buzz the skyscrapers?
Maybe she wanted to take a more metropolitan route through her favorite city before reaching her dad's place? She has some time given how fast shuttles travel at STL in atmosphere.

Later, Burnham delivers Spock to the S31 ship (callsign NCIA 93) in that same shuttle. And then has to bail him out when Georgiou convinces her this was a bad idea...
- She bails out shortly after the ship was "less than four hours from SB23", which is relevant in terms of what happens between this episode and the next, and SB11, and stuff...
I'm not sure why she would trust Mirror Georgiou given all the crap that has happened between them previously.

- Three of the S31 ships chase her, but she hides inside a hole in a small asteroid (and nothing tries to eat her). The ships fly in extremely tight formation, each busily scanning a specific "sector". Sign of them having fairly poor sensing abilities and having to cluster up to bring enough sensors to bear? It's not as if they'd need three ships to overpower or corner a single shuttle.
Huzzah! No random space worms in random astroids like in Star Wars!
Given the density of that Asteroid field and who knows what was causing that EM disturbance, I wouldn't be surprised that they had to do a 3x ship formation to search for her tiny shuttle amongst a lot of Asteroid debris + local EM disturbance.

- Burnham finally figures out Spock's ranting: the string of numbers is the set of coordinates to Talos IV. Although actually the shuttle computer does this figuring, supposedly without accessing the internet or the S31 ships would home in on her in a heartbeat. The logic of how the search engine decides that 749148 can be nothing but "749 mark 148" which equals coordinates to Talos IV is fascinating, to say the least!
I'm sure all shuttles have a local copy of the Star Charts, given the amount of worse case scenarios, having Star Charts stored locally and not depending on Federation Space Internet seems like a logical design decision. I doubt S31 is able to have spy apps implanted across every single StarFleet Ship / Shuttle. They would be found out and S31 would blow it's cover. That's why they need field agents planted usually. So that it's truly covert and localized to the target only. I highly doubt Leland was expecting the reaction from Burnham, otherwise he would've planted bugs. But that's because he didn't expect Mirror Georgiou to still be in good graces with Burnham, which is his mistake on analyzing Burnham's relationship status with Mirror Geoorgiou.

My bigger part is how did Burnham figure out to reverse the digit order then search for that key word in that order?

The searching for those numbers isn't that big of a deal, but the reversing of the digit order is. Maybe human intuition with the way vulcans interpret numbers in their native tongue compared to English? I know in Mandarin that when you mention fractions, that you speak of the Denominator first, then the Numerator second. While in English, it's in reverse. There could be something about the way of interpreting Vulcan Number order in the language that would be backward compared to English? Given that Burnham grew up on Vulcan, she would know the Vulcan language fluently without a Universal Translator by now given that she had to grow up in that education system.

- That is, okay, even though Burnham didn't tell the computer the search concerned Lieutenant Spock specifically, the computer may have realized (or may have been told earlier) to do the search in this context only. It's still a whopper of a hit, even before we come to the next hurdles:

- "749 mark 148" would be one of those headings where you apparently first gather momentum by doing two full circles before launching towards "29 mark 148"!
- Regardless of whether it's a heading or a location in a spherical coordinate grid - where does the third coordinate come from?
- If it's a heading - what is the starting point? Vulcan, or that rock they are hiding in? Was Spock prescient with exactly where and when Burnham would get his meaning?
- Even if it's a set of spherical coordinates - how come they nail "Talos IV", and not, say, "Talos"? If the accuracy is sufficient for specifying the planet (but how could it be with that few digits?), then again Spock is prescient with the exact moment when Talos IV happens to be exactly there and not millions of kilometers to some other direction, easily confused with Talos III or Talos VI. If it's only good for nailing the star, why then jump to the conclusion that it's relevant to the planet instead?

But again, the computer probably thinks in terms of context. And in the context, "749 mark 148" need not be the coordinates to Talos IV as such. When the computer says "One planetary system, located at 749 mark 148, identification: Talos IV", it may skipping a conclusion or fifty. But it still seems that "749 mark 148" specifies the location of Talos, in what Burnham immediately calls "coordinates", rather than, say, a catalog number.
https://memory-alpha.fandom.com/wiki/Heading

The ### mark ### Heading is relative between the current position of the vessel and the center of the Galaxy.

However! If it was fixed angle relative to the center of the galaxy with 749 being a more precise form of Horizontal Angle relative to a virtual galactic plane that would splice the Milky Way, I can get behind that. But did they just multiply the first set of digits by 10 and call it a day? Where accuracy was between 0 & 3600? If that is the case, where is Angle 0 defined as? Earth's relative location?

All right, one final attempt to wriggle out of this jam... Perhaps Spock's 2254 logs contain a bit where he writes down "I am studying an intriguing SOS and trying to locate its origin. So far, I have only found one candidate: one planetary system, located at 749 mark 148 (as seen from the then-location of Pike's ship, that is), identification: Talos IV" and this is what the computer quotes in full?

Also, Spock used to suffer from spatial and order dysphasia as a kid, having inherited it from Amanda; Lewis Carroll helped with that. And it rains on Shi'Kahr at least every now and then, perhaps helping that cherry orchard live long and prosper.

Timo Saloniemi
I don't remember his logs mentioning that, which ep was it referenced in?
 
...How does that even work? It's missing some key data, namely distance from said center. Cool anyway that it's another obscure reference by an insider fan.
Maybe the computer just did a stretched line interpretation and see what it would hit on the known star charts. I did that sort of thing for my Ray Tracing engine back in college, it's really trivial. Finding something that would intersect a line given a known starting point (Starting Point = Center of Galaxy) and figure out what it hits or comes close to.

I'm sort of growing tired of the Vulcan CGI tropes: the absence of any sort of flying craft other than the endless copies of the "Vulcan cruiser", and the copy-pasting of the architecture with the oddly canted floors. Gimme just one different design, even if it's an upside-down Starfleet ship painted red! The criscrossing "railroad" tracks with very small vehicles are odd, but not necessarily dull. But Sarek's house and garden were pure coolness again.
Maybe the "Vulcan Cruiser" is the Vulcan equivalent of a modern day small cessna that is piloted by certified pilots for the Vulcan public to use? Given Vulcan's logical nature, they would probably amalgamate all their best design ideas into one vessel type for public transportation which would make training, servicing, and ID-ing very easy. They probably don't care much for variety or aesthetics, so different shuttle types wouldn't seem important to the vast majority of vulcans while us humans care about variety, ergo all the different models of cars and the different knowledge needed to maintain all of them along with their individual unique quirks.

More of those displays that appear transparent yet feature different graphics when viewed from different sides (that is, the same graphic, but it's the right way around on both sides). That's rather desirable tech. Tilly and Stamets look at the time coordinate mess at Engineering, but there's also an exploded view of the shuttle there. Can we identify the components?
I wouldn't be surprised if it was just two Transparent Displays stacked back to back. We already have Transparent Display tech right now, I wouldn't be surprised if Samsung or LG donated / sold a bunch of them to the production team to show off!
As far as the shuttle parts, the text isn't legible for me, so no dice on my end!

When Burnham escapes from the S31 shuttlebay, there are two craft parked there that are of an all-new, faceted design. I wonder how complete and detailed those things are...
::shrugs:: They look like CGI stand ins for now. Not enough detail and lots of shadows. Maybe early model drafts with lots of details missing due to production schedule?

Finally, my eyes are watering from trying to read the numbers off the sides of the two DSC shuttles featured here. Are they both 05 or perhaps 06 or 08 or what? How can the CGI be so sharp and so blurry at the same time?
Intentional blur by the CGI department?
 
Pike's was 05 and Burnham's was 06, per Memory Alpha...?

Of course, that now establishes Discovery as having at least a half-dozen of that shuttle type.
 
And whether or not you choose to believe the TOS bible suggesting that the TOS Enterprise had only fours shuttles, that Discovery has the Queen beat in another respect besides sheer size and hybrid engine. :)

And this may be the first DSC shuttle destroyed! Lorca was captured from one last year, but it's not confirmed if it's one of Discovery's complement or one of the station's.

Mark
 
- Sarek could have more than one house. He seems the type of Fed 1%er, honestly. :)

Oh, most certainly. It's just that this one looks so adorably TAS - I'd hate lose the connection that young Spock would walk out of this orchard and venture into the deep desert, rather than get lost in the back alleys of office buildings.

In any case we could surmise a minimum number of boarded shuttles to Discovery.

But could we? Kirk only ever seemed to have two, despite one (both!) of them sporting the number 7...

- Flying in the face of last week's sighting of a holo display that seems to be correctly oriented to its viewer regardless of the side of the table they're on, this week we see Tilly and Stamets on either side of an Engineering console, and on Tilly's side it's definitely reversed.

Umm, what? Stamets is the one walking from one side to the other - and on both sides, first opposite Tilly, then on her side, the graphic is perfectly readable and the right way up (not to mention perfectly transparent, making it fantastic, fictional and aphysical).

Apparently they do this trick by flipping the entire display prop when the camera isn't looking...

And they do the same with the bridge display shared by Tilly and Saru.

- When Burnham approaches the S31 ship, the comms traffic between them is perforated with an Apollo-era "beep" when people are done talking. That's cute and all, but later on when the S31 triplet ships go a-searching, there's no "beep" between the communicating officers.

Oh, the beep is an unfortunate side effect of S32 eavesdropping on S31 communications with outsiders. S31 internal comms are secure. :devil:

Oddly, at one point Burnham and co. pass in front of a wall section that seems to be a force field. The force field isn't visible in the reverse shot. Artistic license? Brig located right in the corridor? Secret hallway with a one-way holo concealing the entrance?

I'd love for it to be the latter! Although on a ship that small, they probably need to be flexible, and much of the interior could be partitioned with forcefields only.

- I forgot tot note previously, but there is a male extra walking around the hallways wearing the USS Shenzhou's robot head prop. I wonder if the prop has been refitted to say "USS Discovery" over the old labels. Also, the robot head was originally intended to be a specific device to assist tactical functions on the Shenzhou's bridge, from BTS comments from the props people. Same purpose here? If so why don't we see this guy more often? They were on the bridge during Tilly's May freak-out a couple episodes ago.

Yup. But this time, the jarhead is repairing something off a corridor. Might be he's again "auxiliary tactical" and only needs the helmet for that job, but finds it so cool that he doesn't take it off even when he goes to sleep...

Even Tachyons have a certain amount of time before they dissipate from the area of incursion. If you're late to the party, you see squat.

...But the heroes were there right off the bat every time. And the second time, at Terralysium, they were not distracted by hails of sharp rocks, so they could observe the phenomenon fresh and in detail. The third time, pretty much the same - the time rift above Kaminar wasn't there originally. So it seems if you're early to the party, you see squat... But we don't know if staying put and waiting always helps with seeing a time rift develop (bad news for Terralysium?).

Given the complexities of modern systems, I wouldn't be surprised if it took over a decade+ to certify every single system, sub-system, maintenance train, logistic supplies, etc.

Whether this ought to hold true in the brave new world of Trek, too, is the question. In both DSC and TOS, we see but one standardized type in use across Starfleet (and, in DSC, across decades). In the other spinoffs, shuttle types came and went. Perhaps designs in the 24th century have shorter development cycles even if not overall life cycles.

It looks similar enough, but hard to tell given the Go-Pro esque PoV for when the Torpedo was in flight. But the torpedo casing seems closer to ENT era casings with modifications and a size enhancement.

The hiccup here is that ENT already introduced the smooth Ray-Ban box for the brand new photonic torpedoes. It seems to be Starfleet's equivalent to the pretty much universal 21-inch torpedo standard of ours, with the earlier spatial torpedo style supposedly going out of fashion. Except apparently not, as per DSC.

Perhaps the "Class 5" torps chosen by Pike are different from standard stock?

Oh Yeah! The CrowBar is still relevant that far in the future =P

...I just wonder what Celsius tools look like.

Given the density of that Asteroid field and who knows what was causing that EM disturbance, I wouldn't be surprised that they had to do a 3x ship formation to search for her tiny shuttle amongst a lot of Asteroid debris + local EM disturbance.

It's just a question of the exact mechanism by which three ships flying nacelle-to-nacelle would be better than just one ship. More scanning beams for covering more angles? But why not spread out the ships, then, too?

I'm sure all shuttles have a local copy of the Star Charts, given the amount of worse case scenarios

...But before the shuttle computer narrows down the search to things found in Star Charts, it supposedly has to cover the entire knowledge base of the Federation to find a match for Spock's string of numbers. Which is where communicating with outside assets would come in. And surely S31 would notice that communication was taking place? They wouldn't need to know what was being discussed - they'd simply get a fix on the shuttle. Not an exact one or anything, probably, given the circumstances, but still enough to give Burnham a reason to hurry. Except she does not.

My bigger part is how did Burnham figure out to reverse the digit order then search for that key word in that order?

She spoke of Spock doing "mirror images", supposedly because Amanda had taught him how to deal with a world where "up is down and left is right" by reading him Carroll. According to Amanda, her children were "on both sides of the looking glass", and we see the scene where Michael and Spock "mirror" each other to get the Vulcan hand sign right.

Flipping the numbers is the sum total of all that doubletalk. It's fortunate that Amanda chose to use those specific phrases, rather than go on about the benefits of believing in white rabbits in a great hurry, is all...

I don't remember his logs mentioning that, which ep was it referenced in?

We don't even know if he kept logs like that. But direct quoting from such things might explain the oddities of the computer's claim: it would then be a fragment of a greater whole (which it can well be) rather than a systematic expression of location coordinates (a role in which it serves pretty poorly).

The quote fragment would reveal that it's all about Talos IV, and Burnham would then fly the shuttle to Talos IV quite regardless of this original string of numbers. (In my model the numbers would have been relevant only to that fleeting moment during "The Cage" when the planet was in that particular direction as viewed from aboard Pike's ship. As such, they do not refer to the absolute location of Talos IV at all, meaning nobody else can follow the trail unless they realize they have to scan Spock's old logs!)

Timo Saloniemi
 
...But the heroes were there right off the bat every time. And the second time, at Terralysium, they were not distracted by hails of sharp rocks, so they could observe the phenomenon fresh and in detail. The third time, pretty much the same - the time rift above Kaminar wasn't there originally. So it seems if you're early to the party, you see squat... But we don't know if staying put and waiting always helps with seeing a time rift develop (bad news for Terralysium?).
Maybe if you stay put, the Red Angel in the future sees you and re-adjusts when he chooses to appear? Maybe he has a long game as to when he chooses to appear and allow StarFleet to observe him? Not enough info at this point to be honest.

Whether this ought to hold true in the brave new world of Trek, too, is the question. In both DSC and TOS, we see but one standardized type in use across Starfleet (and, in DSC, across decades). In the other spinoffs, shuttle types came and went. Perhaps designs in the 24th century have shorter development cycles even if not overall life cycles.
During the testing & certification phase, the quickest way to run through the test list is to have more staff on hand to do it. It's a qualified man power issue. I wouldn't be surprised if StarFleet did that in the future by training more staff and getting more people onto project to drive down total time in testing. This would allow them to field more Shuttle types in the future since they would be using validated old hardware moved into new Shuttle Frames with only having to account for new features or hardware.

The hiccup here is that ENT already introduced the smooth Ray-Ban box for the brand new photonic torpedoes. It seems to be Starfleet's equivalent to the pretty much universal 21-inch torpedo standard of ours, with the earlier spatial torpedo style supposedly going out of fashion. Except apparently not, as per DSC.

Perhaps the "Class 5" torps chosen by Pike are different from standard stock?
Maybe, but remember when Tuvok made his custom Probe that wasn't based on the standard torpedo casing!
https://memory-alpha.fandom.com/wiki/Multispatial_probe

It could be that the probe they choose is based off a special casing?

...I just wonder what Celsius tools look like.
Probably the Metric version of the same thing?

It's just a question of the exact mechanism by which three ships flying nacelle-to-nacelle would be better than just one ship. More scanning beams for covering more angles? But why not spread out the ships, then, too?
Given how dense the asteroid field was and to not have their scanning beams to cross and interfere with each other, it probably makes sense to be nacelle to nacelle so they can share sensor data and not have overlap.

The F-35 does the same thing with 2 & 4 ship formations as well where they automatically share data and increase coverage range and speed by scanning areas that don't conflict with each other and ascertain the tactical picture faster!

...But before the shuttle computer narrows down the search to things found in Star Charts, it supposedly has to cover the entire knowledge base of the Federation to find a match for Spock's string of numbers. Which is where communicating with outside assets would come in. And surely S31 would notice that communication was taking place? They wouldn't need to know what was being discussed - they'd simply get a fix on the shuttle. Not an exact one or anything, probably, given the circumstances, but still enough to give Burnham a reason to hurry. Except she does not.
Maybe Burnham was smart enough to set everything to local database mode when she went into hiding in the asteroid, this way no emissions leak as she runs radio silent. Remember, the shuttles usually keep a very large database of most public info and lots of StarFleet info that is public. Given how cheap memory is, I wouldn't be surprised if they found it pretty easily since it's all local.
 
I guess my problem with the latter sort is that if Burnham voluntarily limits her search to the resources of one shuttlecraft, it becomes less plausible that S31 would have failed to make a hit with their vastly greater resources.

I mean, if they search for a string of numbers, there's very little they can do with that string - so they'd do it all, including flipping the order. And if it's a brute-force route to success after that, then S31 would be there already.

On a side note about S31 resources, Burnham now claims all track of Spock's shuttle was lost near Mutara. What is she referring to? Did the heroes intercept the shuttle near Mutara (with the nebula and all)? But how does that equate to losing track of the shuttle? Or did Starfleet at large lose track at Mutara, and the route beyond that was a S31 secret that Number One managed to deliver to Pike?

Who sent the shuttle out there so that Starfleet, Pike and S31 could have their wild goose chase? It doesn't look as if Spock in his current state of mind would have the wits to do that, now does it? Was it Amanda? Did Spock at first steal a shuttle and fly to Vulcan to contact his mother, and then lost his wits? How did he evade getting spotted on the way in? (Is Vulcan Space Central asleep most of the time, as suggested by the late challenge to Burnham's approach?)

Timo Saloniemi
 
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