DS9 ripping off B5?

[Hodge]

I am watching Babylon 5 for the first time and I just finished season 4. This is a terrific show with a lot (a lot!) of similarities to DS9. I remember that DS9 didn't start developing a story arc until the end of season 2. Was this in reaction to the success of Babylon 5?

 

[P0sitr0nic]

How is DS9 developing itself away from the cookie cutter TOS/TNG episodic style a "rip off" of B5?

 

[Ezri]

Other than the fact that B5 and DS9 are based on a space station, do not see anything that warrants the claim it is a mirror of each other. True, both shows did have a war … nothing really mirroring each other. Will say the conflict with B5 was with Earth even that the primary characters were human. If DS9 was going to mirror B5 you would think they were going to overturn the federation council as the federation council mirrors President Clark.

 

[Jan]

There was a lot of competition between the two shows and yes, 15 years ago a lot of talk about which show did what first. Suffice to say that two excellent shows were the result. Old hatchets have pretty much been buried and should stay there.

Jan

 

[Moocey]

Hodge said:
I am watching Babylon 5 for the first time and I just finished season 4. This is a terrific show with a lot (a lot!) of similarities to DS9. I remember that DS9 didn't start developing a story arc until the end of season 2. Was this in reaction to the success of Babylon 5?

Do you think they ripped off the cheesy music too?

 

[Navaros]

Hodge said:
I remember that DS9 didn't start developing a story arc until the end of season 2. Was this in reaction to the success of Babylon 5?

No. It was a reaction to Rick Berman leaving the day to day operations of DS9 in the hands of much better show runners so that he could go muck up the show "Star Trek: Voyager" instead. It has nothing to do with Babylon 5 whatsoever.

As for the thread title, DS9 never ripped off Babylon 5. Some of the DS9 makers have said they did not watch Babylon 5 because they don't like how Babylon 5's creator falsely accused them of plagiarism. The maker of Babylon 5 is not the first man who ever put a story arc into a television show.

 

[Ezri]

Babylon 5 had a story arc ... is that a joke.

 

[Navaros]

Well, it is true that Babylon 5 didn't have any story arc in Season 1, just standalone episodes. Which makes things all the more ironic when it is alleged that DS9 copied that style from Babylon 5.

 

[MadBaggins]

Babylon 5 was pitched to Paramount but rejected because JMS is nuts, but they liked the idea of a space station show and had Berman and Piller create one for them.

 

[Thrall]

MadBaggins said:
Babylon 5 was pitched to Paramount but rejected because JMS is nuts, but they liked the idea of a space station show and had Berman and Piller create one for them.

The way I heard it was that they rejected it because they were already developing DS9. Roddenberry even had input in it's creation before he died.

JMS says that Berman/ The Guy's in Charge stole alot of his ideas from the meeting he had with Paramount. Supposedly he had this big bible of ideas that he showed them and he claims that they stole some of the ideas. Namely the big epic space war and the shapeshifter ideas. Personally I wouldn't put it past Berman to do that(or Roddenberry for that matter. He was notorious for taking credit for others work). But JMS's story and attitude about it seem to change like the wind so who knows.

But we know The Dominion War was not a rip off for certain because it was Behr's baby and Berman was completely against it. And Behr and the guys didn't even watch B5. They were too busy doing their own shit.

 

[Ezri]

B5 is ok.

People think that B5 and DS9 are the same ... well they are not. Maybe they look to be the same ... now would you call food at the grocery store the same as the food in the garbage can? B5, trash day is Thursday

 

[number6]

Ezri said:
B5 is ok.

People think that B5 and DS9 are the same ... well they are not. Maybe they look to be the same ... now would you call food at the grocery store the same as the food in the garbage can? B5, trash day is Thursday

Hilarious. I actually lolled!!

Funny because it's true.

 

[Ezri]

Well everyone says you are comparing apples and oranges. I just like to compare where you see these apples and oranges, I see DS9 apples in the produce section of the grocery store. On the other hand, I see B5 apples in the garbage can. All that I get from B5 is trash talk, well trash day with me is Thursday.

 

[DanTheGrey]

I just chalk it up to people talking to each other and like anything in Hollywood things get approved in waves. In a lot of cases it's just that "the time was right" for certain ideas and show concepts.

To be honest I enjoyed both shows quite a lot for some similar and some different reasons. They both had strengths/weaknesses/messages/painful forced humour that the other didn't. Even today I have both on DVD and watch episodes from both.

 

[Hodge]

Hey, I like DS9 much better myself, so I'm not trying to step on any DS9 toes. The film quality, scoring, casting, and writing is superior in DS.

However I am just wondering if they decided to introduce a menacing threat (like the shadows) to war with because it was working on B5.

 

[Lindley]

"The Jem'Hadar" occurred at the end of DS9 season 2. "Crysalis", which is when the Shadows solidified as a recurring threat, occurred at the end of B5 season 1.

Production-wise, those were almost simultaneous.

 

[toughlittleship]

I haved tried to watch B5 (I even bought the average direct to video films) but its a series I simply cannot like. The characters talk like they're in a Spillane novel. A bad Spillane novel.

 

[Lindley]

I have no idea what characters in a Spillane novel talk like, but I'm certain B5 doesn't get the praise it does because of the dialog.

Some of the monologs. But never the dialog....

 

[misskim86]

I love both shows and I don't think they're rip offs, they got similarities but not much else

 

[Kegek]

Lindley said:
I have no idea what characters in a Spillane novel talk like, but I'm certain B5 doesn't get the praise it does because of the dialog.

On the contrary, I think the dialogue is frequently excellent, mainly when it's dealing with a weighty concern (though there are a few fair moments of banter).

The monologues are a bit hit and miss, they can overweigh themselves with their own self-imortance sometimes.