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Doomsday Machine not best of TOS

From another thread:

Did I just hear Doomsday Machine called a horrid episode? :eek:
While "The Doomsday Machine" is almost on every top 5 TOS (or even franchise) list, it is interesting to read someone with the polar opposite opinion. That member should start a thread detailing all of the alleged problems with the episode.
Which is only my subjective but nonetheless considered opinion. Windom's performance as Commodore Decker isn't fully convincing: He doesn't come across as a traumatized man bent on amending his wrongs, say when he airily dismisses Spock's request that he vacate the captain's chair on the Enterprise toward the endgame of the drama. Decker's sudden assumption of command itself can be excused on artistic license grounds although high brass in actual modern navies would almost never do such a thing: Deferring to the senior officer on board who knows the ship and crew usually makes more sense. Worse is that Decker's suicide is rendered pointless by the later successful use of the empty Constellation to destroy the machine, a small item which evades Kirk and Spock during their banter after the event. :vulcan:

I tend to view Star Trek from a sociological perspective, as a morality play for the Cold War era. The idea of the doomsday machine has ample motivation amid the hair trigger of launch on warning systems for nuclear weapons that no belligerent really wants to use. Fine. Yet I feel Star Trek shone brighter in episodes where the human element was explored, for instance “The Paradise Syndrome.” The latter features Kirk’s lengthy joyful interlude outside his captain’s role, his lapse in dealing with the rivalry created by his new marriage, and acknowledges through Salish that “primitive” folks are quite capable of figuring out who is or isn’t a deity.





Well my first response was..
keep-calm-and-burn-the-heretic-13_zpslchrnctu.png

But I've really got a bit more open mind than that..I just have to locate it..
 
And they brought in a beautiful woman, and put her in one of the most modest costumes Star Trek ever had (Miramanee).
IMHO flaw that the parts of Miramanee and Salish were not cast with Native American actors.

Ahh the 1960's.

:)
Out of curiosity, T'Girl, who would you have cast from who was available at the time? This has always been the hardest part of the casting process; if you have an ethnic role, who do you cast? What if no one from that ethnicity is available?
 
The most well known Native American actor during Star Trek's run was Jay Silverheels, then in his 50s. And he was from Canada.
 
And they brought in a beautiful woman, and put her in one of the most modest costumes Star Trek ever had (Miramanee).
IMHO flaw that the parts of Miramanee and Salish were not cast with Native American actors.

Ahh the 1960's.

:)
Out of curiosity, T'Girl, who would you have cast from who was available at the time? This has always been the hardest part of the casting process; if you have an ethnic role, who do you cast? What if no one from that ethnicity is available?

Hollywood was painting white actors to fill "ethnic roles" at least up to the late 80s..

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Short_Circuit_(1986_film)

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Short_Circuit_2
 
I fundamentally disagree with the premise of this thread. :klingon:
Which another member asked me to start. ;)

However, I also wanted to learn more about the episode and what others think about it. The responses here, including yours, have been most helpful in that regard.
 
The episode is not without its faults, but the faults are overcome, and then some, by its strengths. The planet-killer, you can't threaten it, or reason with it, or bluff it, or anything. Like the later Terminator, it is what it is. Spinrad's top-notch script. Windom's portrayal of Decker. The fact that we get to see two ships in action, although one admittedly is crippled. And it seems that the entire cast brought their "A" game to this episode.

I understand that it takes all sorts to fill the freeways, but anybody who doesn't regard "Doomsday" as a top-tier episode.....let's just use the term "questionable" and leave it at that.
 
Out of curiosity, T'Girl, who would you have cast from who was available at the time?
If you mean in terms of being a celebrity at the time, the only actress I can think of off hand with any Native American ancestry would have been Eartha Kitt.

No I can't give a selection of actors from that time period. There were Native American working in Hollywood in the 60's, personally I've never bought into the idea that having white actors depict non-whites was a necessity.

In all honesty, the roles of Miramanee and Salish were not particularly demanding in terms of acting ability, and that no non-celebrity suitable actors could have been found within the Hollywood available acting pool is nonsense.

:)
 
If you mean in terms of being a celebrity at the time

Who said the actors all had to be known celebrities? And you keep skipping over FormerLurker's phrase available at the time.

There were Native American working in Hollywood in the 60's, personally I've never bought into the idea that having white actors depict non-whites was a necessity.

Who said it was a necessity? Denzel Washington played Don Pedro in the 1993 production of MUCH ADO ABOUT NOTHING. The IMDb entry addresses that in the FAQ—

How can a black actor play Don Pedro?

Don John is referred to twice in the play as a "bastard", so he is only his half-brother. In Sicily of the time, it is not impossible that a light-skinned lord would be married to a black woman and have another son by a white mistress.

—But I doubt the producers rationalized it that way at the time. Washington was probably chosen because he is a popular and talented actor who could deliver the role.

Must an actor really be gay, or say, a Vulcan to play such a role? How about Jewish actors playing the roles of Nazis? (HOGAN'S HEROES, anyone?)

The people who make the most noise over this issue, preaching from their assumed moral superiority, are the ones who should examine their souls.
 
How about Jewish actors playing the roles of Nazis? (HOGAN'S HEROES, anyone?)
This wasn't uncommon at all, even Jewish performers like Jack Benny and The Three Stooges were making fun of Nazis. Jewish actors usually had no problem playing Nazis if they could make them buffoons. Werner Klemperer, John Banner, and Leon Askin had all escaped the Nazis.
 
Which is why I asked T'Girl who she would have cast from among who was(I reiterate) available at the time.
There's Ned Romero who played a Klingon in "A Private Little War".

Randolph Mantooth who's career started around the time the episode was filmed.
 
Out of curiosity, T'Girl, who would you have cast from who was available at the time?
No I can't give a selection of actors from that time period.
And you keep skipping over FormerLurker's phrase available at the time
Hmm, where did I do this again?

The people who make the most noise over this issue, preaching from their assumed moral superiority, are the ones who should examine their souls.
YMMV.

:lol:
 
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