District 9 - Review, Discuss, Commentary ***SPOILERS*** possible
- Thread starter Captain Craig
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As I mentioned earlier, the flag on Wikus' table was that of the post-apartheid South Africa, rather than the older one.
He thinks the aliens are from the Andromeda Galaxy?
Yeah. Because the 100,000 light years of our own galaxy isn't far away enough. No, the aliens have to be 2-million light years away in Andromeda.
Here's another interview with the director...
http://www.avclub.com/articles/district-9-director-neill-blomkamp,31606/
http://www.avclub.com/articles/district-9-director-neill-blomkamp,31606/
He thinks the aliens are from the Andromeda Galaxy?
Yeah. Because the 100,000 light years of our own galaxy isn't far away enough. No, the aliens have to be 2-million light years away in Andromeda.
I don't think the mythology really matters. This is a film that takes place in the middle of an event - the details of what happened before and after aren't that important.
Besides, what happens when people try to flesh out the mythology? We get the Matrix sequels.
It's probably better that way. Given the prawn's huge amount of weapons and their willingness to rip the limbs off humans, it's safe to say they're about as belligerent as we are. Unfortunately for us they're also centuries more advanced and likely to be a bit pissed off when their backup arrives.
Checkmate
Commodore
If being utterly disgusted by someone who's laughing, joking, and offering souveneirs as he's performing mass abortions for the entertainment of his viewers makes me pessimistic, then I'm the most pessimistic man to ever walk the earth.
Fuck Wilkus.
how was Wikus controlling the mecha? he stuck his claw hand through the gooey portal & then it seemed he made a mental link so, was he controling it with his mind? it also seemed to amplify his voice. Very anime. 
Excellent. Really loved the film. Was thinking Half-Life games through the whole thing. Why don't they make a movie about that? Maybe roll it into the District 9 universe, use the same director, etc.
Cristopher (best CGI character realization I've ever seen) and his son (who was just pure win througout) were major characters, but the main character was clearly Wikus. He had the most screen time, the most dialogue and his actions most directly affected the plot. That he was a giant asshole most of the film was kind of refreshing. I couldn't believe he actually ran away at first in the mech like a puss, before a crisis of conscience and the realization he was in MECH facing light infantry convinced him to turn and fuck the villains' shit up.
Cristopher (best CGI character realization I've ever seen) and his son (who was just pure win througout) were major characters, but the main character was clearly Wikus. He had the most screen time, the most dialogue and his actions most directly affected the plot. That he was a giant asshole most of the film was kind of refreshing. I couldn't believe he actually ran away at first in the mech like a puss, before a crisis of conscience and the realization he was in MECH facing light infantry convinced him to turn and fuck the villains' shit up.
Christopher and his son were by far the best CGI characters of the season. Sorry Transformers!
Maybe he was pro-choice?
The eggs didn't seem alive to him, i'm sure....but by the time Wikus was brought in, his eyes began opening about the "humanity" of the Prawns...as well as the fact that he was being used as a weapon.
Glad you brought this up...Wikus seems to bounce back and forth in his view of "others"...kinda like how the rest of we humans can be.
I also liked his "geekiness"...i could relate to it.
I think he was an excellent subversion of the "Mighty Whitey" archetype. Numerous movies about racial oppression cast the hero as some white guy who is an outsider, who is ignorant to the injustices being inflicted upon this group or people. After seeing and experiencing what these people are going through he has a change of heart almost immediatley and sets out to save them however he can. This person becomes a hero and a champion to a community that couldn't find one on their own.
Wikus, on the other hand is part of the system oppressing them. And he doesn't give a shit. He's more than happy to call in that fire unit (dubbed "Population Control") since he already sees these creatures as vermin. Vermin he's forced by law to speak to like they were human beings.
He's also a short-sighted tool. He thinks that just by not having a prawn hand anymore everything will go back to normal. The only reason he doesn't cut it off is because he can't stand the pain.
He learns nothing the whole movie. It's all just as a bad dream. One Wilkus is so desperate to wake up from he's willing to do anything or fuck over anyone in order to do so. Only after all hope is lost, when its clear to him there is no chance of escape, that his former life is effectively over, that he stops thinking about himself and tries to do the right thing. Mind you even then he warns Christopher: "Hurry up before I change my mind!" All this makes for a much more interesting lead character than what Hollywood usually dishes out.
I just got back from it and I was quite impressed. They actually gave us *alien* aliens, I've been waitng a long time to see something like that on screen. And they threw in some nice powered suit mayhem just as icing on the cake. I don't remember anything that just made me want to say "oh, that's so obviously CGI".
I wonder if this film will have any impact one way or another on that V series coming out?
I'm shocked that people wanted the allegory to be more heavy-handed somehow. I think it works very well as is and can go well beyond apartheid when it comes to intolerance and injustice.
I wonder if this film will have any impact one way or another on that V series coming out?
I'm shocked that people wanted the allegory to be more heavy-handed somehow. I think it works very well as is and can go well beyond apartheid when it comes to intolerance and injustice.
I sure wish I could go see this movie, but my loser movie theater manager in my town wont show it. If I want to see it I have to drive 45 miles to Louisville. For some reason the guy picks and choses which movies his theater will show. He has like 10 of them in one building. He refuses to show any of the Angel and Demon movies nor does he show many "black" type movies like Beyonce' latest one where her husband cheats on her.
I attended a screening of this film last night, and have been slowly reading over the responses in this thread.
I wasn’t as concerned as Samuel Walters that apartheid was not addressed by name within the film until I realized the Prawns landed in 1982 and not 1989. That’s a big difference. Historically it is the period when apartheid was at its height rather than at its decline.
Clearly the present-tense material, which date stamps identified as 2010, takes place in a country no longer under apartheid. There’s a black President and Wikus has black co-workers in his office.
On the other hand, claiming that District 9 might take place in an alternate universe where apartheid never happened is unsupported by the film. Many parts of Johannesburg are clearly still affected by racial segregation, and MNU includes black employees, but none in authority positions, and the briefing scenes prove that the corporation is mostly a white one. Claiming that Schindler's List never used the term "holocaust" is a silly defense, too. That term wasn't so uniquely identified with the killing of the Jews during the second World War until the 1950s. That film still tackled the subject (even if I find it mediocre at best, but that is another thread for another time).
In addition, blacks aren’t offered the best array of characterization in the film. The worst offenders are the Nigerians, whose barbaric (animalistic, really) consumption of the Prawns reproduces the worst kind of racial caricatures. And the film does not provide many serious counterpoints. You have the black president, who is proven either inept or corrupt by passing off the story of a terrorist attack that has been dealt with. You have a black subordinate of Wikus, who spends most of the movie cowering behind his boss (and his dialogue repeatedly emphasizes that he is his ‘boss’). The only time the character is proactive is when he looks on the computer to find out what really happened to Wikus, and this action quickly gets him arrested, a fate which he seems to accept.
And I'm not the first to point out how gleefully unsubtle Multi-National United is as a name for the evil corporation, but, come on now.
On the other hand, the film is without a doubt a great technical achievement. The visual effects felt very real in all but a few shots, and considering how small the budget was, I’m inclined to look the other way.
Wikus, too, is an impressive choice of a protagonist. An entirely American film wouldn’t have allowed him to be so inept, so much of a coward, and so physically incapable a man. It wouldn’t allow him to participate in such horrific acts as the abortion scene, either (he’d be denouncing the acts in an act of defiance).
The use of faux-news sequences is very effective as well, and an interesting and unconventional choice.
I'd kind of like to see District 10. In spite of all my criticism, which is not minor, I enjoyed this film, and would rate it above average. It certainly has its mind set on much higher ideals of science fiction compared to most films in the genre. Styalistically it's much more adventurous than any other widely released science fiction film I've seen. The choice of protagonist is unconventional and (unlike the character) brave. And the allegorical message is well-delivered, even if it misses on some of the historical context and reproduces some racist stereotypes.
I wasn’t as concerned as Samuel Walters that apartheid was not addressed by name within the film until I realized the Prawns landed in 1982 and not 1989. That’s a big difference. Historically it is the period when apartheid was at its height rather than at its decline.
Clearly the present-tense material, which date stamps identified as 2010, takes place in a country no longer under apartheid. There’s a black President and Wikus has black co-workers in his office.
On the other hand, claiming that District 9 might take place in an alternate universe where apartheid never happened is unsupported by the film. Many parts of Johannesburg are clearly still affected by racial segregation, and MNU includes black employees, but none in authority positions, and the briefing scenes prove that the corporation is mostly a white one. Claiming that Schindler's List never used the term "holocaust" is a silly defense, too. That term wasn't so uniquely identified with the killing of the Jews during the second World War until the 1950s. That film still tackled the subject (even if I find it mediocre at best, but that is another thread for another time).
In addition, blacks aren’t offered the best array of characterization in the film. The worst offenders are the Nigerians, whose barbaric (animalistic, really) consumption of the Prawns reproduces the worst kind of racial caricatures. And the film does not provide many serious counterpoints. You have the black president, who is proven either inept or corrupt by passing off the story of a terrorist attack that has been dealt with. You have a black subordinate of Wikus, who spends most of the movie cowering behind his boss (and his dialogue repeatedly emphasizes that he is his ‘boss’). The only time the character is proactive is when he looks on the computer to find out what really happened to Wikus, and this action quickly gets him arrested, a fate which he seems to accept.
And I'm not the first to point out how gleefully unsubtle Multi-National United is as a name for the evil corporation, but, come on now.
On the other hand, the film is without a doubt a great technical achievement. The visual effects felt very real in all but a few shots, and considering how small the budget was, I’m inclined to look the other way.
Wikus, too, is an impressive choice of a protagonist. An entirely American film wouldn’t have allowed him to be so inept, so much of a coward, and so physically incapable a man. It wouldn’t allow him to participate in such horrific acts as the abortion scene, either (he’d be denouncing the acts in an act of defiance).
The use of faux-news sequences is very effective as well, and an interesting and unconventional choice.
I'd kind of like to see District 10. In spite of all my criticism, which is not minor, I enjoyed this film, and would rate it above average. It certainly has its mind set on much higher ideals of science fiction compared to most films in the genre. Styalistically it's much more adventurous than any other widely released science fiction film I've seen. The choice of protagonist is unconventional and (unlike the character) brave. And the allegorical message is well-delivered, even if it misses on some of the historical context and reproduces some racist stereotypes.
^^ Perhaps the aliens themselves brought about the end to Apartheid as the humes maybe decided any hume is better than a prawn? Maybe having a gigantic mothership looming in the horizon had a way of changing people's perspectives. That was what I figured at least.
Saw it today with JonathonWally. Rated: Excellent.
Spelled-out references to apartheid were unnecessary. As others have pointed out, you could see the segregation up on there on the screen. White people wouldn't trade with the aliens at all. All their trade seemed to come from Nigerians and other blacks living in the slums around them.
The more I think about the movie, the more disturbing it is. The abortion scene stands out in particular. I know some here have found it unrealistic or that it made Wikus unlikable or irredeemable, but this is hardly something without precedent. Forced sterilizations have happened in our history. We've gunned down women and children, pregnant women, innocents of all kinds. Every war is replete with these stories. For some people, there is no greater thrill than to murder with impunity and legal authority. That aspect of his behavior rang very true. He was a coward and a yes-man. He made his men lower their guns because he couldn't stomach watching Prawns get shot--not because it bothered him on some moral level, but because he was a weak and pathetic human being. Definitely not the kind of protagonist a movie like this usually has. Christopher is the real hero. He goes back to help Wikus even after Wikus betrayed him and stole the command module. I can believe he'll be back in three years, barring something stopping him.
I would argue that Wikus acts selflessly only once in the whole movie, when he tells Christopher to go on without him, so he can delay their attackers. And even then, he doesn't know how long he can stick to his guns. Something that stands out about this scene is how easily he takes to slaughtering other humans. He's become so desensitized to violence by this point, he transfers his excitement at the deaths of Prawns to the thrill of killing other humans.
The parallels also worked quite well for me: Wikus is gradually dehumanized, both figuratively and literally, through the course of the movie; Christopher is gradually humanized, at least figuratively. By the end, Wikus retains almost none of his humanity. The only bit of it we see is that he still loves his wife. If there's any part of him that was good, it was that.
I think it's fair to say that none of the humans were particularly good people. Some just happened to be worse than others--in some cases, much worse. There is no limit to the depths of our moral turpitude. When it comes down to it, if your government or your employer puts the tools in your hand to do something vicious and cruel, and they tell you everything's nice and legal and assure you that you just don't have the big picture, would you go along with it? Study has shown that the vast majority of us will go along. Peer pressure is a powerful thing. And the pressure involved here would have been immense.
The movie itself was well-done, and probably provoked more questions than it answered or even intended to ask, but I think that's a sign of a great movie. Definitely a thumbs-up from me.
Spelled-out references to apartheid were unnecessary. As others have pointed out, you could see the segregation up on there on the screen. White people wouldn't trade with the aliens at all. All their trade seemed to come from Nigerians and other blacks living in the slums around them.
The more I think about the movie, the more disturbing it is. The abortion scene stands out in particular. I know some here have found it unrealistic or that it made Wikus unlikable or irredeemable, but this is hardly something without precedent. Forced sterilizations have happened in our history. We've gunned down women and children, pregnant women, innocents of all kinds. Every war is replete with these stories. For some people, there is no greater thrill than to murder with impunity and legal authority. That aspect of his behavior rang very true. He was a coward and a yes-man. He made his men lower their guns because he couldn't stomach watching Prawns get shot--not because it bothered him on some moral level, but because he was a weak and pathetic human being. Definitely not the kind of protagonist a movie like this usually has. Christopher is the real hero. He goes back to help Wikus even after Wikus betrayed him and stole the command module. I can believe he'll be back in three years, barring something stopping him.
I would argue that Wikus acts selflessly only once in the whole movie, when he tells Christopher to go on without him, so he can delay their attackers. And even then, he doesn't know how long he can stick to his guns. Something that stands out about this scene is how easily he takes to slaughtering other humans. He's become so desensitized to violence by this point, he transfers his excitement at the deaths of Prawns to the thrill of killing other humans.
The parallels also worked quite well for me: Wikus is gradually dehumanized, both figuratively and literally, through the course of the movie; Christopher is gradually humanized, at least figuratively. By the end, Wikus retains almost none of his humanity. The only bit of it we see is that he still loves his wife. If there's any part of him that was good, it was that.
I think it's fair to say that none of the humans were particularly good people. Some just happened to be worse than others--in some cases, much worse. There is no limit to the depths of our moral turpitude. When it comes down to it, if your government or your employer puts the tools in your hand to do something vicious and cruel, and they tell you everything's nice and legal and assure you that you just don't have the big picture, would you go along with it? Study has shown that the vast majority of us will go along. Peer pressure is a powerful thing. And the pressure involved here would have been immense.
The movie itself was well-done, and probably provoked more questions than it answered or even intended to ask, but I think that's a sign of a great movie. Definitely a thumbs-up from me.
^ Both are quotes from "Alive In Joburg" (the short film on which District 9 is based). Both explicitly address the issue of Apartheid in a way that District 9 did not. And neither detracted from "Alive In Joburg," but rather added another layer of realism to the story. Ignoring Apartheid in the feature film makes it less real -- ironic, considering that, otherwise, the rest of D9 was much more realistic than any other Sci-Fi film to be released this year.
Also, Blomkamp had this to say about the "interviews" in "Alive in Joburg": "I was asking black South Africans about black Nigerians and Zimbabweans. That's actually where the idea came from was there are aliens living in South Africa, I asked "What do you feel about Zimbabwean Africans living here?" And those answers — they weren't actors, those are real answers..."
Damned powerful, especially when juxtaposed with the (very similar) reactions of the Apartheid government. Why the feature film ignored these elements, I don't know. D9 is certainly worthy of praise. I enjoyed it, and it elicited a powerful emotional response from me. But the lack of addressing these very real, very prominent concepts undermines the primary message of D9 -- a message that is far more powerful and profound in "Alive In Joburg."
