Discovery and "The Orville" Comparisons

[Captain of the USS Averof]

Better or worse doesn't quite matter, it's not the same thing

It’s about professionals, doing their very serious job, with millions of dollars on the line and millions of people watching/depending on them, with their lives in danger and still taking a minute to screw around and unwind a bit. It’s human nature. Ask a professional soldier (or an astronaut) if you don’t believe me. It happens all the time.

 

[fireproof78]

hardly analogous to my quote.

"in public in front of an alien culture when your number one rule is to draw no attention and cause absolutely no ruckus?"

You honestly don't think it wasn't out in public? Perhaps not an exact analog (analogy is always suspect-thank you Robert Heinlein).

People do stupid things, including talking back to superior officers,

 

[Greg Cox]

I'm 40 and I can barely recall a MASH episode, so most of you must be older than me.. If you guys don't like the humor don't watch it.

Hey, MASH plays all the time on Me-TV these days, along with STAR TREK and WONDER WOMAN and VOYAGE TO THE BOTTOM OF THE SEA . . . .

Never mind.

 

[GeekUSACarl]

It’s about professionals, doing their very serious job, with millions of dollars on the line and millions of people watching/depending on them, with their lives in danger and still
taking a minute to screw around and unwind a bit. It’s human nature. Ask a professional soldier (or an astronaut) if you don’t believe me. It happens all the time.

No, not the same thing. What you're talking about isn't something done to an alien culture in plain public view when you're number one rule is to go unnoticed and cause no noise.

What you describe is nowhere near the same thing.

 

[mos6507]

The Orville is a dramedy, not a documentary.

The bumbling professionals who don't deserve to be in their post is classic comedy ala Get Smart or The Pink Panther. Sure, if you overthink it, it gnaws away at suspension of disbelief, but it's a necessary contrivance in order to create situations like we had in the last two episodes, where characters are in way over their heads and they screw up left and right.

I know the show creates problems for itself by not having a clear identity. I get that critique. People are going to have unmet expectations. Ultimately you're either going to adjust to the wavelength of the show or you're not.

At least The Orville makes sure that not ALL of the crew are walking disasters, which helps balance things out.

What I like about LaMarr is he actually enjoys his job (aka my clip, Boom bitch!) Compare that to the poster children for anti-depressants in Discovery.

I like the fact that he is a walking unrestrained Id, basically a fratboy. It's not realistic and I...don't...care.

I've been guilty of it myself (since I'm very snobbish about entertainment in general) but I think there's an obsessive way of dissecting and critiquing entertainment that, taken to extremes, sort of sucks the joy out of it. It starts to feel like being a teacher grading term papers. If all you do is look or flaws, the only joy of watching a show will be to point them out on a forum like this. That's not to say that flaws, beyond a certain point, don't genuinely get in the way of enjoying a show, but I think some of the criticisms of The Orville do seem overexaggerated in relation to what it does right.

It's really simple. The Orville is probably not something that will go down in the annals of TV like Star Trek (or even MASH). However, what it has going for it are characters I give a crap about it, good music, some decent jokes that land well, and raises some socially relevant talking points, albeit with the subtlety of Fat Albert. And I don't feel like jumping off a bridge with the grimdark. That's pretty rare these days.

 

[BillJ]

It’s about professionals, doing their very serious job, with millions of dollars on the line and millions of people watching/depending on them, with their lives in danger and still taking a minute to screw around and unwind a bit. It’s human nature. Ask a professional soldier (or an astronaut) if you don’t believe me. It happens all the time.

These people simply didn't understand a lot of the context of what was going on in the society, witness Alara's hat. LaMarr probably grew up in a very free society where people could express themselves in any manner that liked. It is something ingrained in who he is. It cost him being an unexperienced visitor in a foreign land.

Nothing more. Nothing less.

I hate to bring up something totally tragic, but it is similar to what happened to Otto Warmbier, who stole a sign in a hotel in North Korea, and it ended up costing him his life.

http://www.bbc.com/news/world-us-canada-40308028

 

[GeekUSACarl]

These people simply didn't understand a lot of the context of what was going on in the society, witness Alara's hat. LaMarr probably grew up in a very free society where people could express themselves in any manner that liked. It is something ingrained in who he is. It cost him being an unexperienced visitor in a foreign land.

Nothing more. Nothing less.

I hate to bring up something totally tragic, but it is similar to what happened to Otto Warmbier, who stole a sign in a hotel in North Korea, and it ended up costing him his life.

http://www.bbc.com/news/world-us-canada-40308028

Otto wasn't a part of an organized expedition who was expected to draw no attention to him or his party in any way and obey his superior.

it's like the simplest expected thing. we GET it we just disagree with the idea that it's anything above stupidly funny,

I don't care who "one" is, it's a simple easy rule to follow, it'd been one thing if he got caught doing something by accident but come on, how seriously are we supposed to take that idiot?

heck even afterwards he refused to take his situation seriously.

But yeah it was funny.

 

[Mudd]

The sad thing is, Mercer probably gave John the assignment because he was afraid Gordon would draw penises on things.

 

[BillJ]

I don't care who "one" is, it's a simple easy rule to follow, it'd been one thing if he got caught doing something by accident but come on, how seriously are we supposed to take that idiot?

How seriously are we supposed to take Warmbier's situation? He went to the most oppressive place on the planet, and made one heck of a mistake. Getting caught up in a moment of juvenile antics.

 

[GeekUSACarl]

How seriously are we supposed to take Warmbier's situation? He went to the most oppressive place on the planet, and made one heck of a mistake. Getting caught up in a moment of juvenile antics.

I don't take him very seriously either but I'm not watching him on a show trying to frame his actions in context of said show.

Discovery is a serious show, whether one likes it or not they are making a show that is supposed to be painted as a more serious venture.

Orville is a comedy, which seems to me like they are "trying" to paint the show as a somewhat serious venture.

And I think Orville is not doing the serious thing well. I can't take a crew of half morons who forest gump their way through till the end seriously. As far as a comparison to Discovery, I think Discovery is doing a better job of framing itself for what it is.

This doesn't change the nature of the society they tried to paint, truly frightening. But it does change how I digest the episode and how it relates to their intent.

 

[BillJ]

Discovery is a serious show, whether one likes it or not they are making a show that is supposed to be painted as a more serious venture.

Which has been Star Trek's biggest problem since the mid-90's. It treats itself like it is important in the grand scheme of things, and the self-importance overwhelms any sense of wonder and adventure that should be there with people exploring the universe.

I'm not really having an issue with either the serious nor comedic bits of The Orville, nor how it transitions between the two. Obviously, everyone's mileage will vary, but I'm finding The Orville refreshing. Something that is unabashedly doing its own thing, not being bogged down by the grimdark trend like everything else around it.

 

[GeekUSACarl]

Which has been Star Trek's biggest problem since the mid-90's. It treats itself like it is important in the grand scheme of things, and the self-importance overwhelms any sense of wonder and adventure that should be there with people exploring the universe.

I'm not really having an issue with either the serious nor comedic bits of The Orville, nor how it transitions between the two. Obviously, everyone's mileage will vary, but I'm finding The Orville refreshing. Something that is unabashedly doing its own thing, not being bogged down by the grimdark trend like everything else around it.

I find Orville refreshing but can't agree that it's "doing it's own thing"

 

[Athena28]

Amen. "The Alternative Factor," anyone? Turnabout Intruder?

As a dog-lover, I never quite understood why "A Night in Sickbay" annoyed people so much.

I'm one of the few people I know who liked Turnabout Intruder. Probably because I was a girl growing up and it had a strong woman (even though she was nuts), lol.

I watched A Night in Sickbay recently. It was better than the first time I saw it.

Not a fan of The Alternative Factor.

 

[BillJ]

I'm one of the few people I know who liked Turnabout Intruder.

I like the episode. Shatner did some fine acting work as the deranged Janet Lester.

 

[Athena28]

I like the episode. Shatner did some fine acting work as the deranged Janet Lester.

Most people I know hate it and Spock's Brain.

 

[BillJ]

Most people I know hate it and Spock's Brain.

Neither are as bad as "And the Children Shall Lead".

 

[gblews]

The Orville is a dramedy, not a documentary.

The bumbling professionals who don't deserve to be in their post is classic comedy ala Get Smart or The Pink Panther.

But, neither Get Smart nor Pink Panther were "dramadies". So, some of the wacky stuff done in those shows/movie, you would not expect to turn up in a dramady. And to add to the confusion, the show is perportedly based on a classic space drama (TNG)

Orville's identity crisis seems to only be an issue with McFarlane scripts. But there is a Catch 22 in that any number of the weekly audience are probably not Trek fans and tune in looking for Family Guy in Space, which McFarlane's scripts seem to veer into often.

 

[Mudd]

Discovery is a serious show, whether one likes it or not they are making a show that is supposed to be painted as a more serious venture.

Well, it certainly takes itself seriously.

 

[fireproof78]

And I think Orville is not doing the serious thing well. I can't take a crew of half morons who forest gump their way through till the end seriously. As far as a comparison to Discovery, I think Discovery is doing a better job of framing itself for what it is.

I think Orville is finding its voice, and in so doing, is doing "it's own thing." It also has more unique characters, and allows each person to shine in ways that are unique to them. It may not be "professional" to you, but having worked in an industry for ten years, I'll let you know not everyone is professional all the time, especially in super serious moments.

 

[Mudd]

Well, The Orville is doing things that Trek certainly hasn't done in over three decades.