Different design for the NX-01

[Skywalker]

I like the different design but it does look more like a 23rd century starship.

Maybe 24th century (I'm assuming you meant the 2300s, since that's when the Akira was developed) starships just look like 22nd century starships.

I agree that the NX looks better than the Akira. I'm not a big fan of inverted warp nacelles (that was my biggest issue with the winning design for the USS Titan, too).

 

[Evil Ezri]

I like the different design but it does look more like a 23rd century starship.

Maybe 24th century (I'm assuming you meant the 2300s, since that's when the Akira was developed) starships just look like 22nd century starships.

I agree that the NX looks better than the Akira. I'm not a big fan of inverted warp nacelles (that was my biggest issue with the winning design for the USS Titan, too).

Nope more around 2250 - 2300, so yes it was not a ship of the 24th century (2301-2400). Never really happy with the NX-01 Enterprise design as it looked to be small and under developed as a starship.

Sure with the story about earth in the 2150's that United Earth could only do at the time was make smaller ships so they can produce more of them. Still the space around Earth was really unknown and having a very under developed ship did pose a problem with the ability to fight.

 

[Vanyel]

Yug, no one is denying the similarities between the Akira and the NX. But I ask you, in a real world scenario, is there the possibility that two ships from two different era's could look similar.

Actually, Vanyel I totally agree with you...I'm displaying this graphic to depict how much the NX is NOT like the Akira, how the NX is in fact a BETTER design and is more a departure from the Akira than it is similar. To that end, I made no additional notes in my post even though this thread is full of my opinions on this debate for purpose of allowing others to see a true comparison... I just posted the image to let people decide for themselves. After all the talk, a visual was needed. AND, I think (IMHO) it's clear that the NX is NOT the "Akira up-side down", and that Doug Drexler did an AMAZING job making the NX an extremely cool and unique starship worthy of being the central hero ship of a Star Trek series.

I'm sorry for jumping to the wrong conclusion.

 

[Glacial]

To scale, for more fun

 

[NIUPonyBoy]

I can see design cues from to the other, I don't see it as a rip off.

Hell, why couldn't Starfleet just pull a MOPAR and use styling ques from a "classic" ship and use them in a modern one?

 

[Guardian Bob]

Styles come back. There is a reason they re-made the Volkswagen Beetle.

 

[Galactus]

Wow I forgot this forum existed. I remember complaining back in the day every week. I don't know which one bothers me more, the NX-01 or those coveralls. I don't think they thought out of the box enough on the show, so the ship design was just lazy. So was naming the ship Enterprise.

 

[NIUPonyBoy]

I liked the ship and the uniforms. The only ones that actually made sense.

 

[Nerys Myk]

Wow I forgot this forum existed. I remember complaining back in the day every week. I don't know which one bothers me more, the NX-01 or those coveralls. I don't think they thought out of the box enough on the show, so the ship design was just lazy. So was naming the ship Enterprise.

The uniforms were way out of the box. Very different than the usual modern trek fare and inspired by jumpsuits worn by actual astronauts and military personnel.

The NX was a varation on the classic trek heroship design. They did a good job dropping in TOS elements. Nothing wrong with take cues from the Akira and the P-38 Supercharger

 

[Sci]

Given that the Phoenix was shown with modified warp nacells, froma design perspective that should have been Earth's contribution to federation starship design. I would then expect that perhaps the separate engineering section from the Vulcans, the Saucer from the Tellarites and perhaps that high level bridge from the Andorians. In essence we should have seen parts of the Enterprise in all of the ships on the show, not just the Earth ships.

I really like that idea!

It's always been my guess that the Federation was a human concept from the get go. Earth entered space with all the familiar alien races already knowing of each others existence. The Vulcans and the Andorians have been feuding for centuries, Klingons and the Romulans apparently have had conflicts before we ever set foot in space. My point is, Earth entered the arena late, but wanting to bring all races together (since us humans are so evolved, tolerant, and naturally a peaceful race ) and so a lot of what we see of the Federation is totally human.

While I think it's safe to say that the Federation was probably a Human concept, I don't think that it then follows that Federation=Earth. If you start saying that, what you're really saying is that all the other races chose to allow themselves to be dominated by Humans, which is just ridiculous. They'd allow an equal partnership, but they'd never allow domination.

We've rarely see an "alien" Captain, or Admiral (Spock the only that comes to mind, but we've never really seen him command a crew as such,

Plenty of non-Human captains and admirals have been established in Starfleet, including Captain Rixx of the U.S.S. Thomas Paine, Captain Solok of the U.S.S. T'Kumbra[/url], the unnamed commanding officer of the all-Vulcan-crewed U.S.S. Intrepid, Captain , Captain [url="http://memory-alpha.org/en/wiki/Satelk"]Satelk, Nog in the alternate future of "The Visitor," the unnamed captain of the U.S.S. Saratoga, Rear Admiral Savar, Rear Admiral Sitak, Admiral T'Lara, the unnamed Vulcan Admiral who decorated Jadzia Dax, two unnamed Andorian admirals in Star Trek IV, two unnamed Caitian Admirals in Star Trek IV.

And that's not counting non-canonical captains and admirals from the novels, including Leonard James Akaar (Capellan), Bazel (Saurian), ch'Regda (Andorian), Gohod Clif (Trill), Dalen (Horta), Ezri Dax (Trill), Vraath ch'Evram (Andorian), Gof (Bolian), Gralev (Tellarite), Grev (Tellarite), Bal Itak (Vulcan), Kadish (Vulcan), Kira Nerys (Bajoran), Mackenzie Calhoun (Xenexian), sh'Raazn (Andorian), Saavik (Vulcan), Sartak (Vulcan), Sivok (Vulcan), T'Vala (Vulcan), T'Vrea (Vulcan), Thelin th'Valrass (Andorian), Kila Vet (Trill), Masc (Denobulan), Los Tirasol Mentir (Alonis), Nyllis (Pentamian), R'Miia (Caitian), Savaj (Vulcan), Stell (Vulcan), Sulak (Vulcan), T'Nira (Vulcan), and T'Pragh (Vulcan).

And that's not counting the numerous non-Human junior officers we've seen over the years, none of whom were indicated to hold any separate legal status from Human officers.

and Oh, by the way: he's half human) ... Earth is considered sector 001, Federation Headquarters are on Earth.

And the Reichstag is in Berlin, but this does not mean that Germany=Berlin. The Australian Parliament House is in Canberra, but Australia != Canberra. The Beehive is in Wellington, but New Zealand != Wellington. The United States Capitol and White House are in Washington, D.C., but the United States =! D.C.

Very allegorically "American" as the super power of the planet, and in Trek terms, the super power of the known galaxy.

How can Earth be the superpower of the known galaxy when it's centuries behind every other major world in terms of technology during ENT?

Logically, Earth can't be the Federation capital because of some "superpower" status. The Federation is the superpower, not United Earth.

We've been a unified country for a very short time, but consider ourselves the police of the world, same as reflected in Trek, Earth is the peacekeeper, Earth is the center of the galaxy... and often they throw the aliens a bone by making the Federation president something other than human.

First off, who occupies the position of head of government is never "throwing a bone" at someone. That's the guy in charge. DS9 established that the Federation President is the commander-in-chief of Starfleet. That's not throwing someone a bone, that's having a President who isn't Human.

Secondly, DS9's "Paradise Lost" made it very clear that the Federation President is an elected office. Earth doesn't get to "throw a bone" to other Federation worlds by "making" the President non-Human, anymore than the District of Columbia gets to "throw a bone" to the states by "making" a non-D.C. native the U.S. President. The Federation President is elected by the people of the Federation -- and since that encompasses over 150 worlds, that means that more likely than not, Humans are outnumbered and are not a determinative constituency.

From the TV series and movies, we see that 99% of the people who do the exploring in Trek are human.

We've seen exactly four Federation Starfleet crews up close, and that's out of a Starfleet of hundreds of starbases and thousands of starships. Not nearly enough data to reasonably draw that conclusion.

Hell, in TOS the Enterprise is often referred to as an Earth ship.

It was only ever referred to as an Earth ship in the early episodes before the TOS writers created the Federation. (The Federation was first established in "Arena," and given its full name in "A Taste of Armageddon.") After the Federation was created, they retconned the Enterprise as a Federation starship rather than an Earth starship.

 

[fishingforships]

I tracked down this pic a while back and found it rather informative, I don't see anything that looks much like the NX, but I guess they had to make something pretty for the fans. I still think the NX looks a little to clean cut for the time period, but like it was said before, it grows on you after time. I'm not sure how old this is, it look's like it predates DS9 and Voyager, but I cant be sure.

 

[Kelso]

^ That's from Masao's Starfleet Museum.

 

[fishingforships]

Thank you for letting me know, I've been trying for a long time to find that site again. I keep a picture collection of every starship I can find on my computer for personal reference and the older ships are by far the hardest to find, now I can get a choice few that I've been sorely missing

 

[Nerys Myk]

I tracked down this pic a while back and found it rather informative, I don't see anything that looks much like the NX, but I guess they had to make something pretty for the fans. I still think the NX looks a little to clean cut for the time period, but like it was said before, it grows on you after time. I'm not sure how old this is, it look's like it predates DS9 and Voyager, but I cant be sure.

Fan conjecture. Has no real meaning in the context of the show(s)

 

[fishingforships]

Your right Admiral, it is just Fan conjecture. But in the space between the shows it's mostly fan conjecture. There's a whole lot of open space there to wonder about. The Enterprise C, what transpired between ENT and TOS, and what what earth was up to before the NX-10 was launched. I for one welcome the conjecture until these questions are answered for me.

 

[fishingforships]

Plus I really like ships

 

[Yug]

Given that the Phoenix was shown with modified warp nacells, froma design perspective that should have been Earth's contribution to federation starship design. I would then expect that perhaps the separate engineering section from the Vulcans, the Saucer from the Tellarites and perhaps that high level bridge from the Andorians. In essence we should have seen parts of the Enterprise in all of the ships on the show, not just the Earth ships.

I really like that idea!

It's always been my guess that the Federation was a human concept from the get go. Earth entered space with all the familiar alien races already knowing of each others existence. The Vulcans and the Andorians have been feuding for centuries, Klingons and the Romulans apparently have had conflicts before we ever set foot in space. My point is, Earth entered the arena late, but wanting to bring all races together (since us humans are so evolved, tolerant, and naturally a peaceful race ) and so a lot of what we see of the Federation is totally human.

While I think it's safe to say that the Federation was probably a Human concept, I don't think that it then follows that Federation=Earth. If you start saying that, what you're really saying is that all the other races chose to allow themselves to be dominated by Humans, which is just ridiculous. They'd allow an equal partnership, but they'd never allow domination.



Plenty of non-Human captains and admirals have been established in Starfleet, including Captain Rixx of the U.S.S. Thomas Paine, Captain Solok of the U.S.S. T'Kumbra[/url], the unnamed commanding officer of the all-Vulcan-crewed U.S.S. Intrepid, Captain , Captain [URL="http://memory-alpha.org/en/wiki/Satelk"]Satelk, Nog in the alternate future of "The Visitor," the unnamed captain of the U.S.S. Saratoga, Rear Admiral Savar, Rear Admiral Sitak, Admiral T'Lara, the unnamed Vulcan Admiral who decorated Jadzia Dax, two unnamed Andorian admirals in Star Trek IV, two unnamed Caitian Admirals in Star Trek IV.

And that's not counting non-canonical captains and admirals from the novels, including Leonard James Akaar (Capellan), Bazel (Saurian), ch'Regda (Andorian), Gohod Clif (Trill), Dalen (Horta), Ezri Dax (Trill), Vraath ch'Evram (Andorian), Gof (Bolian), Gralev (Tellarite), Grev (Tellarite), Bal Itak (Vulcan), Kadish (Vulcan), Kira Nerys (Bajoran), Mackenzie Calhoun (Xenexian), sh'Raazn (Andorian), Saavik (Vulcan), Sartak (Vulcan), Sivok (Vulcan), T'Vala (Vulcan), T'Vrea (Vulcan), Thelin th'Valrass (Andorian), Kila Vet (Trill), Masc (Denobulan), Los Tirasol Mentir (Alonis), Nyllis (Pentamian), R'Miia (Caitian), Savaj (Vulcan), Stell (Vulcan), Sulak (Vulcan), T'Nira (Vulcan), and T'Pragh (Vulcan).

And that's not counting the numerous non-Human junior officers we've seen over the years, none of whom were indicated to hold any separate legal status from Human officers.



And the Reichstag is in Berlin, but this does not mean that Germany=Berlin. The Australian Parliament House is in Canberra, but Australia != Canberra. The Beehive is in Wellington, but New Zealand != Wellington. The United States Capitol and White House are in Washington, D.C., but the United States =! D.C.



How can Earth be the superpower of the known galaxy when it's centuries behind every other major world in terms of technology during ENT?

Logically, Earth can't be the Federation capital because of some "superpower" status. The Federation is the superpower, not United Earth.



First off, who occupies the position of head of government is never "throwing a bone" at someone. That's the guy in charge. DS9 established that the Federation President is the commander-in-chief of Starfleet. That's not throwing someone a bone, that's having a President who isn't Human.

Secondly, DS9's "Paradise Lost" made it very clear that the Federation President is an elected office. Earth doesn't get to "throw a bone" to other Federation worlds by "making" the President non-Human, anymore than the District of Columbia gets to "throw a bone" to the states by "making" a non-D.C. native the U.S. President. The Federation President is elected by the people of the Federation -- and since that encompasses over 150 worlds, that means that more likely than not, Humans are outnumbered and are not a determinative constituency.

From the TV series and movies, we see that 99% of the people who do the exploring in Trek are human.

We've seen exactly four Federation Starfleet crews up close, and that's out of a Starfleet of hundreds of starbases and thousands of starships. Not nearly enough data to reasonably draw that conclusion.

Dude, I and others in this particular thread here are mostly speaking of Trek in the context of a written sci-fi series and it's allegorical notions as such. A metaphorical look at our own real world present and past. And how the writers defined the show, and the production of that show, beginning with the NX design. Not as an exploration of the Federation and it's fictional policies and politics. I get what you're saying, and I appreciate your thoughts, but this isn't THAT forum.

Lie down and have a dream, friend.

 

[ChristopherPike]

Fan conjecture. Has no real meaning in the context of the show(s)

Very true. Works of fanon can often have some influence on those involved in official production though.

I don't think I'll ever get the criticism about the NX. I'm a huge fan of Original Series, not a total purist obviously however given that I watched Enterprise quite comfortably buying its low tech look. To me, breaking out the welding torches to patch holes in the hull and passing a charge through plates on its surface was the realistic way to go. The ships designed in the 60's, both inside and out, have a certain minimalism and sleekness to them (especially now close up in HD, watching TOS-R). Okay, so the colour scheme is often a bit much and belongs more in a kids holiday camp, than a uniformed force's futuristic vessel but it still speaks volumes about how far advanced they were by comparison. The look is FAR less busy and maybe perhaps even influenced by non-human tech, compared to the Earth centric NX. Vulcans clearly got to tractor beams and shields before us. Maybe they came up with jelly bean buttons?

 

[The Castellan]

It's the same as taking a modern-day aircraft carrier but putting it in the 1800s with the only differance being that it's made of wood. It just doesn't work.

Well, an ancient Columbian burial site had a stone object that looks like a really fancy looking aircraft. As well as ancient Eygpt depicting images and statuary of what looks like an aircraft. And don't forgot the famous Mayan picture, sculpted in gold, of a air/space craft. The first two looked pretty slick and advanced.

Sooooo.....who's to say what 'looks' newer.

And if you wanna talk cars....look at the Edisel...that car looked like it came from a scifi movie of its day. Or the Corvette from the 50's compared to a Corvette of today....the latter had alot LESS details and such as opposed to its ancester.

 

[Galactus]

Wow I forgot this forum existed. I remember complaining back in the day every week. I don't know which one bothers me more, the NX-01 or those coveralls. I don't think they thought out of the box enough on the show, so the ship design was just lazy. So was naming the ship Enterprise.

The uniforms were way out of the box. Very different than the usual modern trek fare and inspired by jumpsuits worn by actual astronauts and military personnel.

The NX was a varation on the classic trek heroship design. They did a good job dropping in TOS elements. Nothing wrong with take cues from the Akira and the P-38 Supercharger

Just wasn't what I wanted to see in the show. I don't care what real astronauts wear. I wanted to see what people in a sci fi show were wearing