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Did the Daleks lobotomize themselves?

Guy Gardener

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I'm watching Hartnel at the moment, so I'm coming up with stupid thoughts about 1963 and 1964.

In the Daleks Invasion of the earth the Doctor tells Ian that this, what is happening here in the 22nd century is considerably millions of years before they meet the Daleks on Skaro a few weeks earlier.. Of course the Daleks they met millions of years in the Futures didn't know about other life in the universe or space travel or time travel, but there they are in 2167.

I suppose in The Mutants, it could have been so long since they killed everything and everyone else in the universe that they simply forgot that they didn't used to be alone? That's certainly possible?

Non Dalek life is so disgusting to these fellows that memories of such abominations is too inconsiderate a burden to place on them and their children that history and memory might have been rewritten to make everything beautifully Daleky (I'm flashing back to that Conspiracy movie about solving the final answer to the Jewish question.), of course why prepare for the future when you're in danger of contaminating it with merely your own thoughts, that your own considerable knowledge of non Dalek life is a threat tot he peace of mind to future generations? yes, sometimes book burning is a good ideaa to a zealot.

Thus the lobotomies and butchering of their history and race memory.

Of course, that's just if the Daleks won the final battle, because that doesn't really explain the Thals presence in the story? Because if the Daleks did lose, it is all too possible that the last of the Daleks (ad infinitum preserved) might be splayed into a wildlife preserve and that is what the Doctor met in the Mutants? Caged flesh acting out a repeating yet calming scenario to ... O? Isn't that the Matrix? Well, considering the additions to the Matrix Lore in the later movies, that the Machines do come to Zion every couple generations, cull the heard then reset human history to believe that the resistance is only beginning again for the first time even though all the survivors are complicit...

Unless the Doctor offering to build them a TARDIS in exchange for sparing his life, gave them the idea to actually put their inventiveness towards the technology of space time travel and the genesis of their evil is actually in the distant future reaching backwards to a lush universe of non Daleks they have not yet destroyed which destiny then suggests they already have since they already thought they were alone, which is the first of twice the Doctor has let Skaro know that there is life elsewhere in the universe worth conquering. Without his meddling it's a possibility that they would have been content in their belief that there is no life in the twelve galaxies and that's a decent enough sampling to be representative for the entire universe...
 
Well, I can't recall who said it but there's a quote floating around, something along the lines of "Not giving a toss about how it all fits together is one of DW's proudest traditions".

I certainly wouldn't try to make sense of a lot of the classic series as far as continuity. Especially when Terry Nation gave the Daleks two different types of origins. (Daleks vs The Genesis of the Daleks). But that "millions of years in the future" bit does stick out like a sore thumb, doesn't it.
 
Even the new series has screwed up Dalek continuity. How can Van Stratten not know what a Dalek is now?
 
True enough. But such are the perils of writing for a sci-fi/fantasy show that involves time travel.
 
There have been those who've attempted to rationalize the continuity and present a linear timeline of sorts. Mainly novelist Lance Parkin, who has written some interesting "history" books on WHO. While it's kind of futile, the books are still good fun and provide an interesting summary of WHO adventures. (Also the novelists tried to make their stuff tie in together better than the TV series did, but even one of them-Paul Cornell-has joined the 'no real canon' bandwagon...)
 
The most common theory is that Dalek history isn't supposed to make sense because Genesis rewrote it anyway.

Prior to that, fandom rationalised that the Daleks in The Dead Planet were actually ones left behind as caretakers when the rest of the race went out into space
 
If Daleks can make Daleks out of Cybermen and Cybermen can make Cybermen out of Daleks...

Dalek Tombs, eh?
 
Even the new series has screwed up Dalek continuity. How can Van Stratten not know what a Dalek is now?

I say that "Dalek" actually took place some time in 2008 or 2009, before "The Stolen Earth," and the Doctor just got the year wrong again. (No one else claimed that it was 2008 in that episode...)
 
If the Doctor thought Adam was from 2012, I daresay the boy was in for a bit of a shock when the Doctor took him home four years late.
 
Even the new series has screwed up Dalek continuity. How can Van Stratten not know what a Dalek is now?

I say that "Dalek" actually took place some time in 2008 or 2009, before "The Stolen Earth," and the Doctor just got the year wrong again. (No one else claimed that it was 2008 in that episode...)

It would've had to have taken place in 2007 for Van Stratten to have missed knowing about the Dalek invasion in Doomsday. But Dalek was set in the year 2012, even the Cyberman head was out of place at that. ;)
 
Of course we could always just say that in Van Statton's 2012, the events of 2009 hadn't happened yet. ;)

Wrap your heads around THAT one kiddos.
 
My explanation for the inconsistencies would be simply that the Daleks are time travelers like the Doctor. Unlike the Doctor, though, they don't care one bit about preserving the timeline.

In their blind hatred of all things not Dalek, they have rewritten their own history so many times that it is impossible to make sense of. (Maybe at their height, the Daleks were/are/will be able to build Paradox Machines.)
 
Only the masters of time can really rewrite time to any permanent degree. When the presumptuous try to run amok.. Well, there's either a royal smack down or a time war between equals trying to redetermine who is the master of time... Alexander had it right, you gotta capture the high ground. :)

It all depends on if One was only pretending he didn't know what a Dalek was that these were not the new kids on the block they seemed to be.
 
The Daleks weren't thinking correctly when they nightmared up that silly Reality Bomb and placed all their vital controls in Davros' lair onboard their planet ship.
 
Only the masters of time can really rewrite time to any permanent degree. When the presumptuous try to run amok.. Well, there's either a royal smack down or a time war between equals trying to redetermine who is the master of time... Alexander had it right, you gotta capture the high ground. :)

It all depends on if One was only pretending he didn't know what a Dalek was that these were not the new kids on the block they seemed to be.

Like I've said before, the Doctor has ALWAYS been fighting the Time War.

He's always been a "Special Ops" agent. Nearly every televised episode of the original series has chronicled some mission of his in the Greater Time War.

The 1st Doctor knew EXACTLY what was going on with the Daleks on Skaro and his sabotage of the fluid link was just a way to stay and fight the good fight and complete his mission.

It's only recently that the Doctor has begun speaking honestly about his otherwise classified work.

Of course, that's just my own personal Fanon.
 
What's also a continuity error is that I'm pretty sure all the B & W Dalek serials made mention of Daleks being reliant on static electricity for power. However starting when the show went to color, this was more or less thrown out the window.
 
What's also a continuity error is that I'm pretty sure all the B & W Dalek serials made mention of Daleks being reliant on static electricity for power. However starting when the show went to color, this was more or less thrown out the window.

I'm pretty sure that only "The Daleks" had them limited to static electricity. In "The Daleks' Invasion of Earth" they had gone beyond that limitation and had power aerials on the backs of their casings, and by "The Chase" it wasn't even mentioned at all.
 
Even the new series has screwed up Dalek continuity. How can Van Stratten not know what a Dalek is now?

I say that "Dalek" actually took place some time in 2008 or 2009, before "The Stolen Earth," and the Doctor just got the year wrong again. (No one else claimed that it was 2008 in that episode...)

It would've had to have taken place in 2007 for Van Stratten to have missed knowing about the Dalek invasion in Doomsday.

Not necessarily. The Daleks were in the skies above London for less than ten minutes, and this after hours and hours of Cyberman occupation -- the streets probably didn't have many folks in them; the sane people would be hiding, and the unfortunates already captured by the Cybermen. I could easily picture the Dalek incursion going unnoticed.

But Dalek was set in the year 2012, even the Cyberman head was out of place at that. ;)

The Doctor just steered the TARDIS to the wrong year again. When he dropped Adam off, he was too embarrassed to admit it. ;)
 
Like I've said before, the Doctor has ALWAYS been fighting the Time War.

He's always been a "Special Ops" agent. Nearly every televised episode of the original series has chronicled some mission of his in the Greater Time War.

The 1st Doctor knew EXACTLY what was going on with the Daleks on Skaro and his sabotage of the fluid link was just a way to stay and fight the good fight and complete his mission.

It's only recently that the Doctor has begun speaking honestly about his otherwise classified work.

Of course, that's just my own personal Fanon.

Ha! I've toyed with that theory in my head, as well. It would certainly help explain quite a few conundrums...;)
 
I just stuck the episode on. Watching it right now. In the first 10 seconds the Doctor says that they're in 2012 and Rose says that she would be 26 years old.
 
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