CaptainJack
Lieutenant Commander
Ok... Good. Unless you're one of the voices in MY head?
Did the accent Marina Sirtis used as Troi...
- Thread starter toughlittleship
- Start date
Interesting. It's similar to how Nimoy initially made Spock's delivery very precise and formal because he was trying to emulate someone who'd learned English as a second language.
Never watched "Stargate", but I've been a ST fan since 1979 have never come across people thinking Marina had a speech problem 'til this thread turned up. The creators had a choice: put a weird latex appliance on Troi's forehead, give her three breasts, or show alienness "through gesture and voice" (quote from Bjo Trimble).
Sort of. Marina is of Greek descent and the Betazoid accent she developed is vaguely Greek-accented English.
Actually the Betazoids were given a subtle "alien" makeup in the form of contact lenses that turned their irises all-black.
Yep, although I don't think Bjo knew that at the time - but we did hear that special yellow-iris, soft, contact lenses had been made for Brent Spiner, which was a much better deal than Billy Van Zandt, as the Rhaandarite ensign in TMP, got in more primitive times (1978): hard lenses that had been hand painted.
You know, I never even considered her accent. It just sounded like some vague European accent that maybe I wasn't familiar with. I mean depending if you live in the South, the North, the North West, the North East, the West, or the Mid-West parts of America you can have a different accent and there's likely to be variations and middles between them. So I just figured Marina Sirtis had some obscure English cockney-like accent I hadn't heard.
That she was trying to "make" an accent makes some sense, but I dunno. At the same time no alien species in Trek has ever had an alien "accent" even when speaking an alien language. The fan-plantaion for this likely having something to do with the universal translator. If we're going to bring accents into things we'd open all sorts of doors.
Picard is from France but he speaks like an Englishman.
Riker is from Alaska so he should probably have a North Eastern accent, he should probably talk more like Sarah Palin or Marge Gunderson, or someone from the cast of "Northern Exposure." Instead he has a very a neutral Mid-West American accent.
Worf primarily grew up in either Russia or on a Russian colony. He should sound more like Chekov but instead, again, he talks with a fairly neutral accent.
Crusher grew up on a Scottish colony so she should sound more Scottish. Instead, again, she has a more neutral Mid-West accent.
Geordi was raised by/grew up in Africa so he should have a pretty strong African accent but, again, he has a neutral one.
Data's an android and, thus, should have no accent.
So why did Troi have to have an accent? The only alien of all the aliens we encounter through Trek she's the only one with a noticeable accent?
As for all the neutral mid-west accents in the cast, that's easily explained by that being the standard way many actors are taught to talk (it's considered to be the closest to the way words are supposed to sound) for the most understandability and from there they develop accents for roles.
That she was trying to "make" an accent makes some sense, but I dunno. At the same time no alien species in Trek has ever had an alien "accent" even when speaking an alien language. The fan-plantaion for this likely having something to do with the universal translator. If we're going to bring accents into things we'd open all sorts of doors.
Picard is from France but he speaks like an Englishman.
Riker is from Alaska so he should probably have a North Eastern accent, he should probably talk more like Sarah Palin or Marge Gunderson, or someone from the cast of "Northern Exposure." Instead he has a very a neutral Mid-West American accent.
Worf primarily grew up in either Russia or on a Russian colony. He should sound more like Chekov but instead, again, he talks with a fairly neutral accent.
Crusher grew up on a Scottish colony so she should sound more Scottish. Instead, again, she has a more neutral Mid-West accent.
Geordi was raised by/grew up in Africa so he should have a pretty strong African accent but, again, he has a neutral one.
Data's an android and, thus, should have no accent.
So why did Troi have to have an accent? The only alien of all the aliens we encounter through Trek she's the only one with a noticeable accent?
As for all the neutral mid-west accents in the cast, that's easily explained by that being the standard way many actors are taught to talk (it's considered to be the closest to the way words are supposed to sound) for the most understandability and from there they develop accents for roles.
My twin cousins did an 18-month or so working holiday in the UK when they were in their early 20s. One deliberately retained her British "plum in her mouth" tones - at age 51 she still has the accent. Her twin's accent quickly reverted to a strong Aussie twang within a few weeks of returning home to Australia.
An experiment. Roddenberry suggested three breasts.
You forget Ilia (TMP). If they ever cast more actors as Deltans, they'll probably go for a similar Indian lilt.
IIRC, Reggie Nalder's lisp and unusual, whispery Austrian accent was deliberately cultivated to be more alien when playing Shras the Andorian ("Journey to Babel") - and, in the same episode, John Wheeler deliberately did a gravelly voice for Gav the Tellarite.
Celia Lovsky's natural accent added to her "high Vulcan" dialogue in "Amok Time". People expected the character to speak the same way as a young woman in ENT's Vulcan arc, but T'Pau had not yet been exposed to the ancient katras. Actually, don't forget that Dame Judith Andersen changed her Aussie accent to play T'Lar in ST III.
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CaptainJack
Lieutenant Commander
As for everyones neutral accent. I saw a story once (history channel) about how news anchors all across america speak that way because its supposed to be the easiest to understand. It all has to do with the way people pronounce the vowels. So I suppose many actors speak that way so they dont get typecast as a southerner or someone from Canada with a da yoopers whats up aye accent...
Yup. With the ubiquity of transporters and shuttlecraft, the brothers Picard (since Robert has a British accent too) could've easily commuted from their home in France to school in England.
In high school, I knew a girl who was from Baltimore but had been raised by an English nanny, so she had a gorgeous English accent. Maybe the Picards had an English nanny.
Heck, regional accents change over time. The London accent of Shakespeare's time sounded kind of like a stereotypical pirate accent or something vaguely Irish. So who knows what an English or French accent would actually sound like 400 years from now? What we hear the actors using may just be a translation into our terms of the language and accents the characters "really" use.
I don't know if they would; they'd probably just go for the best actors for the roles and let their accents be whatever they happened to be. I mean, how come Chancellor Gorkon and Gul Madred have English accents when most Klingons and Cardassians have American accents?
Or it could be that the younger T'Pau was speaking Vulcan heard through a translator while the older T'Pau of "Amok Time" was speaking English with a thick Vulcan accent. Or, again, it could just be that what we're hearing is an actor's interpretation rather than the "actual" truth.
There's no such thing as no accent.
Picard, Riker, Geordi and Worf were all raised on Earth. It's not unreasonable to think that the accents associated with different Earth regions would change significantly over the years. The Boston Brahmin accent used by Charles Emerson Winchester in M*A*S*H is not something you're likely to ever hear in Boston today.
It would be very surprising if different regions of earth in Star Trek's time had the same speech patterns they have today; the (to American ears) thick regional accents of Scotty and Chekov are probably more unrealistic than anything in TNG. I don't have any trouble believing that people in Alaska, Russia and the African Confederation all speak Iowan in the 24th century and people from eastern France speak Received Pronunciation British.
Crusher was born in Copernicus City, Luna. The only other Luna native I can think of is Dorian Collins, who if I remember right speaks more or less with a General American accent. She also lived on Arvada III. It's never specified when exactly she and her grandmother moved to the Caldos colony; she could easily have been in her late teens at the time, a few years away from shipping off to Starfleet Academy on Earth.
I happen to be an expat from Orange County, California who has been living in South Korea for almost 3 years now.
I am only surrounded by native Koreans where I live and work. My wife of over 2 years is Korean, so I primarily review "My English" (Not the Academic English I teach through standardized textbooks) at least once a month through dialogue-heavy American films such as Good Will Hunting, True Romance, Out of Sight, Dodgeball: A True Underdog Story, and Free Enterprise to name a few so that my brain can retain my American personality and natural speech patterns through slangs, expressions, humor, and natural "off-the-cuff" talk.
Now, if I were to sit around watching films outside of the American English I grew up with in my formative years all the time, I'm pretty much screwed in terms of my American English language retention. Let's just say, my days of watching an Akira Kurosawa film marathon or watching Victorian-era British English films in succession to pass the time is sadly pretty much over.
Eventhough I teach English to a few adult students who can speak pretty good proper and "too formal and rigid" Academic English with which is okay, I have no Americans or fellow westerners around me to speak "off-the-cuff" with.
I have to really think about what I need to say to the South Koreans here before I actually say anything for them to understand me. Hence, I use some "baby English" to talk to people instead of speaking carefree like the way I used to back in the states.
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I have heard that this is a bit of a retcon -- that Marina was given black contacts as part of the "alienness" but it wasn't until after Majel (who had naturally black eyes) guest-starred and everyone noticed the similarity, that it was decided that all Betazoids would have black-on-black eyes. Which certainly made things interesting the couple of times non-black-eyed Betazoids have shown up....
That's a big negative, Majel Barrett-Roddenberry was wearing black contacts too. Her natural eye color isn't real all that dark.
Just google pictures of Christine Chapel or Number One.
http://en.memory-alpha.org/wiki/Majel_Barrett
Just google pictures of Christine Chapel or Number One.
http://en.memory-alpha.org/wiki/Majel_Barrett
The clip was uploaded to YouTube in 2007, so I assume it’s from around then.
Quite right. Everybody has some sort of accent — because everybody comes from somewhere!
Well I've not seen/heard any dogs or cats remarking on the situation, so I made the generalisation of "people". Perhaps you'd like me to track them down and get their names and addresses so you can berate them?
Or you can read this thread. There are at least two posts where "People" have said they thought Marina had a speech impediment.
Although I think one of them might be a Llama...
Ok... Good. Unless you're one of the voices in MY head?
*drills hole in skull*
get out get out get out get out get out get out get out get out
Balderdash.
These are Majel's natural eye colour, taken during her time in uniform for ST IV. Before being cast in TNG.
Majel Barret and Gene Roddenberry by Therin of Andor, on Flickr
Majel wore black contacts to play Lwaxana Troi.
Very nice photo. I remember the magazine or one of the magazines that had this in it back in 1986. Thanks for the memories.
^How sad to think neither of them are with us any longer.
On topic. I don't think Troi's accent contributed to the perception of Marina as a poor actress. I think she was given some poor stuff to work with in the early days and maybe didn't do much with it. I think that's what contributed to that perception. I think she improved as time went on. On the other hand, her accent did seem to diminish over time, so perhaps the two are related!
On topic. I don't think Troi's accent contributed to the perception of Marina as a poor actress. I think she was given some poor stuff to work with in the early days and maybe didn't do much with it. I think that's what contributed to that perception. I think she improved as time went on. On the other hand, her accent did seem to diminish over time, so perhaps the two are related!
