Did Ron Moore get the Klingons / Romulans the wrong way round in TNG?

[Admiral Buzzkill]

Re: Did Ron Moore get the Klingons / Romulans the wrong way round in T

Moore got everything right.

 

[Zaku]

Re: Did Ron Moore get the Klingons / Romulans the wrong way round in T

Didn't they say in Enterprise that the Klingon augment virus caused personality changes?

Laneth (a infected female Klingon warrior) claimed that she "felt fear for the first time since I was a child."

 

[Christopher]

Re: Did Ron Moore get the Klingons / Romulans the wrong way round in T

Didn't they say in Enterprise that the Klingon augment virus caused personality changes?

Laneth (a infected female Klingon warrior) claimed that she "felt fear for the first time since I was a child."

Fictional characters, just like real people, say all sorts of things that aren't necessarily objective fact. Klingons believe that humans are weaklings, so it's natural that Klingons who've been altered into a more humanlike form would expect to be weaker as a result, and that this could become a self-fulfilling prophecy, altering how they perceive their own behavior and feelings. Self-image has a lot to do with how we think and behave. So it's hardly evidence of a genuine personality alteration.

 

[Mr_Homn]

Re: Did Ron Moore get the Klingons / Romulans the wrong way round in T

Didn't they say in Enterprise that the Klingon augment virus caused personality changes?

Laneth (a infected female Klingon warrior) claimed that she "felt fear for the first time since I was a child."

That's a valid point. The klingons we see in TOS supposedly act "less klingon" and "more human" because of human augment dna.

 

[Christopher]

Re: Did Ron Moore get the Klingons / Romulans the wrong way round in T

^Key word, "supposedly." As I said, just because one character believes that's the case, that doesn't make it objectively true.

I mean, really, what does it mean to "act human?" Human behavior encompasses everything from Gandhi to Hitler, from Mother Theresa to Jack the Ripper. It hardly makes sense to assume that human genes would make an individual act less aggressive or more timid. As Captain Kirk was known to say, we're predators at heart, as much as the Klingons are, but we've chosen to control it.

So Laneth's statement is clearly absurd, simply a manifestation of her own racial prejudices and self-doubt. She believed that being part-human made her weaker, and that made her insecure. It wasn't a genetic change that made her more susceptible to fear, it was her loss of self-confidence.

 

[Jeyl]

Re: Did Ron Moore get the Klingons / Romulans the wrong way round in T

I mean, really, what does it mean to "act human?" Human behavior encompasses everything from Gandhi to Hitler, from Mother Theresa to Jack the Ripper. It hardly makes sense to assume that human genes would make an individual act less aggressive or more timid.

But... But, in the Doctor Who episode "Evolution of the Daleks", it shows that if you combine a Dalek and a Human, it will be a very gentle and peaceful being thanks to it's human... stuff!

 

[Keith1701]

Re: Did Ron Moore get the Klingons / Romulans the wrong way round in T

I don't think it's so much a misunderstanding as an opinion/evolution.

I agree.

 

[TheRoyalFamily]

Re: Did Ron Moore get the Klingons / Romulans the wrong way round in T

Personally, I always had hoped that there would have been a peace between the Romulans and Federation, though the reboot movie put a nail in that coffin forever. It seemed that they were moving that direction between Spock going to Romulus, the Federation-Romulan alliance during the Dominion war, and the friendly overtures of Donatra to Picard, during the battle with the Scimitar. It is unfortunate we didn't get at least one more TNG movie before the reboot because I think it would have been possible to end the TNG era with a peace between the Romulans and Federation.

In Star Trek Online, that mostly happens. Sela took over at one point, so that threw things off for a bit, but with the destruction of Romulus the Empire all but fell apart, and many of the colonies banded together to create the Romulan Republic. Even though they are the good guys now, they are still Romulan enough to play both sides of the Feddie-Klingon war.

 

[Robert Comsol]

Re: Did Ron Moore get the Klingons / Romulans the wrong way round in T

Moore got everything right.

Yes, like the screenplay writer of TWOK:

Captain's log, stardate 8130.3. Starship Enterprise on training mission to Gamma Hydra, Section fourteen, coordinates twenty-two eighty-seven four. Approaching Neutral Zone, all systems normal and functioning.

[Apparently in the Romulans' neighborhood according to "The Deadly Years"]

KOBAYASHI MARU VOICE: Imperative! This is the Kobayashi Maru, ...nineteen periods out of Altair Six. We have struck a gravitic mine and have lost all power. ...Our hull is penetrated and we have sustained many casualties.

[Wait a minute, according to "Amok Time" Altair Six was in an area associated with the Klingons]

KOBAYASHI MARU VOICE: Enterprise, our position is Gamma Hydra, Section Ten.
SAAVIK: In the Neutral Zone.

[No, we're still good with the Romulans]

COMPUTER VOICE: Alert! Sensors indicate three Klingon Cruisers, bearing three one six, mark four, closing fast.
SAAVIK: Visual! ...Battle stations! Activate shields!
SULU: Shields activated!

[No, we're still good. Obviously Klingon Cruisers operated by the Romulans as in "The Enterprise Incident"]

SAAVIK: Inform the Klingons we are on a rescue mission.
UHURA: They're jamming all the frequencies, Captain.
COMPUTER VOICE: Klingons on attack course and closing.
SAAVIK: We're in over our heads. Mister Sulu, get us out of here.
SULU: I'll try, Captain.
COMPUTER VOICE: Alert! Klingon torpedoes activated.



SAAVIK: Any suggestions, Admiral?
KIRK: Prayer, Mister Saavik. The Klingons don't take prisoners. Lights!



[But Klingons take hostages to barter??? ]

From TSFS:

KRUGE: (in Klingonese) I WANTED PRISONERS!

Bob