Decker's First Officer?
- Thread starter Red Ranger
- Start date
Third base!
With no hard evidence, I would think it was Sulu.
I wonder what percentage of the intended crew came aboard for this mission in the end. It wouldn't surprise me if there were only about 100-150 people there, on a ship intended to be run by 400-500. Kirk probably wouldn't sweat bringing aboard every possible botanist and impulse engine maintenance specialist, figuring that either the mission succeeded with minimal crew and resources in minimum time, or it didn't stand a chance to begin with.
Leaving the original XO ashore would sound like a natural shortcut to take, and possibly something that Kirk had already "negotiated" with him/her/it down below before beaming up.
Just musing. But I've never been comfortable with the idea that Sulu would have been Kirk's XO - if only because so many Trek episodes and movies show the XO hovering helpfully near the skipper's seat rather than being tied down with something as vital and mandatory as piloting the ship. (Then again, Pike's supposed XO was hobbled that exact way... And perhaps Sulu would have hovered a lot more if not demoted back to helmsman by all the reshuffling?)
Timo Saloniemi
Leaving the original XO ashore would sound like a natural shortcut to take, and possibly something that Kirk had already "negotiated" with him/her/it down below before beaming up.
Just musing. But I've never been comfortable with the idea that Sulu would have been Kirk's XO - if only because so many Trek episodes and movies show the XO hovering helpfully near the skipper's seat rather than being tied down with something as vital and mandatory as piloting the ship. (Then again, Pike's supposed XO was hobbled that exact way... And perhaps Sulu would have hovered a lot more if not demoted back to helmsman by all the reshuffling?)
Timo Saloniemi
I also think that Sulu would have been the First Officer. Scotty handled Command well in TOS, but we all know he preferred tending to his engines than sitting in the Captains Chair. I would bet that he was offerred a transfer to a Bridge Post and the First Officer Position, which he would have turned down without a second thought. Also, the rest of the Bridge staff weren't as low ranked anymore. Sulu and Uhura were now Lieutenant Commanders, Chekov was a Lieutenant and Chief of Security, the command structure didn't necesitate him coming up from Engineering every time Kirk, Spock and McCoy would beam down anymore.
It made sense in TFF that Chekov was in command over Scotty, since in TWOK he was the First Officer of a Starship.
It made sense in TFF that Chekov was in command over Scotty, since in TWOK he was the First Officer of a Starship.
Even if Sulu did have the post of first officer he probably would have been demoted after nearly blowing up the ship thanks to a Deltan-induced boner.
Timo:
I can buy most of what you're saying regarding leaving some people behind. However, you also acknowledge that Captain Pike's Number One also acted as helm officer, so I don't see any reason why Sulu couldn't do both, and occasionally hover around Kirk when the need arose. I also remember that the Excelsior first officer, played by Miguel Ferrer, in TSFS was the helm officer, too.
But I can also kind of buy that the intended XO might have been left ashore, if not for that pesky, "no one else is rated on this design" line by Decker. But perhaps Kirk decided they needed someone with some familiarity with the refit left just in case Enterprise didn't make it. Then that person could serve on the next refit vessel as XO or maybe even CO, depending on circumstances.
Red Ranger
If you'll notice at the end scene you can hear a crew tally being given over the comm indicating how many crew are in what situation and counting up the given figures gets you around 400 or so. So it would seem they did have a full complement on board.
Have you tried counting heads in the rec deck scene? More than 150: there were 170 fans, the credited cast, plus pro extras, IIRC. Others remained at their posts throughout the ship and watched on monitors. The idea was to convey that the Enterprise held a lot of crew. More than in TOS, and more diverse (ie. aliens).
http://therinofandor.blogspot.com/2007/08/faces-in-crowd-ive-wanted-to-do-this.html
The whole "Enterprise without a full crew" thing is already a recurring cliche in the TOS movies without having to retrofit it to TMP. It made sense in II and III, but was one more bit of unnecessary stupidity in V.
I kind of agree that shoehorning that in is a bit of a stretch. I suggest a "compromise." The pre-refit Enterprise had a crew of 430. I don't think we know if that's the maximum crew complement. Let's assume that with the refit, you could have a larger crew, say 500 for the sake of argument. What if a small percentage of the full crew, because of the V'Ger emergency, didn't board the ship at Earth, say, maybe 20%, or about 100 crew members. Then you could still have the ship looking full and justify it in your head, if you so choose. --RR
Uhura actually mentions "final crew replacements" for Sonak and the woman killed in the transporter. It's not necessary to try to outguess that the TMP Enterprise was understaffed simply because decker hadn't yet announced his first officer.
Remember, in TNG, the Enterprise-D launched without a first officer. The TMP Enterprise launched earlier than anticipated to take on Vejur, and Decker hadn't had a chance to promote Sulu yet.
I'm guessing that the first officer wasn't on board. Scotty was probably too busy with the newly redesigned engines to effectively be the XO. Sulu, while a compotent bridge officer was still only a fairly new Lt. Commander to be the XO of the Federation flagship. I can see him being the 2nd officer though. Sonak was a possibility, but I doubt it since Kirk kind of made a production of advising Decker that he had to pull double duty, which sounded like something that was rarely done (i.e. Spock).
Just out of curiosity, did you know the refit had an official crew complement of 500 according to backstage information, or is this just an incredible coincidence?
Marian
No where was it mentioned in TMP that the enterprise was the "Federation Flagship" that nonsense didn't start up until the Next Gen.
Didn't you work up a full crew break-down somewhere at some point... I think I still have a print out of it somewhere...
I know that. :P
It's a coin-ki-dink! I didn't know about. I picked 500 becaue it's a nice round number and sounds better than saying 430!
-- RR
