Big annual crossovers are pretty much guaranteed at this point.
And we know another, albeit smaller crossover is coming up this season as well.
Spoilers DC TV Arrow/Flash Universe Crossover Discussion
- Thread starter Timelord79 (he/him)
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Big annual crossovers are pretty much guaranteed at this point.
And we know another, albeit smaller crossover is coming up this season as well.
I do think that future crossovers should perhaps be a single 2 hour episode instead of trying to span the crossover across 4 different TV shows. It's a nice marketing ploy to spread the crossover across 4 different shows but I think they could make an even better story if they stick to just a single longer episode.
A few points.
1.) Really disappointing that they not only tried to steal Quicksilver's style (with Barry catching and redirecting a bullet, etc.), but they did a shitty job of it, too. Nevermind that the turning the bullet around made no sense whatsover. If you're going to be that unoriginal, at least do something to elevate the theft.
2.) So the Dominators don't like metahumans, especially those who can time travel. But aliens with superpowers are a-okay, as are actual time travelers as long as they're using a ship? Uhh... I guess aliens with superpowers and time travelers with ships can't be bad guys, since that seemed to be their beef with metahumans?
3.) I really hate that they keep referring to Barry's goof as "Flashpoint," like it's some monumental and unique thing when he's traveled and toyed with history several times, nevermind that the Legends don't seem compelled to name every timeline they make/change/delete. It's even worse since it's a gross affront to the actual Flashpoint story.
4.) The "joy buzzer" attack, as someone else called it, was just really goofy. It's really, really sad that that was the best conclusion to the threat that the writers could come up with.
And last but not least:
5.) I'm really disappointed with how Supergirl fit into the overall story. Not only was her episode had nothing to do with the crossover (as opposed to just getting a "Next time, on the Flash!" scene), but she was mostly just kind of... there. Why'd they need her "big guns" again?
But at least Cisco seems to have gotten the stick out of his ass. I also loved Mick's interactions with Kara. "Hey skirt, call me." XD
1.) Really disappointing that they not only tried to steal Quicksilver's style (with Barry catching and redirecting a bullet, etc.), but they did a shitty job of it, too. Nevermind that the turning the bullet around made no sense whatsover. If you're going to be that unoriginal, at least do something to elevate the theft.
2.) So the Dominators don't like metahumans, especially those who can time travel. But aliens with superpowers are a-okay, as are actual time travelers as long as they're using a ship? Uhh... I guess aliens with superpowers and time travelers with ships can't be bad guys, since that seemed to be their beef with metahumans?
3.) I really hate that they keep referring to Barry's goof as "Flashpoint," like it's some monumental and unique thing when he's traveled and toyed with history several times, nevermind that the Legends don't seem compelled to name every timeline they make/change/delete. It's even worse since it's a gross affront to the actual Flashpoint story.
4.) The "joy buzzer" attack, as someone else called it, was just really goofy. It's really, really sad that that was the best conclusion to the threat that the writers could come up with.
And last but not least:
5.) I'm really disappointed with how Supergirl fit into the overall story. Not only was her episode had nothing to do with the crossover (as opposed to just getting a "Next time, on the Flash!" scene), but she was mostly just kind of... there. Why'd they need her "big guns" again?
But at least Cisco seems to have gotten the stick out of his ass. I also loved Mick's interactions with Kara. "Hey skirt, call me." XD
At least it's better than "I'M CYBORG SUPERMAN!!!".
My favorite reaction shots of the crossover was Felicity after the cousin comment and Kara's look after Mick's comment.
I think they just need the time to coordinate between the shows better. IE once they know which of the shows (if any) are being renewed, they should plot something across the shows and yeah maybe NOT try to tie them so tightly to the on-going internal stories of each particular show.
There of course may be elements they can't ignore - but IMOP each show in the crossover should treat the whole cast of characters as 'being there' and stop having so many ridiculous "no, you stay here..." moments to explain a character's absence from the situation (like in the middle of what could turn into a fight - Oliver telling Supergirl - the teams MOST powerful asset to wait in the hangar because it'll make him feel more normal and that's what he needs right now.
That would kinda be my wish for next year's event, for them to do a 4 part standalone mini-series unconnected to the main storyline of each individual show.
I really don't even care how silly of a plot they throw at it, as long as we just get a bunch of situations with all these characters interacting with each other.
For Supergirl to be more included, a story would have to be more multiverse centered. Maybe a riff on the first JLA/JSA teamup against the Crime Champions. It was a clever concept of villains commiting crimes on one Earth and taking refuge on an other Earth to enjoy their riches. It's not as Earth shattering as an invasion, but it can get heroes moving across worlds to help fight the bad guys they know. Maybe even add an Earth or two. Get Jay Garrick involved.
A 4-way crossover that isn't part of any of the shows' main stories would truly have to be an independent mini series. When they take up regular episodes, the show runners have to consider that not everyone watches all the shows and more importantly, that each show still has to flow on its own when presented in reruns or on blu-ray, etc.
But isn't that actually a bigger "problem" now than in a hypothetical more standaloneish crossover?
For example, if you only watch the Flash, the last episode ended with an alien threat and Cisco not wanting to be in the same room as Barry, and the next one will be "threat over, we're buddies again, oh and Supergirl's gone". I'm sure they'll recap what happened on the next episode, but if the crossover didn't advance the main storylines they wouldn't have to do that.
You're assuming that new DVD's will still be being made in 6 months. 
Streaming packages, on sites like Netflix, will "probably" force you to watch the cross over episodes.
Do they actually do that?
Private Practice/Greys Anatomy.
Chicago PD/MD/FD.
Law and order...
CSI...
NCIS...
Buffy/Angel.
Streaming packages, on sites like Netflix, will "probably" force you to watch the cross over episodes.
Do they actually do that?
Private Practice/Greys Anatomy.
Chicago PD/MD/FD.
Law and order...
CSI...
NCIS...
Buffy/Angel.
Yeah, that's what I'm saying and that's why a standalone mini series or movie would work better.
They don't that I'm aware of but it would be cool if they created or allowed different "playlists" to be made for certain shows. Even in a more limited scope with what they have now with usually a master watch list if you could add episodes instead of just whole series would be nice.You're assuming that new DVD's will still be being made in 6 months.
Streaming packages, on sites like Netflix, will "probably" force you to watch the cross over episodes.
Do they actually do that?
Private Practice/Greys Anatomy.
Chicago PD/MD/FD.
Law and order...
CSI...
NCIS...
Buffy/Angel.
Exactly. And this is how most TV crossovers work anyway. For instance, that bizarre Bones/Sleepy Hollow crossover FOX did last year -- the Bones part was a Bones episode with some Sleepy Hollow characters guest starring, and the SH part was an SH episode with some Bones characters guest starring. It wasn't a complete merger of both entire casts, and it wasn't a single uniform 2-hour story. Similarly, there was a 3-part crossover among the three CSI shows that shifted focus from one city/cast to another in each episode, with only a few crossover characters in each.
If anything, this crossover was far more integrated than most TV crossovers, as well as far more ambitious. It's remarkable that it was as unified as it was. This was anything but an easy thing to pull off, on any level, and the fact they did it as well as they did is an extraordinary achievement. I think that deserves celebration. The creators and performers who worked their tails off to achieve something this unprecedented deserve our thanks and our admiration.
This isn't Netflix. TV movies and miniseries on network television have become pretty much extinct. Besides, the work involved in doing a whole multi-hour crossover production in addition to the production of four weekly shows would be insanely prohibitive. It would require an entire new creative staff to make it, and who knows if they'd have as good a handle on the characters?
This one was likely a little easier than most, in that 3/4 of the shows already clearly were established in the same universe, and the characters had interacted previously. Arrow and Flash casts know each other and have been part of each other's shows already. Legends spun directly off of those two shows. Nothing stood out as odd, as these shows are already inter-related.
Supergirl was a tad harder. Yeah multiverse, and they had that one crossover last year, but it's a distinctly different universe and they haven't interbred like the other shows.
And as an entertaining observation: after watching Ray without a suit for several episodes, he goes through a couple of them in this episode! Finally gets around to rebuilding the suit (because they needed more flying laser heroes and not another punchy one in this mashup), and instantly gets kidnapped and the suit is presumably destroyed (or taken). Couple minutes in the replicator, out pops another brand new one to finish the fight. Hope he stole a lot of Dwarf Star alloy last week, he's chewing through it pretty quickly! Little disappointed it was so easy to just pop out a fresh suit, though, it made his suit-less period more pointless. Yeah, needed more DS to power it, but meh. Maybe could have at least shown him building a new one and moping that he didn't have any way to power it (prior to old west episode).
Of course, with a space/time ship, lack of raw materials was always going to be a silly angle. Anything you need, as long as it ever existed or will exist, is at their fingertips. Shouldn't be a problem. Probably should have been their first pit stop after his suit got destroyed; repowering him.
Supergirl was a tad harder. Yeah multiverse, and they had that one crossover last year, but it's a distinctly different universe and they haven't interbred like the other shows.
And as an entertaining observation: after watching Ray without a suit for several episodes, he goes through a couple of them in this episode! Finally gets around to rebuilding the suit (because they needed more flying laser heroes and not another punchy one in this mashup), and instantly gets kidnapped and the suit is presumably destroyed (or taken). Couple minutes in the replicator, out pops another brand new one to finish the fight. Hope he stole a lot of Dwarf Star alloy last week, he's chewing through it pretty quickly! Little disappointed it was so easy to just pop out a fresh suit, though, it made his suit-less period more pointless. Yeah, needed more DS to power it, but meh. Maybe could have at least shown him building a new one and moping that he didn't have any way to power it (prior to old west episode).
Of course, with a space/time ship, lack of raw materials was always going to be a silly angle. Anything you need, as long as it ever existed or will exist, is at their fingertips. Shouldn't be a problem. Probably should have been their first pit stop after his suit got destroyed; repowering him.
Well, I am looking forward to that upgrade they teased.
Cisco is right, it's due for a Mark II.
If Tony Stark talked to Ray in a Super Café or something, he'd mock him for flying that old piece of antique for three years (not including times being marooned in history).
Cisco is right, it's due for a Mark II.
If Tony Stark talked to Ray in a Super Café or something, he'd mock him for flying that old piece of antique for three years (not including times being marooned in history).
He said he had enough to build 20 Atom suits.
The point was to serve his character arc, to give him a period where he felt powerless and have that motivate his actions (e.g. his action to reverse-engineer the supersoldier serum, which led to Nate's transformation into Steel, and his experimentation with being Mick's partner). He had to go through a journey to figure out that his value and heroic potential were not defined by the suit. And once he resolved that, it was no longer necessary for him to be without the suit.
Except that dwarf star matter is extremely rare, presumably. Well, it can be found in any white dwarf star, of course, but they're so dense and hot that they're prohibitively hard to mine. So it would be pretty rare to find a piece broken off of a white dwarf. (The reason Julius Schwartz and Gardner Fox based the Atom's shrinking power on dwarf-star matter is because white dwarf stars are hyperdense, shrunken by their intense gravity to a size that's impossibly small for ordinary non-degenerate matter -- sort of like the first step toward a black hole, with a neutron star being the second step. So the idea was presumably that the material was exerting a similar gravitational effect to compress Ray's atoms, though of course this was a very fanciful application of a real astrophysics concept. The show doesn't seem to be bothering with that explanation, though, just treating dwarf star matter as a power source for whatever nano-techno-hoodoo lets Ray shrink.)
Don't remember which thread it was brought up in, but I noticed that need to fill in people who don't watch the other shows when Cisco had to deliver some exposition about vibing last night.
That's the thing...she was, to my knowledge, initially a popular character when she was just a cute, quirky supporting character on Arrow...she became intolerable when they made her Oliver's love interest, and thus a focus of much of the show's way-overdone ANGST!!!
The original version of the character was a retro-World War II hero in the '70s. In the comics, the descendant who took up his mantle used the same look. Oddly in the case of LoT, the original WWII version of the character isn't sporting a star-spangled motif, while the descendant is.
Sounds like a Berlanti special. I really hope that doesn't happen with Kara and Alex, mainly because I find both of them, and their chemistry so well written and kind of refreshing compared to other shows I see, including Flash.
Yeah, not to mention all the introductions -- Kara getting the Earth-1 heroes' names straight, Cisco getting the Team Arrow Recruits' names straight. And all the little asides recapping character details, like reminding us that Wally just got his superspeed or that Caitlin has powers she doesn't want. And Oliver telling Barry about the fate of his parents so that non-Arrow viewers would be up to speed about the significance of the fantasy world in part 2. They did quite a lot of this.
I don't think I could ever find Felicity intolerable. I'm still struck by how Emily Bett Rickards has great chemistry with just about everyone. Felicity and Cisco made a terrific team here -- they meshed so well I had to remind myself they aren't regular co-stars. I hope that, if Arrow ends before the other shows, Felicity gets folded into one of the other casts, or maybe gets a "universe regular" gig like Barrowman, Miller, and Cassidy have this season.
Felicity and Cisco working together is always fun, and it was my favorite part of the episode last night. It's also why I would love to see them on Supergirl Earth or Winn go to the Arrowverse. It just feels like that could be a blast in a really fun kind of way.
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