Data's Sexuality
- Thread starter Yvaine
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"They" wrote Data fast & loose, for a long time thoughout TNG: in NAKED NOW, he's capable of getting a disease. In other episodes, later on, he's put into situations where his being an android means he's safe from getting disease. We see Data with the top of his head unscrewed; we see his mechanical innards, from time to time and yet ... he can still get a buzz from alcohol, once his emotion chip's installed. It all seems to revolve around letting Brent Spiner in on the fun, or not.
As far as having fun in the sack would go, for being fully functional went, it was kind of wasted on the poor bastard, when you think about it. He's only "known" 2 (two) women, that we're aware of. He was kind of dating that one woman for a while, but I was under the impression it was more "Dinner & a Movie" kind of "romance," rather than being intimate, in that regard. So it doesn't really matter what his sexuality was. In all the years we've known him he was almost never in a position to do much of anything about it - any which way.
As far as having fun in the sack would go, for being fully functional went, it was kind of wasted on the poor bastard, when you think about it. He's only "known" 2 (two) women, that we're aware of. He was kind of dating that one woman for a while, but I was under the impression it was more "Dinner & a Movie" kind of "romance," rather than being intimate, in that regard. So it doesn't really matter what his sexuality was. In all the years we've known him he was almost never in a position to do much of anything about it - any which way.
There is a case to be made that just because a machine mimics perfectly the behavior of a man, doesn't mean that it is anything more than a machine. For example, I know that I am conscious but in the absolute I don't know if anyone else is. I only presume that they are because we are members of the same species and have 99,99 percent of our DNA in common. So I conclude along with pretty much everybody that has even asked themselves the question, that every one else is also conscious and self-aware. But if someone built a very convincing remote controlled automaton imitating macroscopically a man to the smallest detail, there would be no way to tell that he's not a sentient being. Because we don't have any device measuring self-awareness or conscience...
"Stars move, machines function, animals behave, and human beings conduct themselves." (Perhaps from "Ideology and Insanity" by Thomas Szasz.
If an android were truly chemically equal to humans, then he/she would have emotions. Could he/she behave though?
Emotions are measured by psychologists by: direct measurement such as blood samples or brain scans; inference from behaviour such as anger studied from aggressive behavior; and, self-report such as people explaining the phenomenology of an emotion or answering questionnaires or keeping journals.
If Data could understand all of the cognitive science of emotion without actually feeling emotion, then, he could emulate the last two measures of emotion without experiencing the first measure of emotion.
If Data were fully functional sexually, then this would mean sex role socialization, gender role socialization, and sexual orientation. Keeping in mind that he is "passing" as a human. Would he be a walking sex manual with parenting somehow programmed in too?
Perhaps if he had a 'Control-P' function, humans would finally have the perfect education in sexuality and parenting! Would we really want the "perfect" manual though?
In response to "Kobayashi Maru" though, has Spock yet learned what "Exact Change" only means?
If an android were truly chemically equal to humans, then he/she would have emotions. Could he/she behave though?
Emotions are measured by psychologists by: direct measurement such as blood samples or brain scans; inference from behaviour such as anger studied from aggressive behavior; and, self-report such as people explaining the phenomenology of an emotion or answering questionnaires or keeping journals.
If Data could understand all of the cognitive science of emotion without actually feeling emotion, then, he could emulate the last two measures of emotion without experiencing the first measure of emotion.
If Data were fully functional sexually, then this would mean sex role socialization, gender role socialization, and sexual orientation. Keeping in mind that he is "passing" as a human. Would he be a walking sex manual with parenting somehow programmed in too?
Perhaps if he had a 'Control-P' function, humans would finally have the perfect education in sexuality and parenting! Would we really want the "perfect" manual though?
In response to "Kobayashi Maru" though, has Spock yet learned what "Exact Change" only means?
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I think Data would be open to all experience and then make Picard very awkward by trying to talk to him about it. in the episode where Data's mother turns up (inheritance s07e10) she does say that dr soong gave him a sexuality programme, and she inferred that it was heterosexual, she also inferred that they were never sure if it worked though
I don't think Data really had any sexuality beyond mimicking what he saw others doing. Jenna D'Sora initiated the relationship, and Data decided to go along with it. As others have said, it wouldn't have played out any differently had it been a man instead of her. Also, in that episode we saw that it really didn't work anyway.
There's a switch on his back, next to his off switch.
I also think of Data as asexual. Although I consider him a sentient individual I was always bothered by the relationship with that Jenna woman. To me that episode is the story of a sad and lonely woman spending far too much time with her highly advanced vibrator and still not getting any.
As for Jenna: IIRC, she was already on the rebound when she met Data. So she was in an unfortunate situation from the get-go, and Data - in all his innocence - couldn't see that. So that relationship was basically doomed.
Yeah, it was a rebound. She was vulnerable, and he would be incapable of hurting her emotionally. She thought she wanted a "man" she could mould to her desires, but then ultimately realised it was empty because Data had no feelings for her, and could never have any. Aside from his memory engrams becoming accustomed to her. She was just another experiment to be analysed by his positronic brain.
Jenna and Data had a lot in common, they shared many of the same interests (including music), so maybe she thought she could build a relationship on that. And as Data pointed out, Jenna's last boyfriend wasn't very emotional either, so she seems to gravitate towards that type.
No wonder Spot kept running away.
Data is a machine that progressed to develop some human traits. His behavior is depicted as lying in gray area between heteronormativity and asexuality. I think the same could be said about Lore. Perhaps if Data had lived longer, I'm sure his sexuality could have 'evolved' into something outside of that spectrum.
Someone should write 50 shades of Data.....I jest.
Someone should write 50 shades of Data.....I jest.
So is Data asexual because he "has no sexual desires" of his own; he only has sex when prompted by a partner? And I know that "In Theory" seemed to determine that he could not feel romantic love, but I always thought he had some for Tasha: he cherished her hologram and spoke fondly of their intimacy and bond after her death. Or perhaps that was just because their night together made him EXTREMELY aware of her sensory input patterns?
All sentient beings - including Data - will have some form of desire.
Data was clearly capable of forming friendships, even pre-emotion chip, so I saw no reason not to think he would want a romantic relationship (a real one, not the farce he had with Jenna) some day.
And that's a good point about Tasha. Data guarded the privacy of the time they had together, so he clearly cared about her. And if he was capable of caring and friendship, he could be romantic as well. Even if he didn't know it at the time.
Data was clearly capable of forming friendships, even pre-emotion chip, so I saw no reason not to think he would want a romantic relationship (a real one, not the farce he had with Jenna) some day.
And that's a good point about Tasha. Data guarded the privacy of the time they had together, so he clearly cared about her. And if he was capable of caring and friendship, he could be romantic as well. Even if he didn't know it at the time.
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How sure can we be of that... If it's in his programming.
^ Please don't take this the wrong way, but...you can't reduce everything Data says, does or feels to "his programming". Remember, Data is a sentient being, and so he should be accorded all the respect and consideration that any other life form would.
Besides, as I said before, you can't prove Data is solely controlled by programming any more than WE would be. If you want proof that Data's thoughts and desires don't arise from programming? Prove that YOURS don't.
umm....ew?
Besides, as I said before, you can't prove Data is solely controlled by programming any more than WE would be. If you want proof that Data's thoughts and desires don't arise from programming? Prove that YOURS don't.
Someone should write 50 shades of Data.....I jest.
umm....ew?
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Data clearly adapted, developed and evolved beyond the basic system that was originally programmed into his positronic brain.
I mean, did he have some computer code installed in his head that told him to go to Starfleet Academy and choose a career path in the Operations division, and to become friends with Geordi LaForge, and to get a pet cat and name it Spot?
Edit: Nevermind... there's some necro thread love going on here.
Kor
I mean, did he have some computer code installed in his head that told him to go to Starfleet Academy and choose a career path in the Operations division, and to become friends with Geordi LaForge, and to get a pet cat and name it Spot?
Edit: Nevermind... there's some necro thread love going on here.
Kor
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