Maybe the Government decided Retcon in the water supply was the best way to deal with the recent traumatic exposure to aliens.
Dalek Invasion still erased (SPOILERS)
- Thread starter EJA
- Start date
Maybe the Government decided Retcon in the water supply was the best way to deal with the recent traumatic exposure to aliens.
Right! I'd be pretty pissed if that 2 parter vanished off my DVD's.
Though if it never existed, would I realize they were gone?
The cracks don't literally remove all traces of a person from time. If they did, Amy wouldn't exist in the first place since her parents got eaten by the crack. Likewise, Amy and Rory's engagement ring would have disappeared. The people involved just forgot those events.
And everyone you're complaining about in The Stolen Earth/Journey's End is a time-traveller (or dimensional traveller, which I'll assume also counts) anyway, so wouldn't be affected.
Now calm down and go and have a cuppa, there's a good chap.
And everyone you're complaining about in The Stolen Earth/Journey's End is a time-traveller (or dimensional traveller, which I'll assume also counts) anyway, so wouldn't be affected.
Now calm down and go and have a cuppa, there's a good chap.
So, nobody remembers the Dalek invasion, for whatever reason. What about all the deaths and global carnage wreaked by the Daleks then? How do they explain the mass bombings of major cities like London and New York in which many civilians must have died, and the murder of Britain's former PM? To me, it's like saying Hitler and the Nazis were erased by the Time Crack, but World War II still happened. Bonkers.
What about the attacks by the Slitheen and the Sycorax? I suppose they never happened now too.
What about the attacks by the Slitheen and the Sycorax? I suppose they never happened now too.
Well if you don't know why I found your comment highly amusing, I ain't going to explain it to you.
You really are getting your panties in a twist over this arn't you?
Does your enjoyment of previous adventures, or current ones diminish that much that you honestly can't get your head around the fact that past events may have been erased?
Well if you don't know why I found your comment highly amusing, I ain't going to explain it to you.
You really are getting your panties in a twist over this arn't you?
Does your enjoyment of previous adventures, or current ones diminish that much that you honestly can't get your head around the fact that past events may have been erased?
That does not answer my question. How do people explain the worldwide chaos from the invasion, now that they've forgotten the Daleks? After all, somone had to have massacred all those populations and blasted all those cities. You can't just ignore major events like that; it's a fact of life.
Although it's become rather a cliché, I rather think this was the point of the Doctor's comment in 'Blink' about time not being a simple case of cause to effect, but rather...well, you know the rest.
The events of TSE/JE happened. Davros created his army, and planned to set off the reality bomb. Earth was moved to the Medusa Cascade. The invasion occurred. Dalek saucers blew the stuffing out of various cities. Harriet Jones got zapped. The DoctorDonna was created. The Daleks were defeated. Earth got towed home.
It all happened.
And then the crack came along. And the crack didn't mean that these events hadn't happened. They had happened. They're part of the Doctor's life, of Sarah Jane's, of Captain Jack's. They still occupy a moment of history. It's just that that particular moment of history isn't in the past of most people. It's to the side, or above, or below, or whatever the term is.
I'll try to explain this point better. None of us were alive in 1066, right? (If you were I'd be very surprised). So there exists, in history, a 1066 with none of us in it. Now let's suppose we hop on a time machine and nip back to record the battle of Hastings on our camera phones. This would mean there had been two 1066's, one without us, one with us, co-existing side by side.
And when we return to the 21st century, we'd be in a time line in which we had been present at the battle, and had always been there. We might even find representations of ourselves in the Bayeux Tapestry.
Time, as presented in Who, seems to be mutable. It also seems to be perceived differently by those caught up directly in events rather than peripherally, though the exact mechanism is unclear.
As to the question of Harriet Jones, do we actually know she's dead in the new course of events? If not then the question doesn't arise. Even if she is, there may be an explanation. Remember 'Father's Day', and how Pete Tyler was 'supposed' to die in a road accident? I hate the term 'supposed' as it implies intent, which doesn't seem right, but the word will have to suffice. Now in that paradox strewn cul-de-sac of reality the car that was supposed to have killed him was somehow transported to his current location. Time itself was adapting to repair the anomaly.
Perhaps, following the crack, something similar happened. Not something as dramatic as summoning the Dalek that was supposed to shoot her, but some little fatal accident. So the world mourns Harriet Jones, who perished when her faulty gas boiler blew up, or her car's brakes failed. And those who were directly involved remember a different history, where she gave her life to fight the Daleks.
The events of TSE/JE happened. Davros created his army, and planned to set off the reality bomb. Earth was moved to the Medusa Cascade. The invasion occurred. Dalek saucers blew the stuffing out of various cities. Harriet Jones got zapped. The DoctorDonna was created. The Daleks were defeated. Earth got towed home.
It all happened.
And then the crack came along. And the crack didn't mean that these events hadn't happened. They had happened. They're part of the Doctor's life, of Sarah Jane's, of Captain Jack's. They still occupy a moment of history. It's just that that particular moment of history isn't in the past of most people. It's to the side, or above, or below, or whatever the term is.
I'll try to explain this point better. None of us were alive in 1066, right? (If you were I'd be very surprised). So there exists, in history, a 1066 with none of us in it. Now let's suppose we hop on a time machine and nip back to record the battle of Hastings on our camera phones. This would mean there had been two 1066's, one without us, one with us, co-existing side by side.
And when we return to the 21st century, we'd be in a time line in which we had been present at the battle, and had always been there. We might even find representations of ourselves in the Bayeux Tapestry.
Time, as presented in Who, seems to be mutable. It also seems to be perceived differently by those caught up directly in events rather than peripherally, though the exact mechanism is unclear.
As to the question of Harriet Jones, do we actually know she's dead in the new course of events? If not then the question doesn't arise. Even if she is, there may be an explanation. Remember 'Father's Day', and how Pete Tyler was 'supposed' to die in a road accident? I hate the term 'supposed' as it implies intent, which doesn't seem right, but the word will have to suffice. Now in that paradox strewn cul-de-sac of reality the car that was supposed to have killed him was somehow transported to his current location. Time itself was adapting to repair the anomaly.
Perhaps, following the crack, something similar happened. Not something as dramatic as summoning the Dalek that was supposed to shoot her, but some little fatal accident. So the world mourns Harriet Jones, who perished when her faulty gas boiler blew up, or her car's brakes failed. And those who were directly involved remember a different history, where she gave her life to fight the Daleks.
Calm down. Doctor Who is not real, never has been so why are you getting your panties tied so much in knots over it. It's a fictional construct and thus these things never happened.
As for if World War Two never happened, but no one remembered, swamp gas maybe?
Edit to add, Badger, that's a brilliant way of putting it across. So basically, everything did happen and everything didn't happen
No, please. Enlighten me. I'm intrigued.
Well if you don't know why I found your comment highly amusing, I ain't going to explain it to you.
Forget SJA. If you claim the Dalek Invasion (and knowledge of aliens) never happened because only what Amy remembered was brought back, then what about Skroog from planet JKJIJIN? Amy knew nothing about him/her either. (made up name/planet). The point is the WHOLE UNIVERSE was brought back because of "DNA like" memory that was in the Pandorica, not what was in Amy's memory, so the Dalek invasion and everything else in WHOville did happen.
reread what you originally said. Read what some people, including myself have said about how you conduct yourself on here. Then do the math as our American cousins say.
Are you suggesting that I throw insults and labels around rather than arguing the points at hand? I emphatically do my best not to do that around here, even when others fail to extend the same courtesy in my direction. You really ought to learn the difference.
Jaysis, Bones, I didn't insult or label anyone. I wasn't trying to silence anyone. I wasn't trying to harass anyone. All I was saying was that it is fucking stupid to get worked up over a fictional set of events that may or may not be considered in the current narrative of the story. Fretting about it on a Doctor Who board or fretting about it at a McDonald's, it doesn't matter either way. It's still fucking stupid.
Now, stop overreacting like always...
Now, stop overreacting like always...
Exactly! Couldn't have summed it up better.
Meanwhile, Sarah-Jane doesn't remember the events of The Five Doctors from 1983. DOES THAT MEAN THEY DIDN'T HAPPEN?!?!?!?!?!?
The same way Amy explains why her parents aren't around... it's something that they don't question. Amy knows her parents went away. She doesn't know how, but her mind doesn't actually dwell on that until the Doctor asks her.
Likewise, the people of Earth all KNOW a lot of people died in a big disaster. If they have to tell someone about it, they can refer to it as "I lost her when... well, you know...". And presumably if they do concentrate on it long enough to realize that they don't know the exact details of the disaster, they can't maintain that concentration very long, and the train of thought derails again.
If that's what you think, then so be it, I just found what you said highly amusing. Although what you said about being nice, did come across as slightly ironic and I was reminded of the "it's not fair" part of the Robot Club episode of Spaced.