Spoilers Crisis on Infinite Earths Discussion (CW Event Spoiler Thread)

Discussion in 'Science Fiction & Fantasy' started by Mark_Nguyen, Dec 9, 2019.

  1. The Realist

    The Realist Vice Admiral Admiral

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    Even though they didn't/couldn't show every single Earth, I think the implication of that montage was that they had all been restored one way or another. Certainly it leaves you free to assume as much about your particular fave(s). (And FWIW, Marc Guggenheim has said specifically that Smallville's Clark and Lois are still out there in the new multiverse living their happily-ever-after.)
     
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  2. Christopher

    Christopher Writer Admiral

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    Yes, of course they do. I'm just saying that doesn't obligate any other DC production to reciprocate. Many people online, including writers for clickbaity comics-news sites, are saying that Ezra Miller's appearance in Crisis somehow proves that all DC continuities are now "officially" one, that the movies will now be guaranteed to acknowledge the Arrowverse, that the fictitious conceits of this specific story will be binding on every other DC production from now on. And that's just a fundamental misunderstanding of how fiction works.


    Yes, but the same creator can work in multiple different continuities -- e.g. Marv Wolfman co-writing Crisis Part IV, which is clearly a different continuity from the original CoIE that he wrote. Or Kirsten Beyer co-creating Star Trek Picard, which disregards the Pocket novel continuity that she spent years writing for. Or Timothy Zahn writing a new Star Wars Thrawn trilogy to replace the original one he wrote.

    The reason for having different continuities is not lack of "awareness." It's understanding that different works of fiction in different venues are meant for different audiences. There may be overlap between them, but the whole point of doing different versions of a thing is specifically to attract a wider, more diverse audience than you'd get with just one version. So having the different versions be distinct from each other is a plus. You want each version to be able to stand as an independent entity and tell its stories the way it needs to.



    I remarked on that earlier in the thread. We have seen Arrowverse characters able to recover people's memories from erased timelines before, notably Vibe and Savitar/Alchemy.


    The producers assure us it's still there. I think we can safely assume that all the Multiverse was restored, except for the few Earths that were merged.
     
  3. Aragorn

    Aragorn Admiral Admiral

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    Wait, so you're saying The A-Team and Battlestar Galactica don't exist in the same universe?

    :guffaw:
     
  4. JD

    JD Fleet Admiral Admiral

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    Sorry, I guess I wasn't very clear in my other posts, I never meant to say that I expected the other shows or movies acknowledge the Arrowverse. All I meant was that the Arrowverse, and just the Arrowverse, was considering them part of their multiverse at the moment.



    Of course they do, but most of that stuff has not been exlicitly show to co-exist with the other stuff the way that Crisis did with the other shows.
    I know all of that, what I meant by awareness was that since Berlanti is involved in several of the shows, if they do choose to acknowledge them, he could work to keep them consistent with each other.
     
  5. JanewayRulz!

    JanewayRulz! Vice Admiral Admiral

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    I wondered about that too, but did they ever tell mom about Sara dying and being resurrected again? Maybe she's a nonentity in the post resurrected Sara's life.

    Speaking of plot holes, is the iMonitor still dead? If so, how is he supposed to bring Felicity to Oliver in 2042?
     
    Last edited: Jan 21, 2020
  6. jbny67

    jbny67 Captain Captain

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    I would have to go back and watch the scene in question again, but I thought that when Oliver was talking about the multiverse returning, he said it didn't happen right away. That it took time, but eventually the other universes returned,
    That would explain why nobody knows about it yet and why Brainiac couldn't find evidence of any other universes in this week's Supergirl episode.
     
  7. theenglish

    theenglish Vice Admiral Admiral

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    Wonder Twins Powers Activate! "Shape of an Ice Gondola!"
     
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  8. Turtletrekker

    Turtletrekker Admiral Admiral

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    Zan and Jayna would be a good fit for LoT.
     
  9. Skipper

    Skipper Commodore Commodore

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    By the way, the DC series about them is delightful
    [​IMG]
    [​IMG]
     
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  10. Guy Gardener

    Guy Gardener Fleet Admiral Admiral

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    2 possibilities.

    1. Oliver created a 16 billion year old Multiverse, and everyone has fake memories, so they have no idea that the universe around them, and everyone in it, is a couple days old.

    2. Oliver created a baby universe that split and grew, split and grew, split and grew for 16 billion years, and only then, the souls of the Paragons he'd been safekeeping since the beginning of time, even though he was dead, Oliver stuffed into a collection of doppelgangers on Earth Prime, murdering those Doppelgangers.

    3. Of course considering that time travel is a thing, so when you create a universe, you create the beginning and end of time at the same time as the middle, Oliver probably just hopped over the first 16 billion years of time, dropped the paragons off in 2020, and then went back to the beginning of time, to die.
     
  11. Reverend

    Reverend Vice Admiral Admiral

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    Clearly, you're not thinking 4th dimensionally! ;)
    The universe isn't new, it's billions of years old; they were literally standing at the dawn of time when they created it. Then they got zapped back to more or less their equivalent time and space of origin. The memories aren't fake, that's literally what happened in this universe, dinosaur fossils and all...which kinda makes J'onn firmware patching all the major character's memories back in kinda morally questionable since they're all technically doppelgangers of originals (who are all dead) with slightly different lives. Maybe Luci somehow stepped in and made sure all the old souls got back into their respective new bodies or something...but best not to overthink that aspect.

    And yeah, the multiverse is still there, we saw it begin and we saw a whole montage of the different Earth's post crisis. Just for now (possibly for simplicity's sake) the heroes of Earth Prime believe that their universe is now the only universe. I mean they can't detect the old multiverse's vibrational frequencies anymore and they know for a fact that at least 3 different universes (perhaps more) have merge into one, so it's a fair assumption on their part. incorrect, but fair.

    Side note: does this mean no more annual Wells for The Flash? Are they stuck with Nash now, or will Harry break through whatever barrier os blinding Earth Prime to the res of the multiverse next season or something?
     
    Last edited: Jan 21, 2020
  12. Christopher

    Christopher Writer Admiral

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    No, as I said, according to the Wiki entry, the last we heard, Dinah and Sara were in contact and on good terms. I specifically checked that to rule it out before I asked my question.


    If anything, they changed history so that Mar Novu never conducted his experiment at all and never became the Monitor, though some other Mar Novu did. Though with all of reality being wiped out and reinstated, there's no telling if that revision held.


    It took time in the sense that it started 13.8 billion years ago. Oliver's speech was a revised version of Novu's speech from the beginning of Part 1 (taken in turn from the narration at the beginning of the original comic) about how the Multiverse came into being in the first place. Oliver's narration confirms that the same process still happened in the reborn universe, different timelines splitting off and evolving over billions of years until we reach the present when there are many parallel realities whose histories have proceeded differently.
     
  13. Guy Gardener

    Guy Gardener Fleet Admiral Admiral

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    Thawne, but not Wells, the "original" blonde guy, was on Will and Grace again, while everyone else was squaring down against the Crisis.

    Weird choice.
     
  14. Reverend

    Reverend Vice Admiral Admiral

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    Wouldn't it be interesting if in Earth Prime, the "original" Wells wasn't murdered and is still alive? I feel like they've used the two interchangeably over the years and it'd be neat to finally meet the *real* Earth-1 Wells.
     
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  15. Guy Gardener

    Guy Gardener Fleet Admiral Admiral

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    In the lap of squalor I assure you.
  16. Serveaux

    Serveaux Tasteless and unnecessary Premium Member

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    Yeah, that would be interesting.
     
  17. Reverend

    Reverend Vice Admiral Admiral

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    RE: The Wonder Twins. With Lex back in play, I wonder if they might take a page from the DCAU and introduce a version of the Ultimen (for those that don't know, Shifter & Downpour were kind of stand-ins for the Wonder Twins.) He does have a history in other media of manufacturing his own heroes that he can control, and since Titans are already doing Conner/Superboy this might be the next best thing.
    It also kind of makes sense to have a corporate sponsored team of aliens and meta humans with the DEO now being under Lex's control, doubly so if he just grew them all in a lab.
     
  18. Christopher

    Christopher Writer Admiral

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    Is anyone else having problems with The CW's streaming site? I tried to watch Black Lightning this morning but couldn't get past the "Ad blocker detected, please disable" message -- even though my ad blocker's been disabled on that site all along. No luck with the other shows I tried either. I had the same problem in two browsers, clearing my cache didn't work, rebooting didn't work. I hope that means it's a problem at their end that a lot of people will be alerting them to so they can fix it (I already queried them through their help page), rather than some problem at my end I have to struggle to diagnose. Since I dropped cable, the website's my only way of getting the episodes. (I didn't want to post in the BL thread for fear of spoilers.)
     
  19. Mr. Adventure

    Mr. Adventure Admiral Admiral

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    I was able to watch today using Microsoft Edge as my browser (as I have ad blockers on my others) and was able to play fine though I was really disappointed that there didn't appear to be any navigation controls other than play/pause so I couldn't get to the scene I wanted.
     
  20. Mage

    Mage Rear Admiral Rear Admiral

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    Thanks for that, I wasn't sure since I'm not a big comicreader. ANd I've heard of The Justice Society as well, so I figured I'd ask.
    And the monkey..... Really??

    Still, it felt a bit out of place and all. I enjoyed Crisis, but it wasn't my favorite crossover and the last two episodes were the weakest I feel.