How is the new time line created by Nero's presence in the past even created, especially since we have 29th Century "time police" scanning the space/time continuum for any anomalous readings? Shouldn't have a Federation Temporal time ship have repaired that time line? Or since it is an "alternate time line that is created by the type of time travel (sling shot effect, temporal anomaly within the reality, or passage through a black hole), does the Temporal prime directive not matter since the changes in the time line effect a different reality? I hope this is clear, because now I need an asprin.
Crewman Daniels, USS Relativity, Capt. Braxton
- Thread starter Unimatrix_0
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I think the latter. Although ... it might be interesting if they came after Spock Prime, since he's in the wrong timeline.
They probably wouldn't, though, since he is now on a branch that can't affect their past. Unless, the jumpstart he gives the NuTrek timeline somehow poses a threat to them later when their paths cross again.
They probably wouldn't, though, since he is now on a branch that can't affect their past. Unless, the jumpstart he gives the NuTrek timeline somehow poses a threat to them later when their paths cross again.
Not this again! 
The Original timeline is intact, minus Nero, crew, Narada, Spock prime and the Jellyfish. Some bad shit happened there but it was all supposed to happen, (from the Temporal Police of the Futures POV.) All their disappearance's was supposed to happen therefore, as you explained, the TP have nothing to do.
Whether the NuTimeline has a TP is uncertain. I assume not since that would really throw a wrench in the works. Not having them in the NuT works fine for me since Multiple Universe Theorem eliminates the need for them because it states you cannot alter your own past.
The Original timeline is intact, minus Nero, crew, Narada, Spock prime and the Jellyfish. Some bad shit happened there but it was all supposed to happen, (from the Temporal Police of the Futures POV.) All their disappearance's was supposed to happen therefore, as you explained, the TP have nothing to do.
Whether the NuTimeline has a TP is uncertain. I assume not since that would really throw a wrench in the works. Not having them in the NuT works fine for me since Multiple Universe Theorem eliminates the need for them because it states you cannot alter your own past.
The original time line as pointed out still exists, except without a Romulus any more. The new time line there would be no way of policing the temporal excursion since the 31st century of the new time line has been altered.
Just because something's existence is not needed does not preclude it coming to exist anyway. See also: cigarettes, software licensing schemes, and VH1's "Rock of Love".
It doesn't follow that there would be no way and nobody policing the timeline: as far as we know, different (probably very different) versions of Braxton, Daniels, etc, may exist in the future of NuTrek - they'd just have no reason to police the events of Star Trek 2009 since, from their perspective, they were supposed to happen.
Not this again!
Correct me if I am wrong...but if you're upset that there is another thread related to this matter...do you really have to comment on it in such a fashion? I myself had not had a chance to review every single thread on this bbs, so how about we all just try to keep a civil tone, and share our ideas about Trek. Thanks.
END RANT.
Sorry. It just seems ample time has passed for people to understand how TT works in this film and how it is different from what has come before.
So, other than that; what do you think about the rest of my post? Do you get it now?
So, other than that; what do you think about the rest of my post? Do you get it now?
Thanks Shape-Shifter. I appreciate the insight. I have thought about it as well. Just wanted to hear what other people had to say regarding the matter. The multiple universe theorem definitely explains away the need for the 29th Century time police to interfere.
*sigh* Who cares? Star Trek (no bloody XI thank you) made a bajillion dollars. THIS is Star Trek from now on. Daniels, Braxton, and the Relativity have been relegated to the dustbin of obsessive Trekkie fanboy history.
Star Trek has never really done time travel correctly, especially with the "time police". The two most common theories for time travel are that either the timeline changes the moment someone or something new enters the past or that a new timeline "branch" will leave the current timeline. In either case, there would be no time cops. In case one, the change would be instantaneous so the time cops wouldn't have a chance to react. In the second case, there would be no need because the "main" timeline would be left intact.
See, I've always been a fan of the logical 'you can't change the past because it's already happened' camp. If somebody goes back in time with the intention of changing the past then they would always have gone back in time, and whatever past exists, exists because they have always been there. Time is linear. This is why time travel to the past isn't really possible. If it were, we'd be inundated with time travellers and we aren't.
Star Trek has always been inconsistent on this point but I suppose time travel stories would be quite boring otherwise. The Temporal Shielding in Voyager is the closest I've seen to a bearable excuse. Unfortunately, scientists are now endorsing the alternate timeline model of time travel so the temporal police are sort of redundant aren't they? Who cares if an alternate timeline is created? How can they tell whether the new timeline is better or worse when the butterfly effect has such massive implications (per Year of Hell) unless they too are shielded from alternate realities? How would that even work in practice since the original timeline still exists... yeesh.
Star Trek has always been inconsistent on this point but I suppose time travel stories would be quite boring otherwise. The Temporal Shielding in Voyager is the closest I've seen to a bearable excuse. Unfortunately, scientists are now endorsing the alternate timeline model of time travel so the temporal police are sort of redundant aren't they? Who cares if an alternate timeline is created? How can they tell whether the new timeline is better or worse when the butterfly effect has such massive implications (per Year of Hell) unless they too are shielded from alternate realities? How would that even work in practice since the original timeline still exists... yeesh.
Assuming that time travel works off of branch theory, perhaps Daniels and the "time cops" DID stop Nero, but only in timelines close to their own (prime) universe. Therefore, the only timelines that could be effected by Nero's trip are ones that are exceptionally different from the prime universe...
^Just my BS reasoning.
^Just my BS reasoning.
^But if it were the branch theory, why would they need to stop him at all? He wouldn't be changing anything, just creating another sequence of events that has no effect on what already has happened/ will happen/ supposed to happen/ however the hell you want to look at it.
Agreed. In the original/Prime timeline and TREK universe Romulus and Remus are destroyed in the year 2387. That much is incontestible. The Romulan civilization is all but obliterated in the TREK reality we've all known and loved for years. It's always possible that the changes in the timeline caused by Nero and Spock Prime have not been detected by the future time cops of the Federation like Braxton and Daniels, or that this new history even affects their own histories.
I doubt that, they just probably justran into Robau's badass essence which was release when he was stabbed by the trident thingy and all the time cops were instantly vaporized, oh also the entire 24th century was probably flashfried as well seeing as that much badass running around time and space tends to destroy whole eras.
I don't know that I agree with that last sentence.
According to The Path to 2409, the destruction of Romulus and Remus has resulted in two political entities that each have partial control of the rest of what was the Romulan Empire. Their civilization isn't destroyed. In programming terms, it forked. And things just get more interesting for the Romulans from there. Might not be so great for them, since they have to live through it, but it's great for us readers/players. 
I don't know that I agree with that last sentence.
According to The Path to 2409, the destruction of Romulus and Remus has resulted in two political entities that each have partial control of the rest of what was the Romulan Empire. Their civilization isn't destroyed. In programming terms, it forked. And things just get more interesting for the Romulans from there. Might not be so great for them, since they have to live through it, but it's great for us readers/players.
Thanks for the link. I wasn't aware of The Path to 2409. For real. This sounds very interesting and somewhat logical when you think about things. Certainly not EVERY Romulan and Reman would have died in the home star system and many outlying colony worlds would be untouched and provide the basis for new political realities and arrangements.
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