Could modern Excelsior class beat an Intrepid in combat?

[Xerxes1979]

Non-Lakota class, something like U.S.S. Hood vs. Voyager.

Voyager would be faster, more manuverable and have better phaser coverage, but the Hood is a much larger ship with a big ass warp core and its shields should be of similar tech.

Neither class has overally impressive photon torpedo ability so lets also set that as equal.


Let mortal kombat begin!

 

[judge alba]

would have thought Voyager myself, its smaller and more manouverable. also a big plus is that janeway commands voyager and she'll probaly find a smart way of disableing it
though the Excelsior is larger the defiant in the ds9 series was an equal match for the lakota and that was supposed to be upgunned and everything. the defiant i think is smaller then voyager

 

[Nerys Myk]

Is it the "hero ship"?

 

[SilentP]

Oddly enough, I have just finished watching the episode with the match between the Lakota and the Defiant

Hero ship syndrom aside, if both ship have the most recent refits available, I'd be putting money on the Excelsior class. The Intrepid may be the smaller target (I'd guess that the Excelsior is say 25-40% bigger), but I'd say it's not that much more manouverable than the Excelsior, and I think the Excelsior has a bigger power output and reserves to wear the Intrepid down through a continued engagement. As for phaser coverage, even though the Lakota was upgunned, I'd say that it's phaser coverage wouldn't be unusual for a Dominion War and post-War era Excelsior, and thusly isn't losing out in that area. As for torpedoes complement, I think that neither really has the advantage, though does the Excelsior have more fore launchers?

 

[judge alba]

I think in star trek 6 TUC sulu's excelsior had two, well it fired two torpedoes pretty quickly anyways

 

[Cyke101]

Oddly enough, I have just finished watching the episode with the match between the Lakota and the Defiant

Hero ship syndrom aside, if both ship have the most recent refits available, I'd be putting money on the Excelsior class. The Intrepid may be the smaller target (I'd guess that the Excelsior is say 25-40% bigger), but I'd say it's not that much more manouverable than the Excelsior, and I think the Excelsior has a bigger power output and reserves to wear the Intrepid down through a continued engagement. As for phaser coverage, even though the Lakota was upgunned, I'd say that it's phaser coverage wouldn't be unusual for a Dominion War and post-War era Excelsior, and thusly isn't losing out in that area. As for torpedoes complement, I think that neither really has the advantage, though does the Excelsior have more fore launchers?

Y'know what I love about this battle? Even though the Defiant was a hero ship, it was still on the verge of losing. The fact that the Lakota had to be souped up (and for the writers to point that out) in order to compete was a pretty significant plot point. Certainly much better than Voyager Vs. Braxton's timeship.

I've no comment on the battle itself, but I'm enjoying the comments thus far.

P.S. The USS Hood rocks my socks.

 

[The Wormhole]

Which one is Batman commanding?
Does he have time to prepare?

 

[Cyke101]

Which one is Batman commanding?
Does he have time to prepare?

He doesn't need a starship.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=pdgVnwo-Szk

 

[JuanBolio]

Given the yields of Star Trek weapons, I think just about any ship is capable of bringing down any other under the right circumstances with the right tactics. I think the odds would be on the Intepid's side, but the outcome is by no means a foregone conclusion based on technology alone.

 

[apenpaap]

I think the Intrepid class would easily win. Whenever a ship travels back in time in Trek, it is always shown to vastly overpower anything that era can hurl against it. In a Mirror Darkly is the most obvious example of this, but in Trek XI a simple mining vessel travels back in time and becomes a one-ship fleet.

 

[JuanBolio]

I think the Intrepid class would easily win. Whenever a ship travels back in time in Trek, it is always shown to vastly overpower anything that era can hurl against it. In a Mirror Darkly is the most obvious example of this, but in Trek XI a simple mining vessel travels back in time and becomes a one-ship fleet.

A simple mining vessel beefed up into a half-Borg supership, yes.

 

[Cyke101]

I think the Intrepid class would easily win. Whenever a ship travels back in time in Trek, it is always shown to vastly overpower anything that era can hurl against it. In a Mirror Darkly is the most obvious example of this, but in Trek XI a simple mining vessel travels back in time and becomes a one-ship fleet.

Ahem, Voyager Vs. Timeship? Bleh!

I think the Intrepid class would easily win. Whenever a ship travels back in time in Trek, it is always shown to vastly overpower anything that era can hurl against it. In a Mirror Darkly is the most obvious example of this, but in Trek XI a simple mining vessel travels back in time and becomes a one-ship fleet.

A simple mining vessel beefed up into a half-Borg supership, yes.

It didn't really need that borg tech nonsense anyway. Missiles from 130 years from any future should just about do the trick!

 

[JuanBolio]

It didn't really need that borg tech nonsense anyway. Missiles from 130 years from any future should just about do the trick!

Aside from turn into cluster bombs, those missiles didn't really seem to do much. The explosions and damaged they produced were pitiful compared to the photon torpedoes seen in the movie.

 

[Cyke101]

It didn't really need that borg tech nonsense anyway. Missiles from 130 years from any future should just about do the trick!

Aside from turn into cluster bombs, those missiles didn't really seem to do much. The explosions and damaged they produced were pitiful compared to the photon torpedoes seen in the movie.

Oh, we're not going down this route again, are we? Those missiles did their job, they blew shit up, one salvo reduced the flagship's shields by 70%! The last time we saw a TOS Enterprise's shields under that much firepower in one attack, it was against V'ger! As far as I'm concerned, the century-plus tech is more than enough of an explanation. If the damage was pitiful, I dare you to say that to the shield maintenance crew

 

[JuanBolio]

Oh, we're not going down this route again, are we? Those missiles did their job, they blew shit up, one salvo reduced the flagship's shields by 70%! The last time we saw a TOS Enterprise's shields under that much firepower in one attack, it was against V'ger! As far as I'm concerned, the century-plus tech is more than enough of an explanation. If the damage was pitiful, I dare you to say that to the shield maintenance crew

My theory is that they're relatively primitive mining charges with conventional explosives, but have been enhanced to pass through shields completely. The impact on the Enterprise was on the spine of the dorsal interconnect, which is probably where a lot of power is routed from the reactor to the rest of the ship - including the shield emitters. I think that shot knocked out a lot of shield emitters and blew out lots of power conduits around the ship, but did very little physical damage.

Photon torpedoes, on the other hand, were seen shattering unshielded Klingon warships with one hit, and blasting the Narada's arms to splinters with one salvo. Let the special effects match the script - the Narada's missiles didn't have much power.

 

[Cyke101]

Oh, we're not going down this route again, are we? Those missiles did their job, they blew shit up, one salvo reduced the flagship's shields by 70%! The last time we saw a TOS Enterprise's shields under that much firepower in one attack, it was against V'ger! As far as I'm concerned, the century-plus tech is more than enough of an explanation. If the damage was pitiful, I dare you to say that to the shield maintenance crew

My theory is that they're relatively primitive mining charges with conventional explosives, but have been enhanced to pass through shields completely. The impact on the Enterprise was on the spine of the dorsal interconnect, which is probably where a lot of power is routed from the reactor to the rest of the ship - including the shield emitters. I think that shot knocked out a lot of shield emitters and blew out lots of power conduits around the ship, but did very little physical damage.

Photon torpedoes, on the other hand, were seen shattering unshielded Klingon warships with one hit, and blasting the Narada's arms to splinters with one salvo. Let the special effects match the script - the Narada's missiles didn't have much power.

Good theory all around I would say, but one discrepancy that comes to mind is how the previous seven ships were just blown apart (implied to be pretty quickly judging by Enterprise's arrival and Nero's itchy trigger finger command). I can buy that the missiles were designed to affect or pass through shields like the Borg in "Q Who," but the impacts you imply the missiles to have wouldn't have been enough to destroy 7 ships so quickly. We see no evidence of other weapons on the Narada that might be able to do it, so how were they all blown up?

 

[JuanBolio]

Fair point, although the movie did have a fair number of plot holes. We're not sure exactly how far behind the other ships the Enterprise was. It seems to warp away from spacedock less than a minute after they do, but the next thing we hear is Sulu reporting the engines are at maximum warp, when they're only a bit over three minutes from Vulcan. Perhaps they'd been traveling for awhile by that point, and were having problems with their brand new engines. Maybe Olsen has just then managed to get them up to full power, leaving the Enterprise several minutes, say 15 or so, behind the rest of the fleet.

Its a lot of conjecture, I know, but the Narada's attacks seem fairly inconsistent. It took her several minutes (10, 12?) just to take out the Kelvin, but it laid waste to seven Federation ships in short order, and 47 Klingon ships over an unknown period of time. She scored one hit on the Enterprise which left a small scorch mark on the neck and brought the shields way down, and apparently killed a lot of people even as far away as deck 6, which was nowhere near the blast zone. Your guess is as good as mine. That the missiles just ignore shields is the best I can do to put all these pieces together.

 

[-Brett-]

It seems that every time an Intrepid class takes a hit, sparks fly everywhere and major systems are off-lined.

The Excelsior seems sturdier.

 

[The Wormhole]

Of course we could always look at it as quite a few Excelsiors were severely damaged or destroyed in the Dominion War, meanwhile a single Intrepid took on the entire Borg Collective and survived.

 

[NIUPonyBoy]

I would put money on the Excelsior.