Cloning Humans Could Start a Massive War.

[Alpha_Geek]

Don't worry... to get ten million they'd have to clone clones, and everyone knows that a copy of a copy isn't as sharp as the original. The result of this would be that you'd get ten million bigger idiots and even greater failures than the original. Remember, he went into politics because he couldn't even hang wallpaper worth a damn.

Hey.. what's that say about politicians today?

From 1 master cd you can press endless cd copies.From master DNA of Hitler you could do the same and not clone clones at all.

A single Hitler hair IS ALL THAT IS REQUIRED.HE WROTE BOOKS.
HE PAINTED pictures.Skin Flakes would have been trapped in the paint.Skin flakes trapped in the pages of the book allowing recovery.I hear dinosaur dna trapped in amber could be used to resurrect Mammoths.A dentist may still have his milk teeth.

Yeah, but CDs are digital, DNA is analog!

Besides, you couldn't name them all "Adolph Hitler" that's just too... I dunno... George Forman-y!

 

[Argus Skyhawk]

I hear dinosaur dna trapped in amber could be used to resurrect Mammoths.

Maybe, but if you want to clone mammoths it would probably be easier to use mammoth DNA instead of dinosaur DNA.

Remember, identical twins share identical DNA, just like clones would, but twins are still separate individuals with different personalities. A clone of Hitler would be his own person, not Hitler.

 

[Will]

Okay, a thread about cloning and genetic manipulation on a Star Trek board, and this hasn't happened yet?

I guess I'll do it...

KHHHHHAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAANNNNNNNNNNNN!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

 

[Mr. Laser Beam]

Somebody's seen The Boys From Brazil just a tad too many times.

 

[Alpha_Geek]

Ah, don't worry. While the Nazis weren't looking, I replaced all their Hitler DNA samples with Werner Klemperer DNA samples. Imagine the conversation in that South American biolab:

Random Nazi Scientist: Scheiss! Das HitlerKlonen ist nicth der Hitlerklonen, und ist das Klinkenklonen!

KlinkenKlonen: Colonel Hooooooogan!!!

 

[Myasishchev]

Don't worry... to get ten million they'd have to clone clones, and everyone knows that a copy of a copy isn't as sharp as the original. The result of this would be that you'd get ten million bigger idiots and even greater failures than the original. Remember, he went into politics because he couldn't even hang wallpaper worth a damn.

Hey.. what's that say about politicians today?

As a scientific, non-Hitler-related question, that's a matter of telomere snapping and potentially fixable, though, right?

 

[Alpha_Geek]

I was thinking more of crap on the xerox lens, but yeah. ;-)

 

[Icemizer]

Klinkenklonen bwahahahahaha.

 

[PurpleBuddha]

Okay, let's turn the topic away from Hitler. Somebody's always going to bring up the "cloning Hitler" or "cloning Einstein" or pick an historical figure argument.

Taking the genetic pattern for an average soldier on the battlefield today, how viable might cloning be in producing an army for the future? How much does nature versus nurture factor in?

I agree we should steer this in a less contraversial direction.

What about cloning Jesus? I think it entirely likely that some part of his remains will be found one day, if they havn't already.

And to make the exeriement more interesting, I think he should be raised by a Hindu family.

 

[bryce]

What about cloning Jesus? I think it entirely likely that some part of his remains will be found one day, if they havn't already.

Think I saw that on the Outer Limits - only they used the Shroud of Turin, which is pretty much a proven fake...

The problem would be - how to confirm it was Jesus' DNA!?

And even if you found a tomb sealed for 2000 years and radio-carbon dated as such, with equally radio-metrically dated bones and stuff and a verified 2k-yr old scroll saying...

"THIS IS WHERE WE DUMPED THE BODY OF JESUS AFTER WE FAKED HIS RESURRECTION WITH HIS TWIN BROTHER 'BOB'!

- SIGNED,
SAUL OF TARSUS aka 'PAUL' AND MY 13 BROS!"

...True Believers will just say it was hoax or conspiracy or trick of Satan...

 

[USS KG5]

What about cloning Jesus?

I'd love the conversation if you managed to somehow initiate the second coming...

"Hey Jesus, you know how you said for most of your bit of the Bible we should all learn to get along? Well we ignored that bit but we kept up with the revenge and the smiting, what do you think?..."

I think the more general question comes down to "Would a clone of an evil bastard, or great saint, lead to the creation of an evil bastard or great saint?"

I think it is hard to say anyone is genetically pre-conditioned to do great evil or great good - we ALL have the potential in us to do both. It is not only the genes it is the way we are raised and taught. Hitler was genetically pre-disposed to be paranoid and violent. But with the proper life a Hitler clone could control these things and his natural talent for rhetoric and mesmeric ability in public speaking could have been turned to good.

Now with Jesus obviously there are two options, he was either the physical manifestation of the son of God - I'm not touching that - or he was a man who said he was and preached "Love Thy Neighbour" and so on. In either case cloning would prove very little.

 

[Alpha_Geek]

Nah, while the Vatican wasn't looking, I smeared a huge amount of Arty Johnson DNA on the inside fo the shroud.


Verrrry Innnterrrresstink!

 

[Myasishchev]

A question: why would anyone want to clone an army? If you're going to go to the trouble of raising and enslaving a bunch of human beings, why do you need a big government program to make them when the private sector provides so many already?

 

[USS KG5]

A question: why would anyone want to clone an army? If you're going to go to the trouble of raising and enslaving a bunch of human beings, why do you need a big government program to make them when the private sector provides so many already?

Well the SW prequel idea actually makes some sense. If you are going to manufacture a war, literally manufacturing the combatants on both sides makes some sense. It seems to be one aspect of the SW prequels Lucas actually thought through.

Shame he did not put so much work into the love story...

"I killed them all Padme, women, children..."
"Oh wow I REALLY love you now..."

Gerk!

 

[Alpha_Geek]

Dunno, I prefer the unskilled labor method of producing humans myself.

Seriously... In the Star Wars universe, slavery exists. Unless cloning gets dirt cheap, conscription of slave children for training would always be more economical.

A true horror, but more economical.


In the Real Universe, I doubt labs large enough to make the OPs vision come true would or could ever be built or attempted to be built without raising the suspicions of someone.

 

[noknowes]

What about cloning Jesus?

I think the more general question comes down to "Would a clone of an evil bastard, or great saint, lead to the creation of an evil bastard or great saint?"

I think it is hard to say anyone is genetically pre-conditioned to do great evil or great good - we ALL have the potential in us to do both. It is not only the genes it is the way we are raised and taught. Hitler was genetically pre-disposed to be paranoid and violent. But with the proper life a Hitler clone could control these things and his natural talent for rhetoric and mesmeric ability in public speaking could have been turned to good.

.

Clones of Hitler would hardly be allowed to walk out the front door.
The sorrounding Nazis would start brain washing immediately to get him to start hating jews and blacks and in Aryan supramacy.

He would be shown his true destiny as a Nazi leader from the film archives.

He would be put up a figure head with other Nazi running behind him.A huge wave of Nazizism would rise worldwide.

DNA may be analogue but the police multiply it when there is not enough so you easily get a vat of it.

I don't understand the mirth about dinosaurs dna being used to create mammoths.Mammoths are dinosaur related.

 

[Asbo Zaprudder]

DNA may be analogue but the police multiply it when there is not enough so you easily get a vat of it.

Well, they've got to have something to put on their hamburgers.

I don't understand the mirth about dinosaurs dna being used to create mammoths.Mammoths are dinosaur related.

Yes, but they never call.

 

[farmkid]

Don't worry... to get ten million they'd have to clone clones, and everyone knows that a copy of a copy isn't as sharp as the original. The result of this would be that you'd get ten million bigger idiots and even greater failures than the original. Remember, he went into politics because he couldn't even hang wallpaper worth a damn.

Hey.. what's that say about politicians today?

As a scientific, non-Hitler-related question, that's a matter of telomere snapping and potentially fixable, though, right?

Last week, I interviewed for a Postdoc position in a lab that does a lot of cloning. I asked the guy, an expert in cloning, about the telomere thing, and he told me that it's not a problem. It turns out that when the donor nucleus is injected into the egg (which is full of telomerase), the telomeres are rebuilt back to their proper length. A clone's telomeres are of normal length.

The whole shortened telomere thing was something that scientists thought might be an issue and the general public picked up on it before anyone did the actual experiments to see if it was a problem.

Clones of Hitler would hardly be allowed to walk out the front door.
The sorrounding Nazis would start brain washing immediately to get him to start hating jews and blacks and in Aryan supramacy.

He would be shown his true destiny as a Nazi leader from the film archives.

He would be put up a figure head with other Nazi running behind him.A huge wave of Nazizism would rise worldwide.

DNA may be analogue but the police multiply it when there is not enough so you easily get a vat of it.

I don't understand the mirth about dinosaurs dna being used to create mammoths.Mammoths are dinosaur related.

I need to disabuse you of a few misconceptions.
(1) Mammoths are no more closely related to dinosaurs than you are. You are much closer relative of mammoths than you or mammoths are related to dinosaurs. If you want to clone mammoths, you should start with mammoth nuclei from mammoth bones or carcases from permafrost. There's an article about just that topic in National Geographic from this month or last month. You should check it out.

(2) Current reproductive cloning technology requires nuclei from living cells as the donor material. It is not currently possible (or even close to possible) to clone an organism from a DNA sample such as from a fragment of Hitler's skull or extracted from amber.

(3) The way police amplify DNA is by a process called PCR (polymerase chain reaction) and is suitable for amplifying small pieces of DNA, not entire chromosomes. That technology is not applicable to cloning as discussed here.

 

[USS KG5]

Clones of Hitler would hardly be allowed to walk out the front door.
The sorrounding Nazis would start brain washing immediately to get him to start hating jews and blacks and in Aryan supramacy.

So basically instead of a nature/nurture debate and the impact of such a schism on technology, you want to discuss "Are evil people evil"?

DNA may be analogue but the police multiply it when there is not enough so you easily get a vat of it.

Eh? DNA is a code you carry in most of your cells - why would you want a VAT of it?

I don't understand the mirth about dinosaurs dna being used to create mammoths.Mammoths are dinosaur related.

No they aren't, Mammoths were big Elephants and therefore Mammals like you or me.

 

[noknowes]

Clones of Hitler would hardly be allowed to walk out the front door.
The sorrounding Nazis would start brain washing immediately to get him to start hating jews and blacks and in Aryan supramacy.

So basically instead of a nature/nurture debate and the impact of such a schism on technology, you want to discuss "Are evil people evil"?

DNA may be analogue but the police multiply it when there is not enough so you easily get a vat of it.

Eh? DNA is a code you carry in most of your cells - why would you want a VAT of it?

I don't understand the mirth about dinosaurs dna being used to create mammoths.Mammoths are dinosaur related.

No they aren't, Mammoths were big Elephants and therefore Mammals like you or me.

But mammoths lived alongside dinosaurs.Explain that.

A vat of dna was a figurative expression which could enable millions of hitlars could be cloined from it instead of cloning a clone which would cause errors according to above poster.

Evil people are evil that is why they are evil.nurture and nature both are intertwined in a implioet relationship.Look at iraks sodham he was a soldier who became increasingly evil and brutish until we freed irak and restored democracy.

A blank hitler will be predisposed to evil but not be evil without evil elements turning him evil.