Follow along with the video below to see how to install our site as a web app on your home screen.
Note: This feature may not be available in some browsers.
Welcome! The TrekBBS is the number one place to chat about Star Trek with like-minded fans.
If you are not already a member then please register an account and join in the discussion!
FWIW, I've always felt BillJ was one of the more reasonable outspoken critics around here. Sure, he complains pretty much all the time, but I've never gotten the sense it comes from a place of entitlement or hatred, just from a disappointed man who really wishes he liked the new Star Trek series, but doesn't. Compared to certain other posters I can think of who act like their burning hatred for a fucking TV show is a mark of thier refinement as human beings.
I agree. In fact, I respect BillJ's love and respect of TOS, which I share. I can even see how that reverence for TOS can actually affect your enjoyment of Discovery--there is a mismatch in tone and look--which he talks about quite a bit. While I can get past that and enjoy it for itself, I can also see how it could be difficult for someone else.
At least he explains his views, and even praises some aspects of it, rather than just purely dumping on it as "crap" like certain other posters.
I'm not sure what mental math you're doing, but you can't start a sustainable population from two individuals. The Talosian's plan was doomed to failure. They should've aimed for the entire Enterprise, and even then that might not be enough genetic diversity.
Yes, they should've. But, where I get the math from (if the genders were split evenly):
Pike and Vina have multiple kids. 10 kids. Bear me with me because this sounds awful. 5 boys, 5 girls. Leads to five couples. Each of these five couples as 10 kids each.
1st Century
Generation 1 = Pike & Vina
Generation 2 = 10 kids
Generation 3 = 10 kids each from 5 sets of parents = 50 kids
Generation 4 = 25 sets of parents with 10 kids each = 250 kids
2nd Century
Generation 5 = 125 sets of parents with 10 kids each = 1,250 kids
Generation 6 = 625 sets of parents with 10 kids each = 6,250 kids
Generation 7 = 3,125 sets of parents with 10 kids each = 31,250 kids
Generation 8 = 15,625 sets of parents with 10 kids each = 156,250 kids
So, in two centuries you have entire city filled with incest and inbreeds. Which sounds horrible. And sadistic and twisted on the Talosians' part.
Okay, so this truly is sick. Next time just take my word for it that I figured out the math in my head. Spelling out how I figured it out just led to... wow. My typing out this horrible thing.
What the Talosians wanted to do really was twisted.
So, in two centuries you have entire two filled with incest and inbreeds. Which sounds horrible. And sadistic and twisted on the Talosians' part.
Okay, so this truly is sick. Next time just take my word for it that I figured out the math in my head. Spelling out how I figured it out just led to... wow. My typing out this horrible thing.
Yes, they should've. But, where I get the math from (if the genders were split evenly):
Pike and Vina have multiple kids. 10 kids. Bear me with me because this sounds awful. 5 boys, 5 girls. Leads to five couples. Each of these five couples as 10 kids each.
1st Century
Generation 1 = Pike & Vina
Generation 2 = 10 kids
Generation 3 = 10 kids each from 5 sets a parents = 50 kids
Generation 4 = 25 sets of parents with 10 kids each = 250 kids
2nd Century
Generation 5 = 125 sets of parents with 10 kids each = 1,250 kids
Generation 6 = 625 sets of parents with 10 kids each = 6,250 kids
Generation 7 = 3,125 sets of parents with 10 kids each = 31,250 kids
Generation 8 = 10,625 sets of parents with 10 kids each = 100,625 kids
So, in two centuries you have entire city filled with incest and inbreeds. Which sounds horrible. And sadistic and twisted on the Talosians' part.
Okay, so this truly is sick. Next time just take my word for it that I figured out the math in my head. Spelling out how I figured it out just led to... wow. My typing out this horrible thing.
What the Talosians wanted to do really was twisted.
If eggs were removed and inseminated, you could create a population without the insanity I described and it would work if the embryos were sufficiently altered. Emphasis on if.
Also, I wouldn't put it passed the Talosians to do this against anyone's will. They wouldn't even hesitate if it served their purposes.
The question is less what the Talosians can do and more what they want to do. A race as intelligent as the Talosians could've found their way off Talos IV and onto a more suitable planet.
It's also good leadership. Kirk can't afford to stop and mourn in most of these situations. He's responsible for 400+ other lives, and stakes that are often higher. Kirk does what any good leader must do, he continues to move forward and make decisions/take actions, and then he processes later.
We've seen examples of this throughout TOS and the TOS films. It's actually quite realistic...
I'm not sure what mental math you're doing, but you can't start a sustainable population from two individuals. The Talosian's plan was doomed to failure. They should've aimed for the entire Enterprise, and even then that might not be enough genetic diversity.
The Big Sleep (1946) with Bogart and Bacall famously has plot holes in its mystery plot. Legend has it the filmmakers actually called Raymond Chandler, the author of the original novel, to ask him who committed one of the murderers--and even he didn't know!
But nobody cares because of the chemistry between Bogie and Bacall . . ..
I can even see how that reverence for TOS can actually affect your enjoyment of Discovery--there is a mismatch in tone and look--While I can get past that and enjoy it for itself, I can also see how it could be difficult for someone else.
I have nothing but reverence and passion for TOS. It is one of my favorite things in life.
It in no way makes my enjoyment of DSC difficult or has any adverse affect on my perceptions. If anything, DSC's dedication to the backstory and some characters from TOS causes me to love it even more, unlike the other spin-off shows that purposely attempted to distance themselves and even sort of laugh at the source material.
I love DSC for its acknowledgment and connection to TOS.
