Chuck 2x11 - Chuck Vs. Santa Claus - Discuss/Grade <SPOILERS>

[Base_Delta_Zero]

I was praying to the tv gods Sarah would put that guy in the dirt. Merry Fucking Christmas, Asshole.

He deserved it. Shit, he practically wrote her defense attorny's closing argument for her.

And yeah, yeah, he couldn't hear what the Fulcrum guy said, but instead of not confronting her about what just happened like a normal human being (she's not going to kill him, she's his bodyguard, afterall and they've had how many misunderstandings in their relationship so far because of not communicating?), he gets all tv-angsty -again- and "hides" his feeling by glaring at her. This, apparently, was for the audience's benefit alone, because no one else noticed his expression.

And now we get a whole new round of If Only romantic tension because now she's totally in love with him and he's all conflicted. See what they did there? They switched it around on us! What a twist!

Bleh. Give me the intersect. I give Sarah free reign to execute any cold-blooded assassins who threaten my family, friends, national security and the woman I love. Hell, I'll even take her down off that pedestal and she can shoot them right in front of me.

 

[witchie]

I hope we don't have to put up with angsty, woobie Chuck next year. I won't be able to take it. He has to know the only reason Sarah would kill the Fulcrum agent was to protect him. He can't be that stupid. That's Sarah's job. Not to make yogurt or weiners. Her job is to protect him.

I almost choked when the little guy took out Lester. Big Mike and Awesome stopped dead in their tracks.

Good stuff.

 

[the Dagman]

I am going to miss this show until it returns in February. This episode was all kinds of Awesome, I just don't know where to start.

Sgt. Al Powell being Big Mike's cousin? Awesome. I wonder if Chuck will get a Nerd Herd call from Nakatomi Plaza now. Or we see a shot of Argyle now running his own limo business? And Big Mike certainly traded up on his status in movie franchises. Much better being Big Mike than a mental hospital orderly that gets beat up and put through a window with a steel grate on the other side by a cyborg that was just told he cannot kill any more people, and then eventually killed in the nuclear explosion unleashed by Skynet.

The whole hostage situation being a Fulcrum plot made total sense once it was explained that Fulcrum has made both Sarah and Casey's covers. The only thing now is that having been made, both Casey and Sarah should be replaced as Chuck's protectors, or Chuck needs to be secured in a CIA facility or killed. Or Fulcrum needs to be totally wiped out. For the benefit of the show's status quo, it is the last option that is the most viable. Although rumors about future casting point to at least the exploration of another of those options. I hope they opt to get rid of Fulcrum and move on to a different enemy spy organization if they need to use one in the future.

Oh, and can you just imagine how it was on the set the day they needed to film Lester's POV cleav-O-vision shot? "Okay now, squeeze them together, up and out.... pull in closer... closer..."

 

[Temis the Vorta]

Her execution of this man was totally unexpected and quite a bit shocking.. it was "realistic" and the only course of action but until now such dramatic moments haven't been seen in Chuck.

The logic was strained, certainly. If Fulcrum-guy is a threat to Chuck because if he vanishes, his buddies will know what he was investigating (BuyMore), then he's a threat regardless of whether he lives or dies. The point is, he's gone and presumably his buddies knew what mission he was on when that happened. BuyMore has now rocketed to the top of Fulcrum's investigation list.

And what other threat could he be? The CIA doesn't have a dungeon where they can make this guy vanish just as effectively as if he were dead? Pshwah! The far bigger threat to Chuck is that this guy vanished right at his workplace.

Far better would be to take him prisoner, invent some fake story that he's chasing a lead on the Intersect in Kathmandu, feed the story to his Fulcrum buddies, and have his dead body show up a few weeks later in Kathmandu. Sheesh, the CIA is slipping if I could do their jobs better than they can.

And if Fulcrum guy didn't immediately call his buddies to report his suspicions about Chuck when he had the chance, I guess the CIA has nothing to worry about because their enemies aren't much brighter.

As to Anna.. while she is cute as hell she's also a bitch. She knew Morgan, she knew he's a kid in an adults body

Anna's no more mature than Morgan.

He has to know the only reason Sarah would kill the Fulcrum agent was to protect him. He can't be that stupid. That's Sarah's job. Not to make yogurt or weiners. Her job is to protect him.

Oh, he knows that. But he can't handle the idea that the future mother of his children is a stone-cold killer, regardless of the motive. Cmon, if someone we knew personally and considered a friend murdered a guy who was clearly surrendering, wouldn't it freak you the hell out? It would certainly freak me out. I can't envision anyone I know doing something like that. Killing someone in self-defense in a confused crisis situation, sure, but not premeditated and cold like that.

 

[the_wildcard]

I thought this was a great episode because for once, we are getting some real drama. Up until now, it's been foo-foo lovely/dovey stuff between Sarah and Chuck. Don't get me wrong, I don't mind it. But I wondered how long they could keep it up during the show for the entire season.

Well I guess the buck stops here. Now Chuck is doubting himself if he truly knows what kind of person Sarah is.

 

[TGTheodore]

Now Chuck is doubting himself if he truly knows what kind of person Sarah is.

If this actually IS Sarah ...

--Ted

 

[Gary Mitchell]

Fans of Chuck, please vote for Yvonne in this poll if you haven't already: http://trekbbs.com/showthread.php?t=76702

Summer Glau is pretty, but I don't think she's prettier than Yvonne Strahovski.

 

[cylkoth]

Far better would be to take him prisoner, invent some fake story that he's chasing a lead on the Intersect in Kathmandu, feed the story to his Fulcrum buddies, and have his dead body show up a few weeks later in Kathmandu. Sheesh, the CIA is slipping if I could do their jobs better than they can.

They can, and probably will do, just that.

 

[Guy Gardener]

Okay...

Anikan kills a couple dozen, maybe a hundred sand people, women and babies too, and this gets padme wet as she falls into his arms. Peter shot Lois and she told him to stick his finger in the bullet hole and... Sylar kills Bob and his daughter Elle mounts him likie a thouroughbred fit to trot, but...

The Assassin who was going to kill Captain Awesome is sacred and special?

Fuck that!

Did she have to kill the other guy?

Because Ned Ryanisen, a name previously used by bob from heroes coincidentally enough in Groundhog day, would have to be an idiot not to notice that all roads lead to Chuck.

 

[Ryan]

But I don't see how Chuck can be true to himself by hooking up with a cold-blooded murderer, ever.

Sarah is a murderer but she definitely isn't cold-blooded. I'd go as far to say she's the exact opposite: Sarah's way too hesitant when it comes to killing.

 

[Data Holmes]

Hell, I'd love a hot girl who'd be willing to kill for me...

 

[Brolan]

Chuck knew Sara was willing to die for him or kill people in defense of him. But this is first time he's seen that Sara is willing to murder for him.

That knowledge (and a bunch of guilt it was on his account) is quite a load for Chuck to carry now.

 

[Guy Gardener]

Hell, I'd love a hot girl who'd be willing to kill for me...

My benchmark is still, if a woman makes me a TV from scratch, I'm hers forever.

B'Elanna and Tom, now that's LOVE.

 

[BigFoot]

^

 

[Gary Mitchell]

Yvonne beat Summer Glau in the last bracket in the Genre Babe of the Week Championship. She is now up against Anne Hathaway. So far she only has 27 votes to Anne's 49 votes. If you think Yvonne is prettier than Anne Hathaway she could use some votes. The thread is here: http://trekbbs.com/showthread.php?t=77364#post2424847

 

[Caretaker]

Kind of funny seeing the car wipe out a pile of (Dell) Alienware computers - well, I'm assuming there were supposed to be computers in the boxes.

 

[Temis the Vorta]

But I don't see how Chuck can be true to himself by hooking up with a cold-blooded murderer, ever.

Sarah is a murderer but she definitely isn't cold-blooded. I'd go as far to say she's the exact opposite: Sarah's way too hesitant when it comes to killing.

What she did in this episode was cold-blooded and calculated. She had time to think about it. I'm sure Chuck would have reacted differently if it had happened during a struggle for the gun. The fact that the guy was surrendering was what made it unforgivable, unless Chuck is going to alter his moral code pretty significantly.

 

[Ryan]

What she did in this episode was cold-blooded and calculated. She had time to think about it. I'm sure Chuck would have reacted differently if it had happened during a struggle for the gun. The fact that the guy was surrendering was what made it unforgivable, unless Chuck is going to alter his moral code pretty significantly.

I have to disagree. Watch the scene again and look at Sarah's face. There's nothing cold-blooded about it. Just the opposite in fact. She's running the emotional roller-coaster like she always does with Chuck.

If Sarah was really cold-blooded (and let's admit it, given her job she should be) she would have shot the Fulcrum agent far sooner and wouldn't have been so easily rattled by him.

But Sarah clearly doesn't like doing that kind of thing, even when the bad guy is running his mouth off practically begging her to. Casey is the cold-blooded and calculated one. Sarah's the one looking for picket fences and normalcy (which is why she's hung up on Chuck).

 

[Ruaidhri]

What she did in this episode was cold-blooded and calculated. She had time to think about it. I'm sure Chuck would have reacted differently if it had happened during a struggle for the gun. The fact that the guy was surrendering was what made it unforgivable, unless Chuck is going to alter his moral code pretty significantly.

I have to disagree. Watch the scene again and look at Sarah's face. There's nothing cold-blooded about it. Just the opposite in fact. She's running the emotional roller-coaster like she always does with Chuck.

If Sarah was really cold-blooded (and let's admit it, given her job she should be) she would have shot the Fulcrum agent far sooner and wouldn't have been so easily rattled by him.

But Sarah clearly doesn't like doing that kind of thing, even when the bad guy is running his mouth off practically begging her to. Casey is the cold-blooded and calculated one. Sarah's the one looking for picket fences and normalcy (which is why she's hung up on Chuck).

That's my feeling on this too. If Sarah wasn't in love wth Chuck, the Fulcrum guy would be in a cell. The action was cold-blooded, but the motivation was not. It was pure protectiveness.

And to be quite honest, when I tune in to Chuck, angsty unrequited love and silly comedic spy stuff is what I expect and look forward to seeing. While certain plot points have changed here and there, the show has been pretty consistent in it's themes. It surprises me a little when people who watched the first season express annoyance at the shippy part of the show. Seems to me that the love story is the number one plotline.

 

[Temis the Vorta]

If Sarah was really cold-blooded (and let's admit it, given her job she should be) she would have shot the Fulcrum agent far sooner and wouldn't have been so easily rattled by him.

What she did was cold-blooded murder by the legal definition. She wasn't in hot pursuit of a suspect or fighting for a weapon. He was surrendering. If she were subject to normal legal proceedings, she'd be up for first-degree murder.

And she did the "right thing" even if she didn't give a flip about Chuck as a person. It's her job to go to extremes to protect him, as the Intersect. She didn't shoot him because she was "rattled," but because according to the story logic, that's what she had to do, in order to do her job. In her place, Casey would have killed the guy, too, and I'm pretty sure he's not madly in love with Chuck except for in fanfic.

But really the question is not whether I think she was justified, but whether Chuck thinks she was. Chuck could see her face, too, and he was nonetheless horrified by what she did. The fact that she might have been motivated by love just makes it all the more disturbing.

It might be some small consolation to Chuck to realize that she would have acted no differently even if she didn't love him, but since she does, it freaks him out. Well really what freaks him out is that he loves her, and she has become a horrible, scary person in his eyes. I'm really interested to see how they resolve this situation because I don't see any possible happy ending anymore, but who knows...?

This is a very interesting and surprising twist. This show has great writing and I wish they could lend Heroes some of their people.