Chekov & Terrell's Mysteriously Appearing Phasers

[There Be Whales Here]

Maybe this sounds like a nitpick, but it's something that I couldn't help wondering about over the years every time I re-watch TWOK.

After Kirk & company find Chekov and Terrell stuffed in the storage locker they prepare to beam down to Regula. It's clear at that time that neither of them are visibly armed. Once inside the planet Kirk is attacked by David who clearly has some parental abandonment issues. We can see in those scenes phasers drawn and being held by Kirk, Saavik, McCoy and the soon-to-be vaporized Regula scientist; but Chekov and Terrell are just watching, still with no weapons. After Carrol appears, Chekov and Terrell reveal their deception by leveling phasers at the group. But where did they come from? Or more to the point, where were they hiding them all this time?

They were clearly not carrying them openly prior to that and it just seems to me that the design of the "Monster Maroon" uniform, being without pockets, and due to the size of the TWOK hand phasers, that it does not lend itself easily for concealed carry. I suppose the phasers could have be carried under the jacket and thanks to 23rd century fabrics, not leave a visible bulge or printing; but it always seemed like a convenient form of handwaving in order to show the "dramatic reveal" and make the two appear non-threatening prior to it. As a side note, I always thought that if Khan was the one who had given his Manchurian Candidates those phasers to use against the Enterprise crew he must have had very high confidence in the effectiveness of his Ceti Eels, otherwise Chekov and Terrell could have turned on him or his people prior to the Enterprise arriving.

But an even biggest mystery to me was in the addition of the second phaser Terrell has shoved upside down (which always seemed like a dangerous way to carry a phaser) under his belt. Whose phaser was this? I figured that maybe Chekov and him disarmed some of the Enterprise officers off screen and this was one of their phasers but whose and why only one? Kirk still has his since shortly afterwards we see him fry Chekov's eel with it. So that could only leave Saavik or McCoy. Since that second phaser is vaporized with Terrell I've tried seeing if I could spot one of the two Enterprise members missing a phaser during the rest of their time in the Genesis Cave, but given the way the phasers are carried in the survival jacket pocket (upside down again!) it's difficult to make out.

Over the years I've occasionally tried to see if anyone else noticed these things, but either I've been googling the wrong search terms or it went over most viewers' heads. Given that this is the place to drill down into the minutia of all things Trek, I decided if anyone could shed some light on this it's here .

 

[XCV330]

kidney-carry or tailbone, back of the trousers and under the jacket, maybe.

 

[Timo]

IIRC, as part of the fight with David, Kirk disarms one of the unnamed Regula workers, sending his phaser clattering on the floor; this weapon, picked up from the floor, is one of those found on Terrell and Chekov, namely the one tucked in Terrell's belt. It's just that the final edit omits this disarming (it was part of the version where David wins the wrestling match).

The two guns actually wielded by the pod people must have come from somewhere else, though. It would make sense for Kirk to arm the two, when even McCoy gets a gun...

Timo Saloniemi

 

[Kor]

Yes, we can really get into nitty-gritty details on continuity issues in this scene. I'm basically repeating stuff that was already said, but I'm including some visual aids here to make things more clear.

So Kirk has his phaser drawn, and he apparently drops it in the scuffle with David. Maybe it got kicked across the floor to where Terrell and Chekov were standing. And right at the beginning of that scuffle, the Regula scientist with the dark hair pops out with his phaser drawn, near Terrell, Chekov, Saavik and McCoy. We never see this dude lose that phaser. He does not get into any scuffle with the Starfleet people he is standing near. And presumably, he isn't clumsy enough to just drop it for no reason. Yet shortly after that, In the split second when we see him get vaporized, if you watch frame by frame he does not appear to be holding a phaser in his hand anymore. So when exactly did he lose it?

And in the camera shot where we first see both Terrell and Chekov pointing their phasers, guess what... all of a sudden and completely out of the blue, Terrell has yet another phaser attached to the left side of his belt!

Go to 7:21 in the clip:

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And an HD screencap with Terrell holding a phaser in his right hand while he has that other phaser on his belt: https://movies.trekcore.com/gallery/albums/twok-dc-hd/chapter14/st2-twok-dc-1909.jpg

Besides this, he also has the huge wrist communicator on his left wrist, which he was not wearing until this shot. That's a big piece of equipment that would have been impossible to hide in his sleeve before that. In all the previous shots that show Terrell's left wrist, there is no unsightly bulge in his sleeve or anything. But I digress... this discussion is about the phasers.

So, even if Terrell and Chekov are holding phasers that were dropped by Kirk and the unnamed Regula scientist, where exactly did that mysterious third phaser come from, for Terrell to suddenly have strapped to his belt? Where???

Kor

 

[FormerLurker]

Kirk is shown picking a phaser up off the floor, probably Chekov's, to vaporize the Ceti Eel.

 

[Grant]

As is heard in the audio portion of the deleted original cut of the fight scene, after Carol announces to everybody assembled that Kirk and David are father and son, Terrell takes advantage of the situation by snatching the phaser from "Jedda's" hand.

http://www.marcellorossi.info/14-KirkFightsDavidOriginalVersionPartTwo.mp3

If you listen carefully you can hear Terrell say "I'll hold on to that." when he takes the phaser from David's friend

 

[Brobdingnag]

....

So, even if Terrell and Chekov are holding phasers that were dropped by Kirk and the unnamed Regula scientist, where exactly did that mysterious third phaser come from, for Terrell to suddenly have strapped to his belt? Where???

Kor

I think it was the second shooter on the grassy knoll...

... sorry, I was thinking of something else...

 

[Vger23]

When Jedda pops out and surprises the landing party, he yells “Phasers down” and all the armed officers drop them. Terrell and Chekov pick them all up when Kirk and David’s fight is broken up by Carol.

 

[Grant]

So there were four phasers at the scene of the scuffle between David and Kirk. One each from Kirk, Saavik and McCoy and the one originally wielded by Jedda.
So the question actually is not where did the third phaser come from but actually where did the fourth phaser go to? LOL

 

[Maurice]

As is heard in the audio portion of the deleted original cut of the fight scene, after Carol announces to everybody assembled that Kirk and David are father and son, Terrell takes advantage of the situation by snatching the phaser from "Jedda's" hand.

http://www.marcellorossi.info/14-KirkFightsDavidOriginalVersionPartTwo.mp3

If you listen carefully you can hear Terrell say "I'll hold on to that." when he takes the phaser from David's friend

Yeah, that's in the script. He takes Jedda's phaser.

 

[Timo]

So there were four phasers at the scene of the scuffle between David and Kirk. One each from Kirk, Saavik and McCoy and the one originally wielded by Jedda. So the question actually is not where did the third phaser come from but actually where did the fourth phaser go to? LOL

Yeah, in the final edit, "Phasers down!" plus the subsequent clatter would appear to explain pretty much everything in-universe.

Terrell and Chekov can't get to the phaser dropped by Kirk, because it's too far away from them, being kicked around by the father and the son. But if they pick up the phasers putatively dropped by Saavik and McCoy (not seen but perhaps heard, sort of), and then use the fight as a cover to disarm Jedda (again not seen and not in the final audio), they indeed have three between them. Weird how it works out...

As for the wristcomms, I don't have a big problem with them hiding those up their sleeves. I guess I could nitpick the scientists having TMP-issue military sidearms rather than some older prop (or its commercial replica), as the latter is more customary with most "civilian guns" in Trek, but that's just about it.

Timo Saloniemi

 

[FormerLurker]

At the point TWOK takes place, the military sidearms are old enough that civilian models are probably commercially available. Whether the Federation allows them or not is not at issue here.

 

[Timo]

I actually disagree on both points, slightly.

- This particular Phaser II appeared brand new to TMP, the previous film. It hasn't been all that long after that adventure (perhaps five years if TMP is "over 300 years" after the Voyager probe launches and TWoK is a year or two after 2283, the date on the bottle, but still roughly 15 years after TOS). Elsewhere in Trek, civilian guns aren't the same model as the Starfleet hero ones, but either a preceding design, or then a competing one.
- This particular installation is working under de facto Starfleet supervision. If they did illegal stuff, they'd fry.

There's no fault to civilians having guns per se: nobody in any Trek adventure was told to cease and desist such a practice. And Starfleet hardware in civilian hands isn't objectionable as such, either - never was, not in "Man Trap" even. It's only the particular model that raises my eyebrows and makes my ears want to go all pointy here.

Timo Saloniemi

 

[UssGlenn]

- This particular installation is working under de facto Starfleet supervision. If they did illegal stuff, they'd fry.

Then the solution is that Starfleet issued them those phasers while outfitting the research base. Starfleet wouldn't issue them outdated equipment.

 

[Timo]

That works perfectly, of course. It's merely slightly out of alignment with precedent: Starfleet kept the Craters supplied in "Man Trap", and Crater had a gun, and it was Starfleet - yet it wasn't modern issue but more like a decade out of date. But that may have been a fateful decade, there being a transition there while there was none between the first two movies.

(There's also a tiny bit of visual jarring in that Regula is outfitted by Modern Props rather than by Starfleet Interior Decoration Dept. But the Enterprise gets its share of Modern Props this time around, too, so it's not as if the two locations should be totally distinct visually or anything. And I'm not sure I would have wanted Jedda to point a generic raygun at the heroes, or even a commercial replica of the TOS gun; the TWoK team sure wouldn't have coughed up the dough for creating a dedicated civilian gun.)

Timo Saloniemi

 

[Ryan Thomas Riddle]

As is heard in the audio portion of the deleted original cut of the fight scene, after Carol announces to everybody assembled that Kirk and David are father and son, Terrell takes advantage of the situation by snatching the phaser from "Jedda's" hand.

http://www.marcellorossi.info/14-KirkFightsDavidOriginalVersionPartTwo.mp3

If you listen carefully you can hear Terrell say "I'll hold on to that." when he takes the phaser from David's friend

Ah the continuity of the phasers is a victim of reshoots.

 

[There Be Whales Here]

So there were four phasers at the scene of the scuffle between David and Kirk. One each from Kirk, Saavik and McCoy and the one originally wielded by Jedda.
So the question actually is not where did the third phaser come from but actually where did the fourth phaser go to? LOL

Assuming Kirk continued to carry the phaser he fried Chekov's eel with (which was either his original one off the floor or the one Chekov dropped), then that fourth phaser (either his or Chekov's) was either left behind or given to McCoy or more likely, Saavik. Of course as I stated before, it's impossible for me to confirm or deny the latter, since despite my best freeze-frame effort, I've not been able to tell if any of the Enterprise crew are still carrying a phaser in their survival jackets between the time Kirk zaps the earwig and they return to the Enterprise. Perhaps this mystery can be solved by someone with a larger screen and a better eye for detail, though the camera angles and the way the phasers are carried doesn't make it easy.

However should it show that all three Enterprise officers have their weapons back, then it will add even more questions since it means there must have been a fifth phaser! If that is the case then the only explanation would be that Chekov and Terrell actually did have their own hidden somewhere on them and thus there were actually six phasers in the scene! Of course that would also leave the new wrinkle of where did that sixth phaser (that was again either Kirk's or Chekov's dropped one) go? The only explanation can be that it was left behind on the floor.

What a can of (ear) worms I opened .

 

[There Be Whales Here]

As far as the question of the type of phasers the Regula scientists had access to I don't think it's too unusual they would have some of the same ones the Enterprise crew did, if one was to imagine that the Regula stations, being Federation property, had perhaps a small contingent of Starfleet personnel to run the station operations and provide security. Thus there would be a small supply of military weapons onboard. As far as the question of why there were none of these personnel present at the time, recall David's lines about the majority of the Regula residents being on leave which might have included any assigned security who those phasers would be onboard for but the rest of the staff might still have access to.

Also while regardless of how much time passed between TMP and TWOK, it's clear that by the time of the third film, which could only be a few days to week or so after the last, those particular phasers had already been rendered obsolete since the Enterprise crew are now carrying the newer TSFS/TVH versions; having either mysteriously acquired them somehow between the second and third films or had them in stores all along but for some reason carried the previous version in TWOK. So one could conclude at the time of TWOK, the previous design was either already in civilian use or in the process of being phased in.

Personally I see no problem with civilian personnel having some limited access to military hardware not only because of the possibility of them having to defend a top secret installation that contains a weapon of mass destruction, but there never was any suggestion in any Trek movie or series that there is a type of 23rd or 24th century gun control. True, the majority of civilian Federation members would not need modern weapons, let alone have access to them or carry them; but I still wouldn't suggest it's impossible even by Trek's utopian standards. While the average citizen like McCoy's bar waitress or the guy cleaning the floors with the 23rd century buffer would go through life never having touched a phaser; but again those working on a vulnerable, remote outpost or planet developing something that could be used as a weapon and where military support could be hours or days away, I don't think having the latest (or close to the latest) weapons would be unheard of.

 

[XCV330]

It's a science lab capable of turning a cave in a moon into paradise and making a torpedo that can rearrange matter and energy into whatever you want on a planetary scale. I don't think printing up a few phasers for random security incidents is far fetched. As they aid "we're all alone here." and it clearly takes a long time for anyone to get to them when they had to send an old training ship full of recruits to answer their emergency.

In fact, really how do you control weaponry in a future where everything can be reproduced easily? Make it illegal to have the blueprints and plans? Might appeal to some but not all humans, and seems out of character for many Fed members.

 

[Timo]

"Being phased out" may sound appealing for phasers, but the TMP/TWoK ones apparently didn't bow out due to age - they are still in use in the 2340s of "Yesterday's Enterprise"! Perhaps they simply were too damn modern in the late 2270s and early 2280s, and were shelved for a while to sort out the teething troubles, at which time guns far more visually related to the TOS ones were "brought back".

Although that's not really satisfactory, because the "old-fashioned" ST3/4 phasers appear literally in mid-flight, before the Enterprise has had time to return from her ST2 adventure. So my preferred rationalization there is that the sleek sidearms of TMP and ST2 are the functional equivalent of .22s, carried by officers and civilians alike, and more useful for policing and ceremony than for military field work. A ship launched directly from the box dock of a major refit well ahead of schedule might have even the security contingent be forced to use those when there was no time to load mission gear; the same ship later on would have her armories stacked with proper guns, with just the officers donning their sleeker sidearms.

The next round of phasers introduced in ST5 would then again be a parallel rather than competing design, a submachine gun for bringing down whole armies of unruly natives or enraged Klingons, and possibly coming with a stock and barrel extension and scope as (ultimately not!) seen in ST6...

As for weapons proliferation, our heroes never have a problem with that: anybody can pack heat, as long as they point the business ends in some other direction. But the "withholding of blueprints" method is seen in action in DS9, it being pretty damn challenging to produce the replication pattern for the experimental slugthrower used by the crazy gunman of "Field of Fire". And apparently the Maquis, shown possessing food replicators in "Preemptive Strike", still can't replicate photon torpedo warheads and thus could be behind the theft of said in "Tribunal", and later steal better replicators for real in "For the Cause". So while getting hand phasers may be trivial (and those are stun guns for the most part, and perhaps civilian models get locked on that mode?), limitations still exist on heavier weaponry.

Timo Saloniemi